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#4560682 - 10/31/17 09:24 PM M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F
Fallguy Offline


Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 242
Loc: Iowa (No, But I do Like It)
If you look at foreign MSDS listings they have to apparently show things by percentages. Shows M1 0W-20 Extended Protection to be 60-70% PAO If you Look at the Canada MSDS on Mobil 1 0W-20

Go to Mobil 1 MSDS website Link below. Plug in Canada.

This is probably old news to some but if this is accurate I find this phenomenal. Wish me luck on running the M1EP 0W-20 its MRV is my big attraction for the winter & the PAO.

Now I know how they flow down to -54 Celsius / -65 Fahrenheit

Believe all of their 0W oils use much PAO. Look for " Decene " on the MSDS List

5W+ are mostly group III I believe.


http://www.msds.exxonmobil.com/IntApps/psims/psims.aspx
_________________________
"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Best Oil Tool, Click
https://online.lubrizol.com/relperftool/pc.html

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#4560687 - 10/31/17 09:34 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
4WD Offline


Registered: 09/21/10
Posts: 6369
Loc: Texas
Just put that oil in new 5.3L very quiet compared to my other 5.3L too soon to tell how long the OLM will let me run it but easy to monitor using those naughty steering wheel buttons

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#4560722 - 10/31/17 10:24 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
FermeLaPorte Offline


Registered: 07/25/17
Posts: 469
Loc: Texas (south)
I'm currently using M1 0w-40 on my Nissan Versa with the fiver. Been noticing increased reaction times and it's more quiet.


Edited by FermeLaPorte (10/31/17 10:25 PM)
_________________________
Always Mobil 1
2014 1.6L Nissan Versa Sedan, 5 spd, 5k OCI.
2011 3.5L Chevrolet Impala, Automatic, 5k OCI.

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#4560741 - 10/31/17 11:13 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
Artem Offline


Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 5117
Loc: Florida
Wow, crazy flow temp. Perfect for winter, even down here in Florida. Hahahaha. Cold starts SUCK.
_________________________
2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart.

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#4560750 - 10/31/17 11:26 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
blupupher Offline


Registered: 08/27/04
Posts: 4421
Loc: Katy, Republic of Texas
Interesting.
I have 5 qts sitting on the shelf in the garage that I got for $2/qt at the Auto Zone clearance last year.

No need for the 0w portion of the oil here in south Texas, but looks to be good stuff (and I know a lot of UOA's show it to be).
_________________________
1994 Honda VT1100C: Peak 15w-40/TG/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI


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#4561139 - 11/01/17 11:35 AM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
Crispysea Offline


Registered: 04/14/17
Posts: 402
Loc: TN USA
Does that mean M1 AP is 100%? That would explain the price.

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#4561142 - 11/01/17 11:40 AM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
spj Offline


Registered: 10/14/17
Posts: 62
Loc: north east
No, the MSDS lists the same ammounts for AP as is does EP. What I am unsure about is if mPAO is listed at all.

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#4561154 - 11/01/17 11:52 AM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: spj]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 9395
Loc: Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: spj
No, the MSDS lists the same ammounts for AP as is does EP. What I am unsure about is if mPAO is listed at all.

Well the MSDS will list a range and not a specific percentage. MSDS are not intended for reverse engineering an oil.

I also doubt that in the context of an MSDS the different PAO varieties would have meaningful safety and firefighting differences which would warrant a separate category. As someone who used to write MSDS for a living I would never trust any of the percentages given in an MSDS, but maybe that's just me.
_________________________
1994 BMW 530i, 227K
1996 Honda Accord, 262K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 394K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 267K

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#4561235 - 11/01/17 01:00 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
Fallguy Offline


Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 242
Loc: Iowa (No, But I do Like It)
1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER HYDROGENATED 60 - < 70% = PAO basestock


Thought many of the other 0W's of Mobil 1 would/could have it but looking like the 0W-20 M1 Extended Performance is the only one with this high supposed concentration (60-70%).

At least I now know that Decene in a MSDS would be PAO. If we can trust the percentages is a completely different question I suppose.

Not sure why they dont use the 60-70% PAO in many of there other oils in the "Extended Performance Line". Guess with the Extended Performance 0W-20 they charge enough extra to fund the PAO and have a stellar 0W in the lineup. All others and they have to compete with group III price point competition.

Link:
http://www.msds.exxonmobil.com/IntApps/psims/psims.aspx
_________________________
"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Best Oil Tool, Click
https://online.lubrizol.com/relperftool/pc.html

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#4561289 - 11/01/17 02:19 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
spj Offline


Registered: 10/14/17
Posts: 62
Loc: north east
Not looking to reverse engineer anything, but why list any percentage at all then?
They list a +/-10 percent range for a reason.

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#4561300 - 11/01/17 02:36 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
turboseize Offline


Registered: 09/26/14
Posts: 236
Loc: Germany
If you want a fully synthetic (i.e. PAO base stock) 0w-20, have a look at Ravenol. They have two, an API SN / ilsac gf-5 / ACEA A1/B1] and an ACEA C2.

They are not cheap, a 5 litre jug will cost ~40.
_________________________
Life ist too short for boring cars.

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#4561305 - 11/01/17 02:37 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: spj]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 9395
Loc: Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: spj
Not looking to reverse engineer anything, but why list any percentage at all then?
They list a +/-10 percent range for a reason.

Okay, if you say so.
_________________________
1994 BMW 530i, 227K
1996 Honda Accord, 262K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 394K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 267K

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#4561620 - 11/01/17 09:18 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: turboseize]
Fallguy Offline


Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 242
Loc: Iowa (No, But I do Like It)
Thanks,

Just trying to stay in the $20-30 5qt range which mostly puts me in the group III range.

But noticed seams this particular one has very high PAO which makes it an extremely good value.

OW-20 M1 EP seams to have a lot of PAO if MSDS is to be believed. Even the American MSDS shows 60-70% high PAO on the 0W-20
_________________________
"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Best Oil Tool, Click
https://online.lubrizol.com/relperftool/pc.html

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#4561907 - 11/02/17 08:48 AM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy]
tig1 Offline


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 13661
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: Fallguy
Thanks,

Just trying to stay in the $20-30 5qt range which mostly puts me in the group III range.

But noticed seams this particular one has very high PAO which makes it an extremely good value.

OW-20 M1 EP seams to have a lot of PAO if MSDS is to be believed. Even the American MSDS shows 60-70% high PAO on the 0W-20


Also all M1 oils have some esters.
_________________________
2007 Ford Fusion 227,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 49K
M1 0-20 EP
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and MC LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters


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#4562104 - 11/02/17 01:49 PM Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: turboseize]
Nickdfresh Offline


Registered: 03/15/06
Posts: 5615
Loc: Buffalo, NY
Originally Posted By: turboseize
If you want a fully synthetic (i.e. PAO base stock) 0w-20, have a look at Ravenol. They have two, an API SN / ilsac gf-5 / ACEA A1/B1] and an ACEA C2.

They are not cheap, a 5 litre jug will cost ~40.


I don't think one would gain anything by paying more for Ravenol...

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