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#4580695 - 11/21/17 05:56 AM New generations of oils begin to take hold
wemay Offline


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8895
Loc: Southeast Florida
http://www.fleetowner.com/lubricants/new-generations-oils-begin-take-hold

Excerpts...

Thinner but just as durable
Several years of industry collaboration yielded two variations of the next generation of oil—CK-4 and FA-4.

“The oils are thinner but just as durable and are able to withstand a high-shear engine environment,” said Brian Humphrey, OEM technical liaison at Petro-Canada Lubricants. Higher fuel economy “can be achieved because lower viscosity oil means less friction in the engine, leading to a reduction in both fuel consumption and [carbon dioxide] emissions—while still offering exceptional levels of wear protection.”

Back Spec'ng
"API’s Ferrick said while Detroit Diesel recommended use of FA-4 in its latest engines from the start, other manufacturers are taking a more cautious approach, and are “looking to get a little more assurance FA-4 is suitable.”

Some of the hesitation involves the limited backwards compatibility of FA-4, because some older engines are not designed for low viscosity oils.

The latest engines have slightly more finely polished surfaces on critical parts, according to Valvoline. These surfaces can tolerate the slightly thinner film of oil produced by FA-4 because of its lower viscosity.

“Unless a fleet has all [Detroit Diesel] series engines, they really are kind of handcuffed,” said Paul Cigala, applications engineer for commercial vehicles at ExxonMobil"


Mixing FA-4 with CK-4
“Take great care not to mix FA-4 with CK-4. Co-mingling will adversely impact the viscosity grade of the FA-4 oil, and that is part of the reason they are getting FA-4 oil in the first place,” he said.
_________________________
2017 Hyundai Sonata Sport 2.4L
2013 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport 2.0T
Valvoline

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#4580748 - 11/21/17 07:13 AM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
Donald Offline


Registered: 03/21/04
Posts: 20465
Loc: Upstate NY
And then there is Ford Powerstroke and CK-4 oil concerns.
_________________________
2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)


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#4580836 - 11/21/17 09:08 AM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
PiperOne Offline


Registered: 10/25/17
Posts: 184
Loc: A Highway Near You
I'm holding off using any FA-4 oils even though I'm a fuel economy nut. I'm just switching over to CK-4 in a month or two...and despite Chevron lowering the Z/Phos so they can keep their SN rating...I'm going to try it and see how it looks. I was contemplating switching to Rotella as most of its formulations kept the Phos. Of the other fleet guys I know...no one is switching to FA-4 yet. A few run 10w30, a few run syns (me too) but no one is FA-4.

Interesting to note about the Powerstrokes...I see the Motorcraft oil now says right on the front of the jug "over 1000 ppm Phosphorus for excellent wear control".
_________________________
HDEO in Diesel Engines. No spark plugs here.

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#4580841 - 11/21/17 09:16 AM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
WyrTwister Offline


Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 1531
Loc: Texas
How is the shift to thinner lubricants related to closer machining clearances ?

Thanks , :-)
_________________________
Wyr
God bless

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#4580931 - 11/21/17 11:00 AM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
OneEyeJack Offline


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 7479
Loc: S California
Why take a chance back spec'ng oil? The speculation on mpg gains can't be worth the risk. If there was a slight improvement it might be lost to increased wear. The smart move is no move.

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#4581048 - 11/21/17 01:21 PM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
kmrcstintn Offline


Registered: 05/11/06
Posts: 564
Loc: Palmyra, PA
for folks that want to avoid newer formulated oils...grab supertech 15w-40 at walmart or traveller 15w-40 from tractor supply co. (warren performance products) or lubrigard 15w-40 at autozone (warren oil co); most of current stock is still cj-4; I grabbed 3 gallons of traveller a few months back @ $7.50/gallon & a gallon of lubrigard @ $11.99/gallon for use in the motorcycle & scooter
_________________________
'15 Jeep Patriot Sport (2.4L 4-cyl), '13 Genuine Buddy 125 (125cc air-cooled thumper), '14 Yamaha V Star 250 (250cc air cooled v-twin)

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#4581355 - 11/21/17 07:42 PM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: PiperOne]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 24600
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: PiperOne
I'm holding off using any FA-4 oils even though I'm a fuel economy nut.

I'm wondering if we'll see any 5w-30 FA-4 options. I know we see them in CJ-4 and CK-4, but I haven't seen them in FA-4 yet.
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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#4581914 - 11/22/17 01:16 PM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: Garak]
Solarent Offline


Registered: 10/24/11
Posts: 945
Loc: Toronto ON
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: PiperOne
I'm holding off using any FA-4 oils even though I'm a fuel economy nut.

I'm wondering if we'll see any 5w-30 FA-4 options. I know we see them in CJ-4 and CK-4, but I haven't seen them in FA-4 yet.


DA, Phillips 66, and ExxonMobil are registered according to the API.

The Delvac product is: Mobil Delvac 1 Advanced Fuel Economy
5W30 FA-4 on EOLCS

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#4582280 - 11/22/17 07:27 PM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: Solarent]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 24600
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Nice. I haven't seen any of those, even the Delvac 1 on my Imperial Oil sell sheet.
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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#4751570 - 05/08/18 08:51 PM Re: New generations of oils begin to take hold [Re: wemay]
benjy Offline


Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 870
Loc: pa
not for my $$$

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