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M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F #4560682
10/31/17 09:24 PM
10/31/17 09:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
Fallguy Offline OP
Fallguy  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
If you look at foreign MSDS listings they have to apparently show things by percentages. Shows M1 0W-20 Extended Protection to be 60-70% PAO If you Look at the Canada MSDS on Mobil 1 0W-20

Go to Mobil 1 MSDS website Link below. Plug in Canada.

This is probably old news to some but if this is accurate I find this phenomenal. Wish me luck on running the M1EP 0W-20 its MRV is my big attraction for the winter & the PAO.

Now I know how they flow down to -54 Celsius / -65 Fahrenheit

Believe all of their 0W oils use much PAO. Look for " Decene " on the MSDS List

5W+ are mostly group III I believe.


http://www.msds.exxonmobil.com/IntApps/psims/psims.aspx


"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4560687
10/31/17 09:34 PM
10/31/17 09:34 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,988
Texas
4WD Offline
4WD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,988
Texas
Just put that oil in new 5.3L very quiet compared to my other 5.3L too soon to tell how long the OLM will let me run it but easy to monitor using those naughty steering wheel buttons

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4560722
10/31/17 10:24 PM
10/31/17 10:24 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
FermeLaPorte Offline
FermeLaPorte  Offline
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
I'm currently using M1 0w-40 on my Nissan Versa with the fiver. Been noticing increased reaction times and it's more quiet.

Last edited by FermeLaPorte; 10/31/17 10:25 PM.

Always Mobil 1
2014 1.6L Nissan Versa Sedan, 5 spd, 5k OCI.
2011 3.5L Chevrolet Impala, Automatic, 5k OCI.
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4560741
10/31/17 11:13 PM
10/31/17 11:13 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,277
Florida
Artem Offline
Artem  Offline
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,277
Florida
Wow, crazy flow temp. Perfect for winter, even down here in Florida. Hahahaha. Cold starts SUCK.


2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart. (thanks Advance Auto Parts for the awesome deal)
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4560750
10/31/17 11:26 PM
10/31/17 11:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,635
Katy, Republic of Texas
blupupher Offline
blupupher  Offline
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,635
Katy, Republic of Texas
Interesting.
I have 5 qts sitting on the shelf in the garage that I got for $2/qt at the Auto Zone clearance last year.

No need for the 0w portion of the oil here in south Texas, but looks to be good stuff (and I know a lot of UOA's show it to be).


1994 Honda VT1100: Peak 15w-40/PSL/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561139
11/01/17 11:35 AM
11/01/17 11:35 AM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 435
TN USA
Crispysea Offline
Crispysea  Offline
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 435
TN USA
Does that mean M1 AP is 100%? That would explain the price.

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561142
11/01/17 11:40 AM
11/01/17 11:40 AM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 70
north east
spj Offline
spj  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 70
north east
No, the MSDS lists the same ammounts for AP as is does EP. What I am unsure about is if mPAO is listed at all.

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: spj] #4561154
11/01/17 11:52 AM
11/01/17 11:52 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
kschachn  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: spj
No, the MSDS lists the same ammounts for AP as is does EP. What I am unsure about is if mPAO is listed at all.

Well the MSDS will list a range and not a specific percentage. MSDS are not intended for reverse engineering an oil.

I also doubt that in the context of an MSDS the different PAO varieties would have meaningful safety and firefighting differences which would warrant a separate category. As someone who used to write MSDS for a living I would never trust any of the percentages given in an MSDS, but maybe that's just me.


1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 400K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 271K
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561235
11/01/17 01:00 PM
11/01/17 01:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
Fallguy Offline OP
Fallguy  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER HYDROGENATED 60 - < 70% = PAO basestock


Thought many of the other 0W's of Mobil 1 would/could have it but looking like the 0W-20 M1 Extended Performance is the only one with this high supposed concentration (60-70%).

At least I now know that Decene in a MSDS would be PAO. If we can trust the percentages is a completely different question I suppose.

Not sure why they dont use the 60-70% PAO in many of there other oils in the "Extended Performance Line". Guess with the Extended Performance 0W-20 they charge enough extra to fund the PAO and have a stellar 0W in the lineup. All others and they have to compete with group III price point competition.

Link:
http://www.msds.exxonmobil.com/IntApps/psims/psims.aspx


"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561289
11/01/17 02:19 PM
11/01/17 02:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 70
north east
spj Offline
spj  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 70
north east
Not looking to reverse engineer anything, but why list any percentage at all then?
They list a +/-10 percent range for a reason.

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561300
11/01/17 02:36 PM
11/01/17 02:36 PM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 242
Germany
turboseize Offline
turboseize  Offline
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 242
Germany
If you want a fully synthetic (i.e. PAO base stock) 0w-20, have a look at Ravenol. They have two, an API SN / ilsac gf-5 / ACEA A1/B1] and an ACEA C2.

They are not cheap, a 5 litre jug will cost ~40.


Life ist too short for boring cars.
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: spj] #4561305
11/01/17 02:37 PM
11/01/17 02:37 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
kschachn  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: spj
Not looking to reverse engineer anything, but why list any percentage at all then?
They list a +/-10 percent range for a reason.

Okay, if you say so.


1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 400K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 271K
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: turboseize] #4561620
11/01/17 09:18 PM
11/01/17 09:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
Fallguy Offline OP
Fallguy  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 244
Nonya
Thanks,

Just trying to stay in the $20-30 5qt range which mostly puts me in the group III range.

But noticed seams this particular one has very high PAO which makes it an extremely good value.

OW-20 M1 EP seams to have a lot of PAO if MSDS is to be believed. Even the American MSDS shows 60-70% high PAO on the 0W-20


"Yes I likely did a search already, I want more info".
Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: Fallguy] #4561907
11/02/17 08:48 AM
11/02/17 08:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 13,834
Illinois
tig1 Offline
tig1  Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 13,834
Illinois
Originally Posted By: Fallguy
Thanks,

Just trying to stay in the $20-30 5qt range which mostly puts me in the group III range.

But noticed seams this particular one has very high PAO which makes it an extremely good value.

OW-20 M1 EP seams to have a lot of PAO if MSDS is to be believed. Even the American MSDS shows 60-70% high PAO on the 0W-20


Also all M1 oils have some esters.


2007 Ford Fusion 232,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 55K
M1 0-20 EP
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and MC LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters

Re: M1 0W-20 EP Is 60-70% PAO [Possibly True?] -65F [Re: turboseize] #4562104
11/02/17 01:49 PM
11/02/17 01:49 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,619
Buffalo, NY
Nickdfresh Offline
Nickdfresh  Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,619
Buffalo, NY
Originally Posted By: turboseize
If you want a fully synthetic (i.e. PAO base stock) 0w-20, have a look at Ravenol. They have two, an API SN / ilsac gf-5 / ACEA A1/B1] and an ACEA C2.

They are not cheap, a 5 litre jug will cost ~40.


I don't think one would gain anything by paying more for Ravenol...

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