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Water in oil analysis #4554255
10/25/17 01:49 PM
10/25/17 01:49 PM
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 615
WV
loneryder Offline OP
loneryder  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 615
WV
Got my results back from ALS Tribology and the only thing questionable was .12% water. It's a Ford E350 RV with the V-10. It's been sitting so I ran it at idle to warm it up. I thought it got up to operating temp. There is no antifreeze reported. Do you think the water could be from just idling it to warm it up? I don't know where else it could come from. They could not test the viscosity due to the water present???

Also as an FYI, when you send samples in to them in Atlanta, put it in an envelope instead of just mailing the canister. They have a problem with the post office holding the canisters for weeks at a time before delivering them. Lady told me they seem to receive samples in envelopes in a timely manner.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554258
10/25/17 01:52 PM
10/25/17 01:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 36,637
Great Lakes
Quattro Pete Offline
Quattro Pete  Offline
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 36,637
Great Lakes
Water condensation could be there just from it sitting for a while. And just bringing it up to operating temp may not be enough to burn it off. You'd probably have to run it longer to get rid of all the moisture.


'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (PUP 0W-40 SRT)
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554402
10/25/17 04:46 PM
10/25/17 04:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 88
VA
thastinger Online content
thastinger  Online Content
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 88
VA
Well, since water evaps at 212, you would likely have to warm the oil up beyond that temp and keep it there for a bit in order to burn it off.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554416
10/25/17 04:56 PM
10/25/17 04:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
There's always water in UOA. Most UOA's don't use FTIR or KF, so they don't detect it, that's all. But it's still there.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554453
10/25/17 05:25 PM
10/25/17 05:25 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21,323
ON, Canada eh?
StevieC Offline
StevieC  Offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21,323
ON, Canada eh?
As long as there is no traces of coolant as called out by the Lab I would think it's a combination of it sitting and the oil not reaching full operating temperature so it could burn off the moisture.

I always take my samples after I return from driving around doing shopping/errands etc. so I know the oil got hot enough to give me a good reading.

Hope that helps.


'18 Dodge Grand Caravan GT - AMSOIL SS 5w20
'06 Santa Fe - 535,000km AMSOIL SS 0w30 / ATF
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554462
10/25/17 05:36 PM
10/25/17 05:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,129
Upstate NY
Donald Offline
Donald  Offline
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,129
Upstate NY
Getting the oil to operating temp is not going to burn off any condensation water.


2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554501
10/25/17 06:20 PM
10/25/17 06:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
Also, and Mr. Cedrone can vouch for this or at least he knows who could, what is being detected as "water" in those tests is not always "water".

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554545
10/25/17 07:03 PM
10/25/17 07:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,016
Buffalo, NY
JTK Offline
JTK  Offline
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,016
Buffalo, NY
Trace amounts of moisture in engine oil will most certainly evaporate off over some run time at normal operating temps and be processed by the PCV system. That's one of the reasons the PCV system is there. The closer to the boiling point of water the faster this would happen, but it will occur at less temperature.


2017 Ram 1500 4x4, 3.6L. 2016 Nissan Quest SV (Babe magnet IV)
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554554
10/25/17 07:08 PM
10/25/17 07:08 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,651
The Motor City
Kestas Offline
Kestas  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,651
The Motor City
We use Karl Fischer at work to determine water content in grease. Anything up to 0.5% is considered normal for new grease. I suspect the same may be attributed to motor oil. Your 0.12% may be as low as you can expect it.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554644
10/25/17 08:46 PM
10/25/17 08:46 PM
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 615
WV
loneryder Offline OP
loneryder  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 615
WV
Thanks guys. There was zero antifreeze in it. I just didn't run it long enough. Why would such little water prevent them from testing viscosity??

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4554958
10/26/17 08:34 AM
10/26/17 08:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 36,637
Great Lakes
Quattro Pete Offline
Quattro Pete  Offline
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 36,637
Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: loneryder
Why would such little water prevent them from testing viscosity??

That's puzzling to me.


'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (PUP 0W-40 SRT)
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4555409
10/26/17 05:12 PM
10/26/17 05:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
you can actually use the "water" content to determine the fueling conditions.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4555593
10/26/17 07:33 PM
10/26/17 07:33 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,684
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Online content
DoubleWasp  Online Content
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,684
Fort Lauderdale, FL
They declined vis test on one of my samples for water too. Seems to be the way they operate. No explanation though.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: DoubleWasp] #4555835
10/27/17 12:43 AM
10/27/17 12:43 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
They declined vis test on one of my samples for water too. Seems to be the way they operate. No explanation though.


I've had many times when lab techs wouldn't run a sample through PC because it was too dark, etc. Some labs, the lab tech is responsible for operation and will get dinged for not stopping a sample that could break the machine.

Unless your a multimillion dollar client, they're not going to stop run time if they think your sample will give trouble.

Re: Water in oil analysis [Re: loneryder] #4556845
10/28/17 03:46 AM
10/28/17 03:46 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,684
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Online content
DoubleWasp  Online Content
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,684
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Makes sense.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
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