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Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable #4521530
09/20/17 06:24 PM
09/20/17 06:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 398
Mississippi
Speak2Mountain Offline OP
Speak2Mountain  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 398
Mississippi
What happened?
Much rather buy an American, Japanese, or Korean vehicle

Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521543
09/20/17 06:36 PM
09/20/17 06:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,245
NJ
Leo99 Offline
Leo99  Offline
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,245
NJ
When were European cars known for reliability?


Without data you're just another person with an opinion. W. E. Deming

2003 Corolla 250,000 miles
2004 Rav4 359,000 miles
2015 Camry 59,000 miles
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521547
09/20/17 06:37 PM
09/20/17 06:37 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,002
OH
fdcg27 Offline
fdcg27  Offline
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,002
OH
What happened?
Toy creep and the advent of lowest bidder Chinese parts.
Nothing better than an old Benz or BMW. Have an old BMW and have had four old Mercedes. Great and mostly trouble free cars all.
Generally as reliable as hammers and about as easy to diagnose and fix.
Also owned an '81 Vanagon. Aside from the cracked heads after 100K or so that were a signature feature of the VW Type IV, that thing was also as reliable as any axe.
Italian and French cars always were always pretty dodgy, though.
Brit cars were usually mechanically robust but had endemic electrical, ignition and hydraulic problems, but these were usually easy and cheap to fix. Daily drove an MGB for many miles with no regrets back in the day.
As technically neat as they were, only a masochist would own a Citroen.


17 Forester 12K MSS 0W-20
12 Accord LX 92K PP 5W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521558
09/20/17 06:43 PM
09/20/17 06:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Were French or Italian cars EVER worth buying?!??


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: fdcg27] #4521561
09/20/17 06:44 PM
09/20/17 06:44 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: fdcg27

Italian and French cars always were always pretty dodgy, though.


Hahaha! You beat me to it!


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521577
09/20/17 06:59 PM
09/20/17 06:59 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,441
Indiana
dlundblad Offline
dlundblad  Offline
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,441
Indiana
What cars are you having issues with OP?


03 Jeep WJ 4.0 200k Castrol Edge 10w40 HM Fram XG16
02 Volvo S60 2.4T 177k M1 0w40 Mahle OX149D
97 Chevy Blazer 4.3 149k Rotella T5 10w30 Supertech ST3980

Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521625
09/20/17 08:16 PM
09/20/17 08:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,516
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,516
Marshfield , MA
England is damp and dark. Lucas and Maretti, the Italian version. Gotta be the most mickey mouse ignition and electrics ever made. You would think they would make cars easier to start in damp weather. US cars are cheapest heeps going but they mostly ran. Bugs built VW into the colossus it is today. Volvos and SAABs If you were in W Germany or Sweden, you had Bosch and Beru , good stuff in the day. Good as Delco or Autolite. It is a shame because I really like English and Italian styling. Jaguars, even some of the newer models are sexy. Old Alfas are nice. Ferraris Have good lines but are flawed by imperfect rendering and they don't age well.


'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521627
09/20/17 08:24 PM
09/20/17 08:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,736
North Carolina
rooflessVW Online content
rooflessVW  Online Content
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,736
North Carolina
When were European cars known for reliability?

Mercedes, yes. They were tanks that didn't need much attention, however when they did they weren't cheap!

The Scandinavians made some fine automobiles. Still do. Not without their quirks, though.

As far as I can tell, the "old European cars were more reliable" meme comes from a combination of looking towards the past with rose colored glasses and knowing now, 30 years later, how to permanently fix common problems.

When you said European, what did you mean? Because I don't think anything British, French, Italian, or from the CCCP has ever been considered reliable.


"Zed's dead baby, Zed's dead."
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521631
09/20/17 08:26 PM
09/20/17 08:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,799
USA
slacktide_bitog Online content
slacktide_bitog  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,799
USA
the only reliable European car I can think of is the Volvo 240 LOL

Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521635
09/20/17 08:28 PM
09/20/17 08:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,968
IL
Vern_in_IL Offline
Vern_in_IL  Offline
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,968
IL
Euro cars are ALL ABOUT performance and luxury.......not reliability.

Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521659
09/20/17 08:59 PM
09/20/17 08:59 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,491
DELAWARE
Hootbro Offline
Hootbro  Offline
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,491
DELAWARE
In the 1980's, a Mercedes diesel sedan was something to cherish and pass down to your kids. Today, it is a lease only deal if at all.


2018 RAM 2500 Cummins 6.7L (Factory Fill 5W-40)
2017 Jeep Renegade 2.4L (Idemitsu 0W-20)

Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Vern_in_IL] #4521665
09/20/17 09:03 PM
09/20/17 09:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
B320i Offline
B320i  Offline
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 488
Australia
Originally Posted By: Vern_in_IL
Euro cars are ALL ABOUT performance and luxury.......not reliability.

In the 1990s, BMW produced a lot of very basic models as daily beaters. Take the 316i, 320i, 518i and 520i as examples. All with small 4cyl or 6cyl power-plants that have certainly stood the test of time.
I feel the 90s was the pinnacle of BMW. Nowadays they're just Black Plastic [censored] like everything else. Those older ones are relatively easy to repair, spares are plentiful and they'll certainly go the distance, in relative comfort too.

If you want to call my 1993 "unreliable," you better have a good excuse as to why a heater hose that lasted 24yrs before painting the roads green is unreliable grin

Now, there are some spectacular examples of unreliability in the European world. Some of the cheapest Mercedes in the 90s and 2000s were made in Mexico or East Europe, and were nasty little pieces of junk. There were others, too, but I haven't heard of them.

Australia's contribution to the "performance and luxury ..... not reliability" category was probably the Leyland P76. Actually, scratch the performance. Some bonehead from Leyland ruined the aerodynamics of the car.


'93 BMW 320i 217,000km - Valvoline Engine-Armour 15w40, Mann Filter.
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: rooflessVW] #4521667
09/20/17 09:06 PM
09/20/17 09:06 PM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,657
Canada
camrydriver111 Offline
camrydriver111  Offline
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,657
Canada
Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
As far as I can tell, the "old European cars were more reliable" meme comes from a combination of looking towards the past with rose colored glasses and knowing now, 30 years later, how to permanently fix common problems.


I agree that there is a bit of rose colored glasses going on.

They are not like a modern Corolla where you can just put in gas, change the oil, and chinese rotors once in a while.


BITOG or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Extended OCI
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: Speak2Mountain] #4521668
09/20/17 09:07 PM
09/20/17 09:07 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,364
Flaherty, KY
92saturnsl2 Offline
92saturnsl2  Offline
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,364
Flaherty, KY
I've only owned two cars of a European make-- a 2001 VW Jetta GLX and a 2000 Land Rover Discovery II. I wish I had both back, even though they required frequent repairs. The former, I had too many people jump in at night and ask if it were a BMW (the fit and finish was that good) for that too be a fluke. And it just drove [censored] good. The Discovery? Best 4wd off-road vehicle I've had hands down. Sure, if you didn't see oil on the driveway, that meant there was none in it, but that was part of the fun. Had to take wrench to it every couple of months, but honestly these were FUN cars to drive. I miss that in today's cookie-cutter vehicles.


1985 F-250HD 7.5L 4x4 135k- Maxlife 15w-40 HDEO
04 Odyssey EX 182k PUP 0w-40
96 Maxima GLE 250k QS Defy 5w-30
07 Chrysler Pacifica Limited 129k PUP 5w-40
Re: Euro Cars Used to be Very Reliable [Re: 92saturnsl2] #4521681
09/20/17 09:27 PM
09/20/17 09:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 384
California
Billbert Offline
Billbert  Offline
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 384
California
When I was a teenager, there was a British specialty repair shop that had a very large sign on the back wall which stated 'The brits drink warm beer because lucas makes refrigerators'


If you think you can, or if you think you can't, You are probably right.

Auto Instructor / ASE Master Tech
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