Refreshing a Camry for an entitled old man

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Aug 5, 2002
Messages
23,088
Location
Silicon Valley
You guys probably remembered my post to trouble shoot the warm start problem of my father in law's 97 Camry V6. Recently it went so bad that our daughter was stuck in school or his car is stuck in our driveway after the inlaws dropping her off at our home, about once a week or more. During the Thanksgiving weekend my wife and I suggested to him that we will buy them a "slightly used" car instead. The goal was to provide them with a replacement that will be under warranty for a long time while affordable for their daily routine (about 3 miles per weekday).

The car would have been a Hertz retired 2016 Hyundai Elantra with 82k miles. It would be $8100 and be under warranty for about 8 years with their usage. By then it would be a 10 year old car with around 100k miles, my oldest daughter would be 16 and youngest would be 13, and inlaws be 86 / 88 years old. It sounded just about right to me and my wife.

The idea was rejected for the following reason:

1) They are currently driving a then "top of the line" Camry V6 XLE, and "Nobody downgrade when replacing cars"
2) Mother in law thinks Elantra is too small inside, and the window glass is too small to look outward.
3) Mother in law cannot live with black interior, she needs at least grey but prefer beige, that rules out Hertz.
4) Father in law likes to stay with at least a Toyota Camry, prefer at least a SoftTex seat, and a V6 for smoothness and torque. Based on this he sort of ruled out LE, and he pretty much wants at least an SE if not XLE or XSE.
5) Because we are trying to replace an aging car for reliability over 10 years, it makes no sense to look for something that has little warranty year left (remember they do not drive much, so warranty will expire in years first).
6) Father in law will pay for another 7k to move the budget to 15k from 8k, but it is still not enough to get what "he wants" and what "mother in law wants" ($14.3k if retired SE from Hertz, $19k if SE from other dealers with beige interior, $27k V6 XSE/XLE with extended warranty).


As a result, I would not be helping them with a replacement vehicle. Congratulation Mr. entitled baby boomer, no soup for you. What I am planning to do now, is to "throw parts at the old Camry" to replace anything that can cause reliability issues 10 years down the road in a warm climate with no rust concern. Basically, I want anything that won't last 30 years and 200k miles on that Camry replaced as preventive maintenance.

I'm coming up with a list right now, can you think of anything that I've missed? Which one should I buy reman which one should I buy new?

1. Alternator (reman?)
2. Starter (reman?)
3. Radiator (new any brand)
4. Radiator Hose (new)
5. Timing belt, accessory belts (new, reputable brand)
6. Water pump (new Denso or Aisin)
7. Radiator cap (new OEM)
8. IACV (which brand?)
9. Coil over plug (which brand?)
10. Plugs (Densor or NGK)
11. Thermostat (OEM)
12. Injector (which brand?)
13. Fuel pump (Denso?) and strainer
14. Fuel filter (any brand)
15. Fuel pressure regulator (which brand?)
16. Air filter (any brand)
17. EGR (clean or replace, new or reman?)
18. Exhaust manifold gasket (Fel-Pro)
19. Valve cover gasket (Fel-Pro)
20. Oil pan gasket (Fel-Pro)
21. Timing belt idler pulley (Timken if available, buy with timing belt kit)
22. O2 sensors (Denso or NTK)
23. CV axles / shafts if boot cracked (technically I can ignore it if it is only city driving, OEM)
24. Any other sensors like ECT/CTS, MAP/MAF, Knock, crank angle / position?
25. Anything on the power steering?
26. Anything I've missed?

Things already done long time ago:
1. Struts (KYB GR2)
2. ATF change
3. battery
 
As-far-as the timing belt JOB is concerned, get the Aisin or Mitsuboshi KIT which includes everything(timing belt & tensioner and associated drive belts, water pump, cam/crank seals, etc.). Both kits are the same just in different boxes because both kits contain parts from both manufactures which are original equipment mfg(OEM).

Definitely do maintenance on the car however, I wouldn't suggest just throwing parts at the car until those said part started giving some issues. Many of those items listed could in fact last a lifetime on a Camry. We've had several Camry's in the family over the years and many of those parts lasted into the 300,000 range without replacement.

The items that you listed, isn't "Refreshing" the Camry as your title states, it's "Rebuilding" it. Do it wisely.
 
Last edited:
What happened to the old days when one could get the point across in a sentence or two.
 
try to convince him to just take the Hyundai for a test Drive, (or a comparable new one at your local dealer)
he might just be surprised how the 4 banger feels.

he'll be surprised just how far even base model cars have come in the last 20 years.

not to mention anything recent will be inherently safer than a 20 yr old car...
(except of course for the whole airbag fiasco...can't recall the companies name, but y'all know who i mean...)
 
Buy your daughters the 2016 and just let the in laws deal with the older Toyota. Sometimes, the best you can give still isn't enough with these kinds of people.

Wish we were neighbors though. The old Camry sounds like a fun little project. Obviously, it doesn't "need" done in 1 weekend so that makes it a bit more relaxing.
 
Originally Posted By: Lubener
What happened to the old days when one could get the point across in a sentence or two.


Before posting, we really need to think about whether or not what we have to say contributes to the situation.
 
What happened to the days that people had an attention span greater than that of a gnat. That's far more noticeable in today's time frame.
 
I would figure out what is wrong with the car and fix it.

I’d use Toyota or the OE equivalent parts.

I WOULD NOT replace perfectly good original parts with rebuilt junk. Maintenance stuff sure do it, but replacing radiators, starters and alternators especially with aftermarket/rebuilt is likely to put you in worse shape than you are now.

As for the entitled old man. People want what they want and the visibility issue may be real. You may be able to put a leather or softex kit in something to meet that requirement.
 
So, you want him to spend several thousand dollars to replace a car that he likes, instead of getting the hot start problem fixed?

The other alternative is to just throw parts at it, spending money and hoping?

And his daily routine includes driving your kid back and forth to school for you?

But he's entitled???
 
Last edited:
A bad startercan cause a hot starting issue. Also, does this car have a distributor? Ign. modules can cause it to fail hot. There is something basic and simple wrong with it. Crank position sensor?
 
It's his car, it's his business.

I know you're trying to be helpful, but one lesson I've learned in life is not to push "help" on someone. If they ask, fine.

If I was pushing 80 and still of clear mind, I'd want to make my own decisions.

That's a heck of a list you got there.

Good Luck.
 
The 97 Camry and the 16 Elantra apparently have the same overall passenger volume while the Elantra has a slightly bigger trunk. The Elantra does appear to have slightly less rear legroom though. Externally, the Elantra is about 9 inches shorter.

Maybe you could propose a Nissan Leaf as an upgrade instead?
 
Originally Posted By: DuckRyder
I would figure out what is wrong with the car and fix it.

I’d use Toyota or the OE equivalent parts.

I WOULD NOT replace perfectly good original parts with rebuilt junk. Maintenance stuff sure do it, but replacing radiators, starters and alternators especially with aftermarket/rebuilt is likely to put you in worse shape than you are now.

As for the entitled old man. People want what they want and the visibility issue may be real. You may be able to put a leather or softex kit in something to meet that requirement.


+1
thumbsup2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Buy your daughters the 2016 and just let the in laws deal with the older Toyota.


It sure sounds like they're in elementary school
 
How about run it hot and take it to a mechanic tyat has the proper diagnostic tools. Might be a simple change that costs a couple hundred vs a couple thousand.
 
Last edited:
It's certainly your business... but fix the hot start issue, maybe do a couple other things the car "could use" if you want to - but don't go after that list "preventatively". It's true, sometimes replacing good parts causes problems before their time. If your in-laws are too hung up on "go big or go home" and think their aging Toyota is the best thing since sliced bread, let them keep it and be responsible for that decision. I'm not saying don't fix it when something goes wrong in the future - just let things play out and leave the responsibility of the problems the car's breakdowns cause with the rightful party. Take the thousands you'd spend on parts and save it for your kids, or take them on a trip they'll never forget.
 
Last edited:
Your inlays are happy with what the old 97 Camry XLE v6 offers and may not want the change of a new vehicle.

An Elantra is a serious downgrade from loaded Lexus cousin they have. Not entitlement as much as excuses to not get pushed into a car they don't want the life change/familiarity with.
 
I would definitely not replace 95% of those parts you mentioned. Oem Toyota parts from that era are very good quality. No problem for that car to get 300k miles. I would take it to a reputable mechanic and get the hot start fixed, replace timing belt and water pump, replace trans fluid, and give it a basic inspection for any potential issues. Other than that you are just asking for trouble or a huge expense replacing sensors and injectors and ignition components when it's not needed.
 
Originally Posted By: danez_yoda
How about run it hot and take it to a mechanic tyat has the proper diagnostic tools. Might be a simple change that costs a couple hundred vs a couple thousand.



But gee that's taking all the fun outta it. For what ever reason some people just can't or won't make a decision. When the pain gets to a certain point they will get off the dime. Let them suffer a bit more and don't be overly helpful. The voice of experience.
 
82,000 miles in rental car service? Warranty or not, that car is going to be about used up.

Yes what ever happened to finding the problem with the car and fixing it? Intermittent problems do take a lot of patience to find but the solution is not to shotgun parts at it or to buy another car.

You could buy the Hyundai anyway and tell them it is for them to use when they pick up your kids, because the Camry isn't reliable. What is the torque of a Toyota v6 that does not start?
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top