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#4567507 - 11/08/17 08:34 AM Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs?
SubLGT Offline


Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 2646
Loc: Idaho
https://www.autosphere.ca/tirenews/tires-news/2017/11/02/hunter-road-force-elite-balancer/

Quote:
Mis-centering during wheel balancing is a major cause of improper balancing and customer comebacks.≠≠ Hunterís Road Force Elite features Automatic CenteringCheck technology with new 4.0 software that reduces these errors by notifying the technician of improper centering. The result is improved quality, increased shop efficiency and customer retention.

Road Force Elite 4.0 software also features a Balancer Report Card with a specified inner error and outer error amount and a letter grade to optimize weight placement. Presenting a ďscorecardĒ to the technician after a balance has been completed enhances balancer performance. Hunterís patented vision system completes a 3D scan of the wheel to determine the accuracy of wheel weight placement, which helps technicians learn on-the-job.

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#4567546 - 11/08/17 09:11 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
KGMtech Offline


Registered: 10/17/14
Posts: 964
Loc: SW Ontario Canada
Unless it refuses to release the wheel assembly from the machine until proper balance is achieved, this will only be an improvement for those techs that want to improve.
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#4567561 - 11/08/17 09:27 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
Audios Offline


Registered: 11/19/11
Posts: 879
Loc: Lyndhurst NJ
Just another reason to make techs more lazy. If they can't see that the wheel has a hop or lateral runout when its balancing, they should only be changing oil. And its probably a $15k balancer.
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#4567565 - 11/08/17 09:30 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
UG_Passat Offline


Registered: 05/27/08
Posts: 1959
Loc: NJ
Still won't fix the lazy tech issue, because the lazy tech will still ignore the software.

It only helps the tech that wants to do his job better.

The fix is the boss firing the lazy tech because the lazy tech is costing the business money.
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#4567576 - 11/08/17 09:35 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Audios]
Mr Nice Offline


Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 21175
Loc: Orlando, FL
Originally Posted By: Audios
Just another reason to make techs more lazy. If they can't see that the wheel has a hop or lateral runout when its balancing, they should only be changing oil. And its probably a $15k balancer.


Same goes for the Hunter alignment rack. High end equipment don't mean [censored] if lazy technician doesn't use it correctly.

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#4567609 - 11/08/17 10:05 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
tc1446 Offline


Registered: 12/10/10
Posts: 944
Loc: Lexington, NC
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.
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#4567652 - 11/08/17 10:42 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: tc1446]
FZ1 Offline


Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4727
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: tc1446
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.
This^^^^.

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#4567766 - 11/08/17 12:06 PM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
FordBroncoVWJeta Offline


Registered: 04/16/16
Posts: 765
Loc: KS
I wish Walmart used Hunters. We had a Hunter standard in Highschool. I felt like it was doing a better job. Now the coats on the other hand, they seem to be using old technology.
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#4568323 - 11/08/17 09:03 PM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
eljefino Offline


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 32629
Loc: ME
You guys are missing two points:

This stuff is marketed at chain shop owners/ decision makers who are looking for another excuse to hire cheaper people. A slice of Americana. This goes on in many industries!

And if the machine's arbors are all dinged up in the common bore sizes and cause this machine to complain, this will create a demand for replacement arbors before they were otherwise "needed".

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#4568405 - 11/08/17 10:14 PM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
Carmudgeon Offline


Registered: 04/26/05
Posts: 533
Loc: Under the hood
Discount Tire is using the RF Elite in their stores, but only in basic mode unless you pay them an extra $20/ea to do a road force balance.

Outside of a specialty shop that caters to high-end sports cars and racers, I've yet to encounter any shop that regularly uses the fancy Hunter machines to their full capability. Most don't bother or maybe even know how.

Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.

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#4568515 - 11/09/17 06:34 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Carmudgeon]
CapriRacer Offline


Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 3368
Loc: Somewhere in the US
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.

All tires arriving at the assembly plant are marked by the tire manufacturer for the high point of the radial first harmonic (think out of round and you'll be close!) - and all wheels are marked for the low point of the radial first harmonic. A machine matches those marks up and the tire/wheel assembly is the most round those 2 components can be. Then they do a normal balance using an automated balance machine.

What a Hunter RoadForce machine does is find those places on tires and wheels not marked by the tire/wheel manufacturer, but the tech has to manually line up the marks.

Aside from loading the tires and wheels onto the assembly line, the techs (hourly workers) don't touch either until it is time to add the balance weights - and the locations are indicated for them. That means the mounting of the tire on the wheel is done by the machine as is the lining up of the marks and the balance spin.
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#4569071 - 11/09/17 04:30 PM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: SubLGT]
Traction Offline


Registered: 06/04/13
Posts: 977
Loc: iowa
Unfortunately the shop techs have to try and beat the clock. On the Hunter, the cycle time for a balance spin is like 5 seconds, and in road force/tracking mode it is like 30 seconds, and another 10 minutes+ if it tells you there is an issue. Coffee time. I know what I'd do in a shop, but working on my own, the clock beats the heck out of me on every tire job.


Edited by Traction (11/09/17 04:38 PM)
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#4569325 - 11/09/17 09:55 PM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: tc1446]
stephen9666 Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 3431
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: tc1446
I'll still take my chances by having it done on the Hunter Road Force rather than standard.


What youíre forgetting is that a Hunter RF machine can also be used just like a plain-old standard balancer if the tech doesnít want to take the time to use all the RF features.

Iím not saying thatís right or wrong. In the vast majority of cases you wonít need to use all the RF features because a simple balance will be fine.

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#4569415 - 11/10/17 01:34 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: CapriRacer]
Carmudgeon Offline


Registered: 04/26/05
Posts: 533
Loc: Under the hood
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.


That's insightful, but my intel comes from the engineering, not plant side, at least in a casual capacity.

Procedure may dictate they follow the full procedure while they're on the clock, but off hours they can be just as lax as the rest when doing "extracurricular" jobs.

These machines are great, but there's no getting around that they require a lot of time, especially if a tire needs to be reindexed to the wheel.

So it's not just the local tire jockey who might be too lazy, even the guys inside can find them a hassle as well.

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#4569528 - 11/10/17 07:14 AM Re: Hunter Balancer for Careless Tire Techs? [Re: Carmudgeon]
CapriRacer Offline


Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 3368
Loc: Somewhere in the US
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: Carmudgeon
...... Not even techs inside OEMs necessarily go to such lengths from what I've heard.


If you mean at the dealership level, I sort of agree - although those guys generally are forced to learn more of the sophisticated stuff simply because of where they are.

But if you mean at the assembly plant level - those guys don't do anything at all. It's all done by the set up or the machines. I'll explain.


That's insightful, but my intel comes from the engineering, not plant side, at least in a casual capacity.

Procedure may dictate they follow the full procedure while they're on the clock, but off hours they can be just as lax as the rest when doing "extracurricular" jobs.

These machines are great, but there's no getting around that they require a lot of time, especially if a tire needs to be reindexed to the wheel.

So it's not just the local tire jockey who might be too lazy, even the guys inside can find them a hassle as well.


Ah .... Mmmmm ......

I think you are talking about the assembly plant, and perhaps you missed the part where they have to load the tires and wheels separately into the machine (that is, unmounted) - and then they don't touch them until it is time to put on the weights. There isn't any way to shortcut the process. If the tires and wheels aren't loaded into the machine, nothing is produced and the assembly line stops - and not just the tire/wheel assembly line. The whole assembly line, because vehicles can't be processed off the line without tires and wheels mounted on the vehicle hubs.

Oh, and the machines automatically index the tire to the wheel - no human intervention required.

But on the off chance that you are talking about at the vehicle dealership level: Typically, the shop guys are dealing with returns for vibration - and if they don't follow the procedure, they won't solve the vibration problem. It doesn't take very many returns before a tech who doesn't solve vibration problems gets in hot water for not doing his job.


Edited by CapriRacer (11/10/17 07:23 AM)
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