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What is the reason for monogrades? #4559000
10/30/17 06:20 AM
10/30/17 06:20 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,825
Kendall, FL
wemay Offline OP
wemay  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,825
Kendall, FL
Just curious.


18 Sportage LX: M1AP 5W-20 + M1-104A
13 SFS 2.0T: PP 10W-30 + XG9688
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559003
10/30/17 06:26 AM
10/30/17 06:26 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,413
PA
d00df00d Offline
d00df00d  Offline
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,413
PA
Cheaper for a given level of performance when hot, and less or no VII/PPD content.

AFAIK, some of them actually would test out as 15W or 10W, but they're labeled as monogrades for people who think they still need a monograde (e.g. they have an old OPE that specs it).


2008 BMW M3
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: d00df00d] #4559022
10/30/17 06:40 AM
10/30/17 06:40 AM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,985
Southeast Texas
gfh77665 Offline
gfh77665  Offline
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,985
Southeast Texas
Originally Posted By: d00df00d

AFAIK, some of them actually would test out as 15W or 10W, but they're labeled as monogrades for people who think they still need a monograde (e.g. they have an old OPE that specs it).


Correct. Thats why I occasionally use monogrades without worry. In summer temps, they are absolutely excellent. Great for highway towing applications, too.

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559024
10/30/17 06:41 AM
10/30/17 06:41 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,825
Kendall, FL
wemay Offline OP
wemay  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,825
Kendall, FL
Thanks^

Is in inherently more stable, resistant to shear?


18 Sportage LX: M1AP 5W-20 + M1-104A
13 SFS 2.0T: PP 10W-30 + XG9688
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559069
10/30/17 07:44 AM
10/30/17 07:44 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,283
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,283
N.H, U.S.A.
No VM junk in there. They might be multigrade capable but the lack of VM is important for some engine spec like Detroit diesel turbo-supercharged 2 stroke diesels bus engines. A robust 10w30 multigrade would likely lunch that beautiful engine whereas an SAE HD30 would not and assures stay in grade performance.


2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#10 47272mi-QSUD10W30+5w20 Toughguard Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559130
10/30/17 08:54 AM
10/30/17 08:54 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,413
PA
d00df00d Offline
d00df00d  Offline
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,413
PA
Originally Posted By: wemay
Thanks^

Is in inherently more stable, resistant to shear?

As a class, dollar-for-dollar, yes.


2008 BMW M3
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559162
10/30/17 09:17 AM
10/30/17 09:17 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,075
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline
BrocLuno  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,075
Kalifornia Kollective
In marine and aircraft they are the norm, not multi-grades. Also in Detroit Diesels (2-stroke), they are absolutely mandatory. No viscosity modifiers and absolutely shear stable. All oil, all the time.

They show good upper ring band wear protection compared to multi's. There is absolutely no reason not to run a mono grade if you live in benign climate. Multi's were invented for northern USA/Canada and Europe where winter cold can be a problem.

So-Cal, AZ, TX, NM and most of Nevada can do w/o multi's completely. Same for FL and most southern states. No reason for multi's in Mexico or the Caribbean either.

But, refiners do not want to market lo-profit oils when they have spent big bux convincing most of the world of the superiority of multi's ... confused

I just bought 8 gallons of SAE 40 SN for $10.00 on sale at TSC. Nobody is making any money at that price ...

Last edited by BrocLuno; 10/30/17 09:23 AM.

Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559175
10/30/17 09:29 AM
10/30/17 09:29 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 544
Ontario Canada
2KBMW Offline
2KBMW  Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 544
Ontario Canada
Mono grades would be used mostly in farm and heavy duty construction equipment.

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559178
10/30/17 09:31 AM
10/30/17 09:31 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,075
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline
BrocLuno  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,075
Kalifornia Kollective
Depends on where the equipment is operated. In Nebraska in winter, even construction equipment gets multi's, or block heaters, etc ...

Last edited by BrocLuno; 10/30/17 09:32 AM.

Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: BrocLuno] #4559181
10/30/17 09:35 AM
10/30/17 09:35 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 544
Ontario Canada
2KBMW Offline
2KBMW  Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 544
Ontario Canada
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Depends on where the equipment is operated. In Nebraska in winter, even construction equipment gets multi's, or block heaters, etc ...


Your right. Used in summer only, like using 30 weight in lawn equipment etc.

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559205
10/30/17 10:14 AM
10/30/17 10:14 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,220
Port Orange, Florida
Panzerman Offline
Panzerman  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,220
Port Orange, Florida
Monogrades handle the heat better than multigrades.
Make them a favorite for air cooled small engines where durability is more important than fuel economy.



2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi 4x4
2016 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack
Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559277
10/30/17 12:08 PM
10/30/17 12:08 PM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 172
New York
jeff78 Offline
jeff78  Offline
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 172
New York
Monogrades also work very well in shared sump motorcycles where the engine oil also lubricates the transmission, gear shifting mechanism, and the clutch. In other words, everything. The gears really do a number on the VII's in multigrades. Monogrades are immune.

On a car, you don't really feel the effects of oil that has sheared down. On a shared sump bike, you do - shift quality goes downhill and results in poor shifting and even missed shifts.

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559292
10/30/17 12:34 PM
10/30/17 12:34 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 87
America
LaCocina27 Offline
LaCocina27  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 87
America
If I recall, monograde 30 or even 40 motor oil was specified for use in manual gearboxes on cars.

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559378
10/30/17 02:27 PM
10/30/17 02:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,529
'Stralia
Shannow Offline
Shannow  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,529
'Stralia
Naturally, monogrades existed first.

The different oils from different regions had different properties, some showed less viscosity change with temperature and were considered more desirable. So they were given a "viscosity index" of 100 (the best), and the worst given zero.

Synthetics had viscosity indices higher than 100 and were more desirable.

At some stage, viscosity index improvers were developed, and "multigrades' came about, that could cross the boundaries between a thin and thick oil...or add a lower "W" rating for a given KV100 basically.

These were ultimately found to no offer what they promised, and high shear viscometry was born.

Monogrades do not change viscometrically with the rate that the wear surfaces move past each other ... they are "Newtoian"...multis don't do that, they change with shear rate as the polymers "flatten out"...here's one of the early tests...


One of the "50s" perfomed as well as a 40, the other about as well as a 30.

That's why HTHS minimums were introduced into J300 (which has evolved continuously since the 20s), as it was found that HTHS was more related to bearing wear. (Ealy on, the 0W, 5W, 10W 40s were only required to have a 2.9 min, just like the 30s...that was changed recently to 3.5)...note, a mono 30 has an HTHS of about 3.5+

Re: What is the reason for monogrades? [Re: wemay] #4559417
10/30/17 03:31 PM
10/30/17 03:31 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 204
Albury, NSW
JFAllen Offline
JFAllen  Offline
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 204
Albury, NSW
As I've mentioned in other threads, the new sawth of 0W16 and 0W8 oils are going to very closely resemble mono-grades with low PPD, VII and VM additives. This is because they already pass the cold pour tests as they're so thin to begin with. As has been mentioned in this thread already, mono-grades are much more sheer stable over the life of the oil. It also means that you don't need to spend as much on your additive package. But rest assured they will not pass those savings onto the consumer smile

Jordan

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