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Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment #4529449
09/29/17 02:17 PM
09/29/17 02:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 800
NC
Vladiator Offline OP
Vladiator  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 800
NC
Here are the samples of the same oil (Toyota 5w30) from different OCIs and different duty cycles in the same engine.
-Sample on the very left is a brand new oil.
-Next one to the right has 10k kilometers (6200 miles) and 294 hours of mixed driving.
-Third sample has 16k kilometers (10k miles) and 307 hours of highway cruising.
-The darkest sample on the right has ONLY 8.5K kilometers (5.3K miles) and 354 hours of city traffic with idling and stop&go.

Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.



Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529456
09/29/17 02:26 PM
09/29/17 02:26 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 30,416
NY
demarpaint Offline
demarpaint  Offline
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 30,416
NY
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.


God Bless Our Troops

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: demarpaint] #4529458
09/29/17 02:30 PM
09/29/17 02:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 800
NC
Vladiator Offline OP
Vladiator  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 800
NC
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.


Samples were taken in this order:
1) 6200 miles
2) 5300 miles
3) 10000 miles


2000 Lexus GS300-361k
1999 Lexus GS400-213k
2006 Toyota Camry-187k
2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid-125k
2009 Scion xB-120k
2013 VW Tiguan-120k
2009 Toyota Tacoma-60k
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529461
09/29/17 02:34 PM
09/29/17 02:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 30,416
NY
demarpaint Offline
demarpaint  Offline
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 30,416
NY
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Interesting, thanks for posting. The only flaw I see is the last sample is from the engine with over 21K miles more on it than it had when the first sample was taken. More wear, etc.


Samples were taken in this order:
1) 6200 miles
2) 5300 miles
3) 10000 miles



OK, but each time a sample was taken the engine had more miles and more wear on it. I'd also expect the oil with the most time on it and hardest use would be the worst, which the picture shows.


God Bless Our Troops

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529513
09/29/17 03:46 PM
09/29/17 03:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,862
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
kschachn  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,862
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.

So you can tell how "used up" it is by the color?


1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 400K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 271K
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529540
09/29/17 04:14 PM
09/29/17 04:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,319
texas
Burt Offline
Burt  Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,319
texas
Yep - hours is the biggest factor.


2011 RX350 53k miles
2015 Fiesta SFE eco-boost 25k miles
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529570
09/29/17 04:49 PM
09/29/17 04:49 PM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,727
Texas
FZ1 Offline
FZ1  Offline
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,727
Texas
I like it. Thanks,man.

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529746
09/29/17 07:36 PM
09/29/17 07:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 588
On the road Midwest
Ihatetochangeoil Offline
Ihatetochangeoil  Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 588
On the road Midwest
Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
Here are the samples of the same oil (Toyota 5w30) from different OCIs and different duty cycles in the same engine.
-Sample on the very left is a brand new oil.
-Next one to the right has 10k kilometers (6200 miles) and 294 hours of mixed driving.
-Third sample has 16k kilometers (10k miles) and 307 hours of highway cruising.
-The darkest sample on the right has ONLY 8.5K kilometers (5.3K miles) and 354 hours of city traffic with idling and stop&go.

Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is. Free visual oil analysis, so to say.




This is useless. Assuming there are no obvious mechanical problems with the engine (like a head gasket leaking antifreeze into the oil), the only thing that can be determined by the color of the oil is the color of the oil. I have a UOA on this oil:

Would anyone care to guess at the TBN, wear metals, Iron ppm, viscosity, miles, ISO 4406 particle count, etc?

This oil has over 8K on it and test lab results are "suitable for continued use." All parameters normal from the test lab.

The color of the oil reveals NOTHING except the color of the oil. I have sent in previous samples that "looked nicely honey colored" and were contaminated with coolant. (High Potassium ppm). It is my opinion that UOA has saved more than one engine for me. There isn't a Mr. Goodwrench mechanic in the nation who could have looked at my oil on the dipstick and said "Gee, Mister, 446 ppm Potassium, you've got a coolant leak."



2003 Lesabre
2004 Lesabre
2004 Impala
If ur NOT doing UOA then you're throwing away good oil or your engine is already damaged. Choose.
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Ihatetochangeoil] #4529757
09/29/17 07:42 PM
09/29/17 07:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,832
'Stralia
Shannow Online content
Shannow  Online Content
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,832
'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Ihatetochangeoil
The color of the oil reveals NOTHING except the color of the oil.


Quoted for truth...

I sponsored a thesis on optical patch colorimetry on turbine oils a few years ago.

With that, t-you take the oil, thin it with solvents, run it through a 0.5um filter paper, wash the oil residue out with a non polar solvent, and then compare the colour on the patch with a reference of virgin oil...yes, it tracks varnish and oxidation pretty well...if we could have done it with a test-tube, clearly industry would have developed that instead.

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Ihatetochangeoil] #4529764
09/29/17 07:47 PM
09/29/17 07:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
bbhero Online content
bbhero  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
If it never ever changed color or went black instantly then it would have zero meaning. I bet dollars to donuts if you pulled the stick out of a car you were thinking of buying and it was jet black it would make you go hmmmm. Then you open up the oil cap to see what or if you could see into that.
Color is not definitive that is very true. But it does change with time and type of use. And by this we can see at least if it's jet black or golden brown, or translucent. If some cat swears the just changed it on a gasoline motor and it is jet black we'd know they are full of number two. This would have us question if they were telling the truth about them saying it was maintained well by them. When I went 11k miles on my Castrol Syntec in my old Sentra it was just about jet black. Unlike the usual slightly dark brown it was when I normally changed it at 4500 miles.


Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe
Quaker State High Mileage 5w30 Purolator Boss 14610
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529776
09/29/17 07:58 PM
09/29/17 07:58 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 717
Canada
i_hate_autofraud Offline
i_hate_autofraud  Offline
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 717
Canada


" Of course a UOA would show a bigger picture, but oil color does give a good idea of how used up the oil is."

Even on the longest OCIs I ever dared, the oil was never "used up", darkness in oil from a late model engines will
be all the various metals that wear off, in very old engines you can include soot and combustion by products. Some
additives did deplete, but not 80% like I thought, more like 20-40%!

Why?

Once I changed over to a pair of FilterMags and a bunch of other magnets on the spin-on oil filter my oil stays
clear for months and 9,000Kms / 5,500 miles before it even start to turn dark! Was I surprised!


FILTERMAG vs HOMEBREW
https://app.box.com/s/uxvu8dmscf5wcgftutdm0ejqwgn86tw7

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: i_hate_autofraud] #4529788
09/29/17 08:10 PM
09/29/17 08:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
bbhero Online content
bbhero  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
I agree. A more in depth analysis is certainly needed to assess what the real condition the oil is truly in. Agree 100% on that. You can't tell TBN, viscosity at 100°C, what else is present in it has well by color. But it does change with time as well in a gas motor.

Last edited by bbhero; 09/29/17 08:10 PM.

Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe
Quaker State High Mileage 5w30 Purolator Boss 14610
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529810
09/29/17 08:40 PM
09/29/17 08:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,370
Soviet State of Washington
PimTac Offline
PimTac  Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,370
Soviet State of Washington
Slightly off track but wouldn't it be something to have test strips much like blood glucose strips that would test for TBN, fuel, oxidation, etc? Maybe they do have these but I am not aware of them.


2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter

Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: PimTac] #4529856
09/29/17 09:31 PM
09/29/17 09:31 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
bbhero Online content
bbhero  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,018
Virginia
I have wondered about that as well PimTac.


Nissan Altima 3.5 Coupe
Quaker State High Mileage 5w30 Purolator Boss 14610
"Treat your family like your friends and treat your friends like your family."
Re: Miles vs Hours: visual oil experiment [Re: Vladiator] #4529878
09/29/17 10:06 PM
09/29/17 10:06 PM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 388
Western usa
Ammofirst Offline
Ammofirst  Offline
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 388
Western usa
“Nothing” ?

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