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Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? #4567507
11/08/17 09:34 AM
11/08/17 09:34 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,760
Idaho
SubLGT Offline OP
SubLGT  Offline OP

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,760
Idaho
https://www.autosphere.ca/tirenews/tires-news/2017/11/02/hunter-road-force-elite-balancer/

Quote:
Mis-centering during wheel balancing is a major cause of improper balancing and customer comebacks.≠≠ Hunterís Road Force Elite features Automatic CenteringCheck technology with new 4.0 software that reduces these errors by notifying the technician of improper centering. The result is improved quality, increased shop efficiency and customer retention.

Road Force Elite 4.0 software also features a Balancer Report Card with a specified inner error and outer error amount and a letter grade to optimize weight placement. Presenting a ďscorecardĒ to the technician after a balance has been completed enhances balancer performance. Hunterís patented vision system completes a 3D scan of the wheel to determine the accuracy of wheel weight placement, which helps technicians learn on-the-job.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4567546
11/08/17 10:11 AM
11/08/17 10:11 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,177
SW Ontario Canada
KGMtech Offline
KGMtech  Offline

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,177
SW Ontario Canada
Unless it refuses to release the wheel assembly from the machine until proper balance is achieved, this will only be an improvement for those techs that want to improve.


2017.5 Nissan Rogue SV FWD
2013 Nissan Maxima SV
2009 Ford Flex SEL FWD
1984 Yamaha XJ750RL
Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4567561
11/08/17 10:27 AM
11/08/17 10:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,471
Lyndhurst NJ
Audios Offline
Audios  Offline

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,471
Lyndhurst NJ
Just another reason to make techs more lazy. If they can't see that the wheel has a hop or lateral runout when its balancing, they should only be changing oil. And its probably a $15k balancer.


2002 VW Golf TDI-Mobil 1 5/40 TDT
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Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4567565
11/08/17 10:30 AM
11/08/17 10:30 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 2,254
Parts Unknown
UG_Passat Offline
UG_Passat  Offline

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 2,254
Parts Unknown
Still won't fix the lazy tech issue, because the lazy tech will still ignore the software.

It only helps the tech that wants to do his job better.

The fix is the boss firing the lazy tech because the lazy tech is costing the business money.


2016 VW Tiguan|APR Stage 1|Neuspeed P-Flo|Osram CBI|Redline 5w30
Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Audios] #4567576
11/08/17 10:35 AM
11/08/17 10:35 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,369
Central Florida
Mr Nice Offline
Mr Nice  Offline

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,369
Central Florida
Originally Posted By: Audios
Just another reason to make techs more lazy. If they can't see that the wheel has a hop or lateral runout when its balancing, they should only be changing oil. And its probably a $15k balancer.


Same goes for the Hunter alignment rack. High end equipment don't mean [censored] if lazy technician doesn't use it correctly.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4567609
11/08/17 11:05 AM
11/08/17 11:05 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,019
Lexington, NC
tc1446 Offline
tc1446  Offline

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,019
Lexington, NC
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.


'14 Kia Soul, 2.0L (29K)
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Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: tc1446] #4567652
11/08/17 11:42 AM
11/08/17 11:42 AM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,727
Texas
FZ1 Offline
FZ1  Offline

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,727
Texas
Originally Posted By: tc1446
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.
This^^^^.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4567766
11/08/17 01:06 PM
11/08/17 01:06 PM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,155
KS
FordBroncoVWJeta Offline
FordBroncoVWJeta  Offline

Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,155
KS
I wish Walmart used Hunters. We had a Hunter standard in Highschool. I felt like it was doing a better job. Now the coats on the other hand, they seem to be using old technology.


2017 Volkswagen Jetta 1.4T - 2015 Honda CRV 2.4 - 2012 Volkswagen Jetta 2.0 - 2007 Chevy Trailblazer 4.2 - 2001 Pontiac Sunfire 2.2
Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4568323
11/08/17 10:03 PM
11/08/17 10:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 34,076
ME
eljefino Offline
eljefino  Offline

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 34,076
ME
You guys are missing two points:

This stuff is marketed at chain shop owners/ decision makers who are looking for another excuse to hire cheaper people. A slice of Americana. This goes on in many industries!

And if the machine's arbors are all dinged up in the common bore sizes and cause this machine to complain, this will create a demand for replacement arbors before they were otherwise "needed".

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4568405
11/08/17 11:14 PM
11/08/17 11:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 590
Under the hood
Carmudgeon Offline
Carmudgeon  Offline

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 590
Under the hood
Discount Tire is using the RF Elite in their stores, but only in basic mode unless you pay them an extra $20/ea to do a road force balance.

Outside of a specialty shop that caters to high-end sports cars and racers, I've yet to encounter any shop that regularly uses the fancy Hunter machines to their full capability. Most don't bother or maybe even know how.

Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Carmudgeon] #4568515
11/09/17 07:34 AM
11/09/17 07:34 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,542
Somewhere in the US
CapriRacer Offline
CapriRacer  Offline

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,542
Somewhere in the US
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.

All tires arriving at the assembly plant are marked by the tire manufacturer for the high point of the radial first harmonic (think out of round and you'll be close!) - and all wheels are marked for the low point of the radial first harmonic. A machine matches those marks up and the tire/wheel assembly is the most round those 2 components can be. Then they do a normal balance using an automated balance machine.

What a Hunter RoadForce machine does is find those places on tires and wheels not marked by the tire/wheel manufacturer, but the tech has to manually line up the marks.

Aside from loading the tires and wheels onto the assembly line, the techs (hourly workers) don't touch either until it is time to add the balance weights - and the locations are indicated for them. That means the mounting of the tire on the wheel is done by the machine as is the lining up of the marks and the balance spin.


CapriRacer

Visit my web site: www.BarrysTireTech.com
Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT] #4569071
11/09/17 05:30 PM
11/09/17 05:30 PM
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,182
iowa
Traction Offline
Traction  Offline

Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,182
iowa
Unfortunately the shop techs have to try and beat the clock. On the Hunter, the cycle time for a balance spin is like 5 seconds, and in road force/tracking mode it is like 30 seconds, and another 10 minutes+ if it tells you there is an issue. Coffee time. I know what I'd do in a shop, but working on my own, the clock beats the heck out of me on every tire job.

Last edited by Traction; 11/09/17 05:38 PM.

Certified Tire Service Instructor since 2009
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Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: tc1446] #4569325
11/09/17 10:55 PM
11/09/17 10:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,431
USA
stephen9666 Offline
stephen9666  Offline

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,431
USA
Originally Posted By: tc1446
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.


What youíre forgetting is that a Hunter RF machine can also be used just like a plain-old standard balancer if the tech doesnít want to take the time to use all the RF features.

Iím not saying thatís right or wrong. In the vast majority of cases you wonít need to use all the RF features because a simple balance will be fine.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: CapriRacer] #4569415
11/10/17 02:34 AM
11/10/17 02:34 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 590
Under the hood
Carmudgeon Offline
Carmudgeon  Offline

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 590
Under the hood
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.


That's insightful, but my intel comes from the engineering, not plant side, at least in a casual capacity.

Procedure may dictate they follow the full procedure while they're on the clock, but off hours they can be just as lax as the rest when doing "extracurricular" jobs.

These machines are great, but there's no getting around that they require a lot of time, especially if a tire needs to be reindexed to the wheel.

So it's not just the local tire jockey who might be too lazy, even the guys inside can find them a hassle as well.

Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Carmudgeon] #4569528
11/10/17 08:14 AM
11/10/17 08:14 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,542
Somewhere in the US
CapriRacer Offline
CapriRacer  Offline

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,542
Somewhere in the US
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.


That's insightful, but my intel comes from the engineering, not plant side, at least in a casual capacity.

Procedure may dictate they follow the full procedure while they're on the clock, but off hours they can be just as lax as the rest when doing "extracurricular" jobs.

These machines are great, but there's no getting around that they require a lot of time, especially if a tire needs to be reindexed to the wheel.

So it's not just the local tire jockey who might be too lazy, even the guys inside can find them a hassle as well.


Ah .... Mmmmm ......

I think you are talking about the assembly plant, and perhaps you missed the part where they have to load the tires and wheels separately into the machine (that is, unmounted) - and then they don't touch them until it is time to put on the weights. There isn't any way to shortcut the process. If the tires and wheels aren't loaded into the machine, nothing is produced and the assembly line stops - and not just the tire/wheel assembly line. The whole assembly line, because vehicles can't be processed off the line without tires and wheels mounted on the vehicle hubs.

Oh, and the machines automatically index the tire to the wheel - no human intervention required.

But on the off chance that you are talking about at the vehicle dealership level: Typically, the shop guys are dealing with returns for vibration - and if they don't follow the procedure, they won't solve the vibration problem. It doesn't take very many returns before a tech who doesn't solve vibration problems gets in hot water for not doing his job.

Last edited by CapriRacer; 11/10/17 08:23 AM.

CapriRacer

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