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How to get that new car brake pedal feel? #4519241
09/18/17 07:47 AM
09/18/17 07:47 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 460
Australia
Spetz Offline OP
Spetz  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 460
Australia
Hi guys,

With new cars the brake pedal bites instantly.
I've done a brake bleed on a couple of my cars but there is still about an inch of travel before the brakes bite.

I've driven a friend's old car that had that instant bite to the brake pedal.

The only thing I can think of is either some parts go soft (lines etc) or that the factory does a power brake bleed and that's what it takes to get rid of any and all air bubbles?


2003 Mitsubishi Diamante 6G74 3.5L. 5 Speed auto. 155,000 miles. Shell Helix Ultra 5W40 at 6k OCI
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519245
09/18/17 07:50 AM
09/18/17 07:50 AM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,481
Ontario, Canada
mightymousetech Offline
mightymousetech  Offline
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,481
Ontario, Canada
That is usually caused by tapered wear on the pads. Take a look at them. Only fix is new pads.


Mighty Mouse Tech
BMW Tech, Former Acura Tech
2010 Civic Si Castrol 0W40, Redline MTL
2013 BMW 135i M Sport Edition Castrol 0W40, Redline MTL
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519250
09/18/17 07:53 AM
09/18/17 07:53 AM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,976
Onondaga County
Miller88 Offline
Miller88  Offline
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,976
Onondaga County
Does the vehicle have rear drums? I've seen that a lot with maladjusted rear drums.


18 Forester 2.5I 6M
00 Jeep Cherokee
01 Ford F-350 XL 4x4 5M
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519267
09/18/17 08:45 AM
09/18/17 08:45 AM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,824
Wisconsin
wallyuwl Offline
wallyuwl  Offline
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,824
Wisconsin
Yup, new fluid and new pads would take care of it. Even new pads can have a bit of travel if they are cheap ones. I just did a brake bleed and still had some travel. I replaced the new (but cheap) pads with better ones and now it brakes great.

Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519270
09/18/17 08:49 AM
09/18/17 08:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,534
Illinois
javacontour Offline
javacontour  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,534
Illinois
14-15 year old car and you are probably looking at replacing all hydraulic components. There is likely years of slack and wear in the system. Rubber lines give a bit more. Probably even wear on the pivot point of the pedal. A little wear at the top translates to more movement at the pedal.

I'd probably start with checking that everything is properly adjusted. I believe this car has rear disc brakes. Parking brake adjustment may still matter depending on how it is implemented.

After that's all confirmed, then any rubber hoses, which means bleeding the system again...

But perhaps the best solution is to adjust your expectations on a 14-15 year old car.


network down, IP packets delivered via UPS -BOFH
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519272
09/18/17 08:50 AM
09/18/17 08:50 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
Ducked  Offline
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Sounds good to me. Dragging brakes waste energy.

I dunno how fast your leg moves when braking (and couldn't find out when I had a quick Google) but I doubt the extra delay is significant.

I too would suspect drum brakes, more specifically automatic adjusters, which often aren't automatic and often don't adjust.

Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519273
09/18/17 08:51 AM
09/18/17 08:51 AM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 318
NC
fenixguy Offline
fenixguy  Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 318
NC
I just replaced the front rotors and pads on the '08 CR-V. They were spongy before but stopped fine. Now, they'll throw you through the window if you're not careful. I've never done a brake job that made this kind of difference. The rotors were Wagner E-coated and the pads were Wagner ThermoQuiet ceramics. I noticed the old rotors had quite a bit of lip from where they were worn (why I replaced them) so the new rotors are somewhat thicker. I don't know if the brand makes a difference, but Wagner might've gained a loyal customer.


'16 Frontier SV 4x4-PP/Nissan OEM
'08 CR-V EX AWD-Valvoline Syn MaxLife/Fram TG
'01 Civic EX-Valvoline Syn MaxLife/Fram UG
'00 Civic LX-PYB/Fram UG
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519283
09/18/17 09:03 AM
09/18/17 09:03 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
OneEyeJack Offline
OneEyeJack  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
My complaint on my 84 Civic was a brake pedal that was getting just a little soft. I already had good pads and shoes and braided steel brake lines. I replaced the master cylinder and that fixed it.

I do have one question about braided steel brake lines. As I understand it, if they are not an OEM part they are not DOT approved. Is the fact that a replacement is not DOT approved ever a problem?

Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519297
09/18/17 09:33 AM
09/18/17 09:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,918
Florida, Cape Coral
Eddie Offline
Eddie  Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,918
Florida, Cape Coral
When I worked at a Porsche dealer we always vacuum degassed brake fluid before using. Amazing how much air is trapped in the fluid that can't be seen. I suspect that many or most new car manufactures do the vacuum degas on brake and PS fluids.


CX5 Touring 2.5L :-)
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: OneEyeJack] #4519315
09/18/17 10:00 AM
09/18/17 10:00 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,534
Illinois
javacontour Offline
javacontour  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 10,534
Illinois
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
My complaint on my 84 Civic was a brake pedal that was getting just a little soft. I already had good pads and shoes and braided steel brake lines. I replaced the master cylinder and that fixed it.

I do have one question about braided steel brake lines. As I understand it, if they are not an OEM part they are not DOT approved. Is the fact that a replacement is not DOT approved ever a problem?


If you were in an accident, it might come up if someone wants to claim it's the reason you hit another person, couldn't avoid the accident, etc.

It goes without saying that if they are poor quality and fail....


network down, IP packets delivered via UPS -BOFH
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519328
09/18/17 10:11 AM
09/18/17 10:11 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,417
The Northeast
mclasser Offline
mclasser  Offline
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,417
The Northeast
I've tagged this interesting thread for later.


2018 Hyundai Elantra VE -- 6K
2013 Honda Pilot EX-L 4WD -- 57K
2002 Honda Accord EX-L -- 212K

Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519335
09/18/17 10:15 AM
09/18/17 10:15 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,283
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,283
N.H, U.S.A.
Glaze can cause poor bite: I like to hacksaw grooves in my pads to allow gas to escape.
NO! Not THAT gas, The pads on the car!

But it depends..


2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#10 47272mi-QSUD10W30+5w20 Toughguard Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519337
09/18/17 10:16 AM
09/18/17 10:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 345
Ohio
Dorian Offline
Dorian  Offline
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 345
Ohio
I really like my Wagner E coated rotors and ceramic pads as well. The 99 still has a light and spongy brake pedal though. I have noticed that they are not smooth when you come to a complete stop when it is cold out. It takes a bit of getting use to.


15 Camry Hybrid SE 48K 0W20 Kendall bulk
14.5 Camry SE 2AR 0W20 M1 AFE 44K (Mom's)
98 Chevy Prizm 1ZZ M1 AFE 0W30 148K (Brother's)
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519502
09/18/17 02:05 PM
09/18/17 02:05 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,993
Chicago, IL
Brybo86 Offline
Brybo86  Offline
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,993
Chicago, IL
My thoughts are that
Brake pads with the rubber integrated shims need to compress slightly before grabbing so there is a bit of travel.
Old rubber brake lines flex a little when the pedal is pushed

Some air in lines.

If you are bleeding DO NOT shake the bottle of brake fluid! It introduces little tiny Bubbles into the fluid which then goes into your brake lines.

Just like a can of polyurethane varnish. You stir, not shake them.


08 Honda Accord EX-L 2.4L M1 EP 0w20 145k
01 Kymco People 50
95 Lexus LS400 M1 AFE 0w30 193k
95 Yamaha Jog
Re: How to get that new car brake pedal feel? [Re: Spetz] #4519529
09/18/17 02:43 PM
09/18/17 02:43 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,802
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,802
Marshfield , MA
The more new brake fluid, the harder the pedal it seems. Used 2 qts when I replaced all the Rat's hard lines, hoses and a bunch of other brake parts. About a pint a corner. Gravity bleed takes time, but it proves your work. grin2


'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2

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