Recent Topics
Decent MP3 player
by Ed_T
06/24/18 07:08 PM
Letgo
by Donald
06/24/18 06:52 PM
Tire buying advice
by supton
06/24/18 06:23 PM
Two versions of M1 5w30 ESP now?
by Patman
06/24/18 06:21 PM
No older cars in New York State?
by Oldtom
06/24/18 06:19 PM
2009 Taurus strut mount noise
by terry274
06/24/18 04:38 PM
A3/B3 vs A3/B4, big difference or irrelevant?
by FordCapriDriver
06/24/18 03:36 PM
2003 Honda power steering problem
by hogpops
06/24/18 03:29 PM
Public Service Announcement: Flush Your HW Heater
by gathermewool
06/24/18 03:25 PM
Fellow 2AZ-FE toyota owners: what oil are you usin
by car51
06/24/18 03:21 PM
Castrol 0W40 vs 5W40??
by Realfine69
06/24/18 03:02 PM
Paint impurities on a new car
by Quattro Pete
06/24/18 02:49 PM
2014 Ram wheel FIT on a 2005 Ram?
by SumpChump
06/24/18 02:41 PM
Do people buy from telemarketers?
by Chris142
06/24/18 02:06 PM
TGMO 0W20, 8100km/5mo, 2013 Lexus GS350AWD 118K KM
by David_Corbett
06/24/18 01:54 PM
Sonoma Raceway
by Warstud
06/24/18 01:51 PM
Zipcode error
by aquariuscsm
06/24/18 01:36 PM
NHRA drag racing Racing question??
by daddi
06/24/18 01:33 PM
Milesyn 5w30 5 gal pails $50.94 w/prime
by Samrsnow
06/24/18 01:20 PM
Removing Broken Bathtub Drain
by Warstud
06/24/18 01:15 PM
Newest Members
crrider, EdDmax, 2018matto, Lancruza, IanSampson
65312 Registered Users
Who's Online
101 registered (A310, 69Torino, 2015_PSD, bdcardinal, bbhero, 379KITTY, 9 invisible), 1595 Guests and 40 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
65312 Members
67 Forums
285932 Topics
4771653 Posts

Max Online: 3590 @ 01/24/17 08:07 PM
Donate to BITOG
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#4529449 - 09/29/17 02:17 PM Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment
Vladiator Offline


Registered: 01/04/16
Posts: 728
Loc: NC
Here are the samples of the same oil (Toyota 5w30) from different OCIs and different duty cycles in the same engine.
-Sample on the very left is a brand new oil.
-Next one to the right has 10k kilometers (6200 miles) and 294 hours of mixed driving.
-Third sample has 16k kilometers (10k miles) and 307 hours of highway cruising.
-The darkest sample on the right has ONLY 8.5K kilometers (5.3K miles) and 354 hours of city traffic with idling and stop&go.

Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.



Top
#4529456 - 09/29/17 02:26 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 29802
Loc: NY
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.
_________________________
God Bless Our Troops


Top
#4529458 - 09/29/17 02:30 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: demarpaint]
Vladiator Offline


Registered: 01/04/16
Posts: 728
Loc: NC
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.


Samples were taken in this order:
1) 6200 miles
2) 5300 miles
3) 10000 miles
_________________________
Thicker oils give protection for severe operations such as driving in mountains, pulling a boat, dusty conditions, short trips, high rpm, overloading, overheating and overcooling. Thin oils give MPG.

Top
#4529461 - 09/29/17 02:34 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 29802
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.


Samples were taken in this order:
1) 6200 miles
2) 5300 miles
3) 10000 miles



OK, but each time a sample was taken the engine had more miles and more wear on it. I'd also expect the oil with the most time on it and hardest use would be the worst, which the picture shows.
_________________________
God Bless Our Troops


Top
#4529513 - 09/29/17 03:46 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 9420
Loc: Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.

So you can tell how "used up" it is by the color?
_________________________
1994 BMW 530i, 227K
1996 Honda Accord, 262K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 394K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 267K

Top
#4529540 - 09/29/17 04:14 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
Burt Offline


Registered: 01/08/09
Posts: 1311
Loc: texas
Yep - hours is the biggest factor.
_________________________
2011 RX350 53k miles
2015 Fiesta SFE eco-boost 24k miles

Top
#4529570 - 09/29/17 04:49 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
FZ1 Offline


Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4727
Loc: Texas
I like it. Thanks,man.

Top
#4529746 - 09/29/17 07:36 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
Ihatetochangeoil Offline


Registered: 10/28/14
Posts: 580
Loc: On the road Midwest
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Here are the samples of the same oil (Toyota 5w30) from different OCIs and different duty cycles in the same engine.
-Sample on the very left is a brand new oil.
-Next one to the right has 10k kilometers (6200 miles) and 294 hours of mixed driving.
-Third sample has 16k kilometers (10k miles) and 307 hours of highway cruising.
-The darkest sample on the right has ONLY 8.5K kilometers (5.3K miles) and 354 hours of city traffic with idling and stop&go.

Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.




This is useless. Assuming there are no obvious mechanical problems with the engine (like a head gasket leaking antifreeze into the oil), the only thing that can be determined by the color of the oil is the color of the oil. I have a UOA on this oil:

Would anyone care to guess at the TBN, wear metals, Iron ppm, viscosity, miles, ISO 4406 particle count, etc?

This oil has over 8K on it and test lab results are "suitable for continued use." All parameters normal from the test lab.

The color of the oil reveals NOTHING except the color of the oil. I have sent in previous samples that "looked nicely honey colored" and were contaminated with coolant. (High Potassium ppm). It is my opinion that UOA has saved more than one engine for me. There isn't a Mr. Goodwrench mechanic in the nation who could have looked at my oil on the dipstick and said "Gee, Mister, 446 ppm Potassium, you've got a coolant leak."
_________________________

2003 Lesabre
2004 Lesabre
2004 Impala
If ur NOT doing UOA then you're throwing away good oil or your engine is already damaged. Choose.

Top
#4529757 - 09/29/17 07:42 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Ihatetochangeoil]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39927
Loc: 'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Ihatetochangeoil
The color of the oil reveals NOTHING except the color of the oil.


Quoted for truth...

I sponsored a thesis on optical patch colorimetry on turbine oils a few years ago.

With that, t-you take the oil, thin it with solvents, run it through a 0.5um filter paper, wash the oil residue out with a non polar solvent, and then compare the colour on the patch with a reference of virgin oil...yes, it tracks varnish and oxidation pretty well...if we could have done it with a test-tube, clearly industry would have developed that instead.

Top
#4529764 - 09/29/17 07:47 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Ihatetochangeoil]
bbhero Online   content


Registered: 03/20/15
Posts: 4632
Loc: Virginia
If it never ever changed color or went black instantly then it would have zero meaning. I bet dollars to donuts if you pulled the stick out of a car you were thinking of buying and it was jet black it would make you go hmmmm. Then you open up the oil cap to see what or if you could see into that.
Color is not definitive that is very true. But it does change with time and type of use. And by this we can see at least if it's jet black or golden brown, or translucent. If some cat swears the just changed it on a gasoline motor and it is jet black we'd know they are full of number two. This would have us question if they were telling the truth about them saying it was maintained well by them. When I went 11k miles on my Castrol Syntec in my old Sentra it was just about jet black. Unlike the usual slightly dark brown it was when I normally changed it at 4500 miles.
_________________________
Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic 5w30 Federated Auto 4612ex
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."

Top
#4529776 - 09/29/17 07:58 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
i_hate_autofraud Offline


Registered: 05/19/16
Posts: 706
Loc: Canada


" Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is."

Even on the longest OCIs I ever dared, the oil was never "used up", darkness in oil from a late model engines will
be all the various metals that wear off, in very old engines you can include soot and combustion by products. Some
additives did deplete, but not 80% like I thought, more like 20-40%!

Why?

Once I changed over to a pair of FilterMags and a bunch of other magnets on the spin-on oil filter my oil stays
clear for months and 9,000Kms / 5,500 miles before it even start to turn dark! Was I surprised!


FILTERMAG vs HOMEBREW
https://app.box.com/s/uxvu8dmscf5wcgftutdm0ejqwgn86tw7

Top
#4529788 - 09/29/17 08:10 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: i_hate_autofraud]
bbhero Online   content


Registered: 03/20/15
Posts: 4632
Loc: Virginia
I agree. A more in depth analysis is certainly needed to assess what the real condition the oil is truly in. Agree 100% on that. You can't tell TBN, viscosity at 100°C, what else is present in it has well by color. But it does change with time as well in a gas motor.


Edited by bbhero (09/29/17 08:10 PM)
_________________________
Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic 5w30 Federated Auto 4612ex
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."

Top
#4529810 - 09/29/17 08:40 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
PimTac Offline


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4338
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
Slightly off track but wouldn't it be something to have test strips much like blood glucose strips that would test for TBN, fuel, oxidation, etc? Maybe they do have these but I am not aware of them.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


Top
#4529856 - 09/29/17 09:31 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: PimTac]
bbhero Online   content


Registered: 03/20/15
Posts: 4632
Loc: Virginia
I have wondered about that as well PimTac.
_________________________
Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic 5w30 Federated Auto 4612ex
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."

Top
#4529878 - 09/29/17 10:06 PM Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator]
Ammofirst Offline


Registered: 06/22/17
Posts: 353
Loc: Western usa
“Nothing” ?

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >