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School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 #4536703
10/07/17 11:11 PM
10/07/17 11:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
B320i Offline OP
B320i  Offline OP
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
Am curious about the Penrite HPR30's formulation.

It carries the following OE approvals:
ACEA A3/B3
API SJ/CF
API SL/CF
API SM/CG-4
Ford M2C153-E
GM 6094M
VW 501 01
VW 502 00
VW 505 00

And has the following typical data:
Code:
Density at 15C, kg/L	                0.884
Viscosity, Kinematic, cSt at 40C	229
Viscosity, Kinematic, cSt at 100C	24.2
Viscosity Index	                       132
Cold Cranking Viscosity, cP at -15C   8206
Ca content, Mass %	               0.315
Zinc, Mass %	                       0.157
Phosphorus, Mass %	               0.145
Sulphated Ash, mass %	             1.29
Base Number	                       9.7


Would this oil be shear-stable as claimed, a good cleaner oil, or maybe something else?

While normally a staunch advocate of "Use what it says in the manual" (except for ILSAC/Economy stuff where use of A3/B3 oils would probably help prevent oil consumption), its just something I was thinking about recently and wanted some input on cool


'93 BMW 320i 217,000km - Valvoline Engine-Armour 15w40, Mann Filter.
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4536747
10/08/17 01:11 AM
10/08/17 01:11 AM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,891
New Zealand
Silk Offline
Silk  Offline
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,891
New Zealand
I think it great, I'd like to try it in my bike or Volvo some time...if it gets cheap enough when I want it.


1987 BMW R65 - Aegis SAE30
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4536757
10/08/17 02:14 AM
10/08/17 02:14 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
It was THE performance oil back in the day (used by many club racers - so I'm told) and I've used a lot of it.

When I first started riding motorcycles, I was into air-cooled single cylinder thumpers with a shared sump and a wet clutch. They were very hard on oil with the lack of temperature control and the mechanical shearing of the gears. Also back then nobody made special motorcycle only engine oils (as far as I know) and synthetics had yet to appear around me (or were unaffordable exotica).

Anyway, fiirst oil change, I went for Castrol GTX 20W-50 but it sheared out pretty quick and gave me a bad gear change. Next I tried Valvoline 20W-50, but I had much the same issue, it sheared out too quickly. Then I went to Penrite HPR 30 (20W-60) and it was Great !!! Reduced oil consumption and a good smooth gear change for twice the distance of the other too. In fact the gear change never went bad, I just changed my bike oil according to mileage for the first time. But it could definitely go twice the distance of the other two, if not further.

So I used nothing else but HPR 30 in my thumpers from then on. I also ran it in my HJ Kingswood with 202 in-line six, it was the oil in my Holden sump the day I blew a radiator hose in the middle of the bush and I had to limp home at night, pausing occasionally to cool my dry engine. Made it to my Uncle's farm, repaired the hose, no engine damage. It can take a bit of heat and has a nice does of zinc too at 1570 ppm.

I also had an older Audi with a 2.3L 5-cylinder. It drank like a sailor on shore leave with a hand full of fifties and a new tattoo. I tried Shell Helix 15W-50 High Mileage, and it still drank big. It switched to HPR 30 and suddenly my oil consumption dropped to about a quarter of it's previous rate.

Does it shear ? I don't know exactly, it may, but it never shear enough to be a problem on my motorcycles, yet other oils would. It did have a head start on them though, the GTX 20W50 has a KV100 of about 18 cSt, while the HPR30 has a KV100 of about 24 cSt. So it could drop 4 or 5 cSt and still be thicker than fresh GTX 20W50.

In the right application, and I've had a few, it's a great oil.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4537632
10/09/17 01:41 AM
10/09/17 01:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Right now it's on sale everywhere
It's $10 off at AutoBarn, $8 / 15% off at Repco, and $11.40 / 25% Off at SuperCheapAuto ($33.60 for 5L).
SCA has the best price.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4537637
10/09/17 02:10 AM
10/09/17 02:10 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Even though I like and have used much Penrite 20W-60, I now see it as having a fair amount of polymer VII's in it.

Back in the day, another popular heavy duty oil was Castrol GP50, this is now called Edge 25W-50. It should be very close to a monograde and shear stable.
They say it's "a semi synthetic engine oil formulated for big bore street machines", but it's only rated API SG/CD and I believe it to be a high zinc oil (but I can't find any solid figures to back that up).

Edge 25W-50
KV100 = 21.0 cSt
KV40 = 204 cSt
HTHS = 6.1 cP
TBN = 8.3


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: SR5] #4537638
10/09/17 02:11 AM
10/09/17 02:11 AM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
B320i Offline OP
B320i  Offline OP
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
Originally Posted By: SR5
Right now it's on sale everywhere
It's $10 off at AutoBarn, $8 / 15% off at Repco, and $11.40 / 25% Off at SuperCheapAuto ($33.60 for 5L).
SCA has the best price.

Don't tempt me! I'm only about 2000km into my current OCI cry

Originally Posted By: SR5
Even though I like and have used much Penrite 20W-60, I now see it as having a fair amount of polymer VII's in it.

It seems to have a cult following in some communities, particularly owners of Range Rovers (P38a, Classic) with the old Aluminium V8. I'm somewhat interested, given that I seem to have a slightly tappy lifter or two, plus the requisite VANOS noise (although performance and economy are still good, so not suspicious of it being bad just yet).

Edge 25w50 sounds very interesting... Wonder what base oils in that one? It is presently on sale at SCA for $31.89/5L, about 20% off.

Last edited by B320i; 10/09/17 02:16 AM.

'93 BMW 320i 217,000km - Valvoline Engine-Armour 15w40, Mann Filter.
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4537640
10/09/17 02:21 AM
10/09/17 02:21 AM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,891
New Zealand
Silk Offline
Silk  Offline
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,891
New Zealand
I don't need any right now, and I don't buy in advance...well a couple of weeks maybe. But when I do want HPR30, it will be full price and I'll have to settle for GTX 20w-50...again.


1987 BMW R65 - Aegis SAE30
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4537652
10/09/17 03:58 AM
10/09/17 03:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,513
'Stralia
Shannow Online content
Shannow  Online Content
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,513
'Stralia
Originally Posted By: B320i
Edge 25w50 sounds very interesting... Wonder what base oils in that one? It is presently on sale at SCA for $31.89/5L, about 20% off.


absolute zero VII effect in edge 25W50...and an HTHS over 6...can't go wrong.

Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4537654
10/09/17 04:15 AM
10/09/17 04:15 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Quote:
It seems to have a cult following in some communities,

It was the first oil that ever impressed me. I could tell I had something different in the engine, and it could handle a thrashing and come back for more. It made me never look at Valvoline XLD 20W50 or Castrol GTX 20W50 ever again (except as cheap mower / top-up oil).

So HPR30 at $33.60 or Edge 25W50 at $32- . Choice is yours.
One is SM & A3/B3 with lots of zinc, and the other is a semi-synthetic SG monograde with decent TBN.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: Silk] #4537659
10/09/17 04:41 AM
10/09/17 04:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Quote:
and I'll have to settle for GTX 20w-50...again.

Valvoline make a MaxLife 20W-50 that is semi-synthetic and A3/B4. I've not used it myself, but it looks like one of the better 20W50's out there right now, and it's priced between the GTX and the HPR30.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4539745
10/10/17 11:56 PM
10/10/17 11:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 203
Albury, NSW
JFAllen Offline
JFAllen  Offline
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 203
Albury, NSW
As an Aussie, I find that a great number of people feel the need to use overly thick oil here. For years the go-to oil in Australia was 20W50, when the rest of the world was using XW30 oils.

People go on about high ambient temperatures and this and that, but it's all trash. Assuming that your engine isn't over heating, once at operating temperature, your oil temps will be the same regardless of ambient conditions. All you're doing by using such heavy oil is increasing load and wear during cold start conditions. There is a place for 60W oils, but a regularly driven 'street car' isn't it. Special interest cars are even a less compelling use case as they sit for months at a time. thus coal start need the most oil flow as quickly as possible. these ultra heavy oils are not useful here at all.

Lastly 60W oils add significantly to internal hydraulic friction, thus increased fuel consumption, as the engine is having to work harder against the oil. If the oil is full of PPD and VII's this leads to them breaking down sooner, as the oil is effectively worked harder in-between the bearings (greater heat.)

If you're using a 60W oil to 'hide'some engine noise, then there are bigger issues at play, get that fixed and go back to a 30 or 40W oil and realise the performance benefits.

Regards
Jordan.

P.S: The Bathurst winning car from last sunday uses Pentrite 10W40 10/10th raceing oil, straight off the shelf.

Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: JFAllen] #4539747
10/11/17 12:12 AM
10/11/17 12:12 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Originally Posted By: JFAllen
P.S: The Bathurst winning car from last sunday uses Pentrite 10W40 10/10th raceing oil, straight off the shelf.


Nice to know.

Many years ago I used HPR 30 in my motorcycles, but the last oil change in my bike was with Penrite 10-Tenths 10W40.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: JFAllen] #4539749
10/11/17 12:20 AM
10/11/17 12:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
B320i Offline OP
B320i  Offline OP
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
Originally Posted By: JFAllen
If you're using a 60W oil to 'hide'some engine noise, then there are bigger issues at play, get that fixed and go back to a 30 or 40W oil and realise the performance benefits.

Generally, I'm not one to recommend beyond "use what it says in the manual." I was merely curious about the formulation of HPR30. Even for me, a xW-60 would be pushing things a bit much.

Normally agree on engine noise being unhealthy - (however) the BMW M50 engines (as well as the M42/44) are reasonable well-known to exhibit some degree of noise from the hydraulic lifters. Some examples are definitely worse than others. The "VANOS" noise is due to a degree of slop in the variable-valve timing mechanism, and not detrimental to performance. Some oils are particularly bad for exasperating this noise, M1 definitely made some noise in my vehicle.

My vehicle exhibits both traits, despite being serviced appropriately in its' 24yrs on the road.

If the vehicle made any other sounds, I'd obviously not be using thicker oil to cover it up. The BMW engines of this era were designed for xW40 oils, although the manual certainly recommends thicker for hotter climates.
Having used both xW-40 and xW-50 oils, I can't say there was any notable difference in performance or economy in my vehicle.

Will not debate the semantics of flow vs. pressure at startup, as other's are better-equipped to do so. All I have to say is, oils with a low 'W' rating a mostly pointless in Australia, unless your aim is to needlessly waste money.


'93 BMW 320i 217,000km - Valvoline Engine-Armour 15w40, Mann Filter.
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4548904
10/20/17 05:05 AM
10/20/17 05:05 AM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
SR5 Offline
SR5  Offline
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,650
Down Under
Penrite HPR 5 (5W-40) synthetic is on sale now at SCA for those interested (Oct. 2017)

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4548862/

API SN, ACEA A3/B4, BMW LL-01, MB 229.5, Porsche A40, JASO MA-1
TBN = 10.4, Zinc = 1240 ppm

Last edited by SR5; 10/20/17 05:08 AM. Reason: Add some specs.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Castrol GTX Ultraclean 15W40 A3/B3 + Wesfil-Cooper Z154
Re: School Me on Penrite HPR30/20w60 [Re: B320i] #4551623
10/23/17 04:32 AM
10/23/17 04:32 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 87
NSW Australia
peejaycruiser Offline
peejaycruiser  Offline
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 87
NSW Australia
This oil was my first foray into Penrite oils. It was used as a ff on a rebuilt Astron in my Galant.


02 Subaru Liberty RX 2.5 Synpower 5W-40 OEM Filter
96 Toyota 80 Series 1HZ Sakura C-1112 Nulon High Torque 15w-40

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