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Extended Oil Change ? #4548993
10/20/17 08:31 AM
10/20/17 08:31 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 235
Girard, Ill
yankees1 Offline OP
yankees1  Offline OP
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 235
Girard, Ill
I have two corvettes that were only driven about two hundred miles each this year due to illness. Normally I change the oil each fall but with low miles is it okay to wait until next spring to change oil ? Dino oil in 72 vette and synthetic in 2003.

Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549002
10/20/17 08:36 AM
10/20/17 08:36 AM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 544
DFW
JustN89 Offline
JustN89  Offline
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 544
DFW
Originally Posted By: yankees1
I have two corvettes that were only driven about two hundred miles each this year due to illness. Normally I change the oil each fall but with low miles is it okay to wait until next spring to change oil ? Dino oil in 72 vette and synthetic in 2003.

I would change the dino out and keep the synthetic, but that's just me.

Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549013
10/20/17 08:41 AM
10/20/17 08:41 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,186
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,186
N.H, U.S.A.
No reason to change whatsoever. The oils have anti-acids in them and the contamination comes though hours of use not hours of sitting. Oil is a stable paraffin doesn't care about time sitting in a pan.
If you over-change you will cause HARM. So, fa gitaboudit!

If you put about 3k in three years go the three years. Forget Annual OCI. Save your worries for the crisis around the corner - not this smile

Last edited by ARCOgraphite; 10/20/17 08:43 AM.

2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549052
10/20/17 09:29 AM
10/20/17 09:29 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
69GTX Offline
69GTX  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
Any hard evidence out there that doing an annual oil change on a low mileage vehicle WILL result in HARM?

If this were really the case, shouldn't there be a warning in current owner's manuals to warn users that in the event they have too few miles in a year, to ignore the manufacturer's written owner's manual guidance of doing an annual oil change? What if some owner had only 200 annual miles but did that with weekly 4 mile trips (2 miles to the shopping center...then drive back 1-2 hours later)?

I'm in the same boat as the OP. 800-1200 miles per year on my 1999 (always a minimum of non-stop, 15-20 miles drives). I change the M1 0w-40 annually. Nothing I've read says this is doing HARM. I can afford the extra $20/yr for an M1/FUG oil change. I keep in touch with a number of other 4th gen LS1 owners who do a similar maintenance routine. All these cars are under 30K miles and 15-20 years old now. Some drive as little as 200-400 miles per year...maybe half a dozen uses per year. No issues on any of the engines.

If it were me, I'd probably change the dino oil on the OP's Vette. The synthetic at only 200 miles is really not an issue not changing until more miles rack up. I think you're fine no matter what you do on either of them. New cars can sit on lots for up to 2 years at time, under 200 miles and on factory conventional/syn blend fills. They don't seem to suffer for it...though I doubt anyone tracks such vehicles through end of engine life to see if there were "problems" years down the road.


----------------

2001 Lincoln Cont 4.6L DOHC/ 39K mi / QS HM 5w30 / FUG XG2
1999 Camaro SS M6 /19K /Mobil 1 0w40 /Fram UG /GM MTL-ATF
1969 Ply GTX/RRs
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549060
10/20/17 09:35 AM
10/20/17 09:35 AM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 18,326
Ontario, Canada
StevieC Offline
StevieC  Offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 18,326
Ontario, Canada
My MIL drives low mileage on her CRV and was doing yearly changes with conventional oil and the engine seems fine.

Last edited by StevieC; 10/20/17 09:35 AM.

'18 Highlander - AMSOIL SS 0w20 / ATF / Severe Gear
'06 Santa Fe - 535,000km AMSOIL SS 0w30 / ATF (R.I.P)
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549098
10/20/17 10:09 AM
10/20/17 10:09 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,504
Chattanooga, TN
Spector Offline
Spector  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,504
Chattanooga, TN
When I had my toy I easily went 1 to 1-1/2 years between changes. When I did start it I tried to drive at least 10-15 miles to heat it up but the UOA were always fine.

No harm in waiting

Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: ARCOgraphite] #4549118
10/20/17 10:24 AM
10/20/17 10:24 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 7,094
Colorado
Kuato Offline
Kuato  Offline
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 7,094
Colorado
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
No reason to change whatsoever. The oils have anti-acids in them and the contamination comes though hours of use not hours of sitting. Oil is a stable paraffin doesn't care about time sitting in a pan.
If you over-change you will cause HARM. So, fa gitaboudit!

If you put about 3k in three years go the three years. Forget Annual OCI. Save your worries for the crisis around the corner - not this smile


^ This. Especially with ONLY 200 miles!


Thick vs Thin test: 15k / 43k miles complete
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549214
10/20/17 12:09 PM
10/20/17 12:09 PM
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 109
VA
MSTUEBER Offline
MSTUEBER  Offline
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 109
VA
I have a 1992 Miata that I have had since new. I only put about 300 miles a year on it, and is garage kept. But every spring I change
the oil & filter, even thou I know I don't have to. With the deals on oil & filters that I get from joining this site, it cost me
less than $10 to put syn blend in. Gives me a reason to tell my wife I can't help her with spring cleaning, I have to change the oil. smile


2017 Fiat 124 Spider Abarth .... factory fill
2015 Chrysler 200 0w20 Milesyn Wix XP
1992 Mazda Miata Napa 5w30 Napa Gold
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549257
10/20/17 12:58 PM
10/20/17 12:58 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
69GTX Offline
69GTX  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
It is true that there's a 2007 mfg's fleet study that concluded engine wear rates were the highest early in the oil change interval. After 3K miles wear rates continued to decline until the oil was "officially" used up (TBN, TAN, viscosity, or other factors). Still, the period of higher wear likely varies considerably between oils, engines, and duty cycle. Apparently, the protective, anti-wear chemical tribofilms get fully/partially removed from the application of fresh detergents following an oil change. One size doesn't fit all.


----------------

2001 Lincoln Cont 4.6L DOHC/ 39K mi / QS HM 5w30 / FUG XG2
1999 Camaro SS M6 /19K /Mobil 1 0w40 /Fram UG /GM MTL-ATF
1969 Ply GTX/RRs
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: 69GTX] #4549263
10/20/17 01:02 PM
10/20/17 01:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,209
Wet side WA
JohnnyJohnson Offline
JohnnyJohnson  Offline
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,209
Wet side WA
Originally Posted By: 69GTX
It is true that there's a 2007 mfg's fleet study that concluded engine wear rates were the highest early in the oil change interval. After 3K miles wear rates continued to decline until the oil was "officially" used up (TBN, TAN, viscosity, or other factors). Still, the period of higher wear likely varies considerably between oils, engines, and duty cycle. Apparently, the protective, anti-wear chemical tribofilms get fully/partially removed from the application of fresh detergents following an oil change. One size doesn't fit all.


If that was true why wouldn't we all be running oil forever and just use an additive to take care of TBN/TAN?


2004 Corolla 124705
Out: VML 5w-30 TG4967 OCI 5007 Miles
In: EDGE EP 5W-30 Bosch 3311 122537 7-18-18
2006 Duramax 74277
Out: T6 5W-40 M1-303
In: T6 5W-40 XG9100 74705 4-22-18
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: JohnnyJohnson] #4549265
10/20/17 01:07 PM
10/20/17 01:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
kschachn  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,884
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: JohnnyJohnson
Originally Posted By: 69GTX
It is true that there's a 2007 mfg's fleet study that concluded engine wear rates were the highest early in the oil change interval. After 3K miles wear rates continued to decline until the oil was "officially" used up (TBN, TAN, viscosity, or other factors). Still, the period of higher wear likely varies considerably between oils, engines, and duty cycle. Apparently, the protective, anti-wear chemical tribofilms get fully/partially removed from the application of fresh detergents following an oil change. One size doesn't fit all.

If that was true why wouldn't we all be running oil forever and just use an additive to take care of TBN/TAN?

It appears to be something that's not true but often repeated here on Bitog. Take a look at this thread:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4443010/1

Originally Posted By: Shannow
That paper keeps getting trotted out as proof of something that the paper never tested nor demonstrated.

They took a bunch of used oils, some of which were utterly shagged, had thickened excessivly and had poor TBN.

Then they use a contacting surface tribometer and measured the establishment of the tribofilms with new and progressively used oil. The used oil formed tribofilms on fresh metal surfaces quicker than fresh.

This is entirely to be expected, as the first part of the laying down of tribofilms involves partial destruction of the ZDDP/Mo into more reactive species...some additive companies put a lot of different elemental "variaties" in so that there are different points of activation.

So the oil with the most already partially reacted species in it produced the best tribofilms the earliest...exactly as expected.

The Used oil, excessively thick, wiht no TBN to speak of was not necessarily the best oil to have in the engine. Extrapolating the limits (surface tribometer) of this study INTO that realm is really stretching the bow a bit (well a lot).

And at OCI, the quote that you have provided assumes that ALL of the tribofilm is removed to fresh metal (not true, never seen anything on that).

As to the thought process...

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4060600/1


1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 400K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 271K
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549288
10/20/17 01:36 PM
10/20/17 01:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,769
Ca.
UncleDave Offline
UncleDave  Offline
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,769
Ca.
If they were mine Id take them out and heat them up enough to burn off any condensation then put them back in storage until I could enjoy them again.


UD


Uncle Dave
Cat 3126/2 MB3500/Titan/RX400H/17 Ridgeline
700HP V10/ 725HP BBC/ Raptor 700/ KFX450/ YZ250/Onan 8K/ Cat3011C
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549290
10/20/17 01:43 PM
10/20/17 01:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 10,682
Phoenix, AZ
Nick1994 Offline
Nick1994  Offline
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 10,682
Phoenix, AZ
Leave it alone. Changing the oil before winter isnít going to help anything, itís just going to be sitting in the bottom of the pan regardless.

That would be like washing a Jeep absolutely spotless, waxing, polishing, tire shine, etc. and then go drive it through 2 feet of mud for an hour.

Doesnít make a difference.


2015 Hyundai Sonata 2.4L 84k Mobil 1 AFE 0w30 & OEM
2000 Toyota Camry 2.2L 230k Valvoline 5w30 & Fram Ultra
1996 Jeep Cherokee 4.0L 147k Mobil 1 HM 10w40 & Fram Ultra
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4549520
10/20/17 06:57 PM
10/20/17 06:57 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
69GTX Offline
69GTX  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 3,861
Connecticut
What I posted above was in fact true. And Shannow seems to agree. There is more wear early in the OCI's as "some" of the Tribofilms get removed. Whether you run your own oil to past TBN expiration is your own choice. I wouldn't. I merely brought this up to show that wear rates do start off higher in an OCI. It's probably very costly to quantify what those "wear rate" differences might be over an engine's life. Probably not much.

This is entirely to be expected, as the first part of the laying down of tribofilms involves partial destruction of the ZDDP/Mo into more reactive species...some additive companies put a lot of different elemental "variaties" in so that there are different points of activation.


And one should clearly change their oil before TBN/TAN get too close to turning the wrong way. Nowhere did I agree with pushing TBN into the ground while running on thick/oxidated oil from 8K to 20K miles depending on your vehicle/oil/usage. And my own OCI's never go past 4K-4.5K on synthetic oils.


----------------

2001 Lincoln Cont 4.6L DOHC/ 39K mi / QS HM 5w30 / FUG XG2
1999 Camaro SS M6 /19K /Mobil 1 0w40 /Fram UG /GM MTL-ATF
1969 Ply GTX/RRs
Re: Extended Oil Change ? [Re: yankees1] #4552938
10/24/17 11:31 AM
10/24/17 11:31 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,186
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,186
N.H, U.S.A.
... Not to mention dry starts after changing the oil... and chance of installing a bad filter (where the existing was fine. I recall I spun a bearing on an old suburu Loyal 1.8L changing the oil in the dead of winter. Engines Wasn't knocking BEFORE I changed the oil.

The oil get oxidized and the EP /AW get used up. On a UOA, You will still see the high ppm for Zn, but its inactive - used up. Oil does have to be changed but not too soon.

I was an over zealous oil changer and you saw what happened to my cars.

It can be a hard habit to loose.

Last edited by ARCOgraphite; 10/24/17 11:34 AM.

2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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