Phantom Vehicles in Canada?

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http://www.autotrader.ca/newsfeatures/20...antom-vehicles/

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...You may have noticed the rise of this in the last five years or so. Come up behind a newer car or truck on the highway at night and the back of the vehicle is dark. Pass them and the dash is lit up like the sun and there is just enough light coming from the headlights to look like they're on... The driver has no idea that their headlights aren't on and that they have no light showing behind them. These "phantom vehicles" are dangerous. And they're a growing problem.

...Transport Canada is acting on the many complaints they've received about these vehicles. "The vehicle's illuminated dashboard can give the driver a false sense that their outside lights are activated, when they are not. The department has received a continuous high influx of letters from the driving public raising concerns about the increasing amount of phantom vehicles on the roads."

Early last year, Transport Canada issued proposed regulations that required manufacturers to make sure that the taillights would be on if the automatic dash lights were on or to have automatic head and taillights on all vehicles. Automakers were given 75 days to comment on those regulations, but they could not come to a consensus and the final regulations were delayed. The final rules should arrive this fall, with compliance due September 1, 2020.

Why the delay from automakers? According to the TC memo, automakers "have requested that Transport Canada include new alternative testing requirements for complex advanced lighting systems." Automakers want new rules for LED, HID, and even fibre optic or laser lighting systems, and are using this opportunity to get them….
 
If the car has Bluetooth, just have the car lights connected to the cell phone screen light. How is someone supposed to drive at night without being able to check how many responses they got on that picture of their mediocre dinner if their cell phone doesn't light up?! Sheesh! Rant over.......maybe
 
I blame the manufacturers.

Many of these cars have LED gauges that are constantly lit the same whether the lights are on or not. My mom's 2011 Fit is a perfect example. The dash is the same brightness with headlights on vs. lights off. Add in day time running lights and you further confuse people because they can see that lights are on in front of them at night. I probably see about one of these phantoms a day.
 
This time of year is when I notice a lot of people driving at dusk without their headlights on. However, all year long I can usually find 1 car on every outing that drives without headlights.

People can be oblivious man.
 
The automakers should also make the headlights turn on automatically any time the windshield wipers are turned on. I can't stand how many people drive in pouring rain with no headlights on!
 
I see quite a lot of these phantom cars on regular basis. It was not the case when the dash light were directly tied to the outside lighting.

I'm not some old geezer that is afraid of new technologies, but this is a perfect example of a new technology creating a problem and the proposed solution is to add even more complex technology.
 
I've seen this too. How can people drive in the dark and not wonder why they can't see?

I've also seen a lot of newer Chryslers driving around with no running lights in the rear but, when I pass them, the headlights are indeed on. I foresee a recall.
 
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Blip the stalk to flash the high beams. If you see the blue light on the dash, then the head lights are on. When I drove Transits Connects, I drove with head lights on full time. One of the Rat's best features is the classic pull out head light switch.
 
Originally Posted By: andyd
Blip the stalk to flash the high beams. If you see the blue light on the dash, then the head lights are on. When I drove Transits Connects, I drove with head lights on full time. One of the Rat's best features is the classic pull out head light switch.

The blue light on the dash comes on anytime you flash the high beams, regardless if the headlights are on or not. At least it does on my cars.
 
Yes, this is epidemic. At least with the most recent chain of LED DRL's, it is obvious the headlights are not on. Older vehicles, with the high beams as the DRL's can certainly confuse people into thinking their lights are on.
 
It is hard to believe that folks drive without their lights on. I talk to OTR truck drivers from time to time and the stories that they tell about truly stupid drivers is scary.

We are at a point where daytime running lights aren't enough, full time lights when the vehicle is on will be the only fix for this. Default on every key cycle. Mandatory LED's front and rear to minimize the electrical load and for bulb longevity. Add a button to disable the lights if parked and still running but you have to be parked to activate the button.

That's my simple solution to the problem. People seem to have trouble thinking for themselves. Ain't technology grand!
 
I get it, your instrument lights are on and you have DRL's but that doesnt explain the rest of the dashboard lights and the maybe even the display for the radio. If i drive with no lights at night in my car, the instruments and head unit would blind me and I wouldnt be able to see any button for ac control at all.
 
Originally Posted By: Tdog02
It is hard to believe that folks drive without their lights on. I talk to OTR truck drivers from time to time and the stories that they tell about truly stupid drivers is scary.

We are at a point where daytime running lights aren't enough, full time lights when the vehicle is on will be the only fix for this. Default on every key cycle. Mandatory LED's front and rear to minimize the electrical load and for bulb longevity. Add a button to disable the lights if parked and still running but you have to be parked to activate the button.

That's my simple solution to the problem. People seem to have trouble thinking for themselves. Ain't technology grand!


That doesn't sound simple at all.

Simple would be eliminating LED gauge displays that are constantly 100% bright.
 
GM does this right. The switch always defaults to auto and the headlights come on with the wipers.
 
Originally Posted By: exranger06
The automakers should also make the headlights turn on automatically any time the windshield wipers are turned on. I can't stand how many people drive in pouring rain with no headlights on!


Some already do this. My Mercedes E-350 does this now, anytime the wipers go on, the headlights automatically go on.

I blame the clueless drivers though. They should notice that the symbol for their headlights aren't on when driving at night. It's still pretty bad now where I always see one or two cars that drive around in the city with their high beams on. You would think they'd notice the blue on their dash, but either they clueless or feel they can drive around with their high beams on and blind everyone. I told one lady to shut her high beams off when I was walking around and she told me she had them on because one of her low beams was out. Still not a reason to switch on high beams and blind everyone else because they can't be bothered to fix their low beam.
 
This situation was the result of the "Big 3" US automakers lobbying in Canada when Daytime Running Lamps were made mandatory in 1989. They argued that the necessary changes to the lighting system would add too much increased costs to their manufacturing with relation to the US-spec (USDM) and Canada-spec (CDM) cars which generally are made on the same line (whether the factory was in the US or Canada; at the time the Canada-US FTA was in effect; adding Mexico via NAFTA would come a few years later).

Essentially the lighting system was identical in both USDM and CDM markets with the addition of DRL for frontal lighting only.

European and Japanese makes, both of whom also had implemented DRL, were sometimes (but not always) different. Dash lighting could only be engaged with front /rear night lighting.

(On my 1990 Miata, engaging the dash lighting also engages the "courtesy lamps", which include tail lamps but not headlights. Since it has pop-up headlamps, it's never not obvious whether the headlamps are engaged or not but doing so requires another turn of the lighting stalk).

Over time the European and Japanese carmakers adopted the same system as North American carmakers, so that today there is no functional difference ... all makes can have dash lighting, DRLs engaged, at night without night-time headlights or tail lamps lit.

It's especially common in cities where outside illumination (street lamps, business lighting) can, to the driver, mask the fact that your outside lamps are not engaged. There is no feedback to alert inattentive drivers of the condition, as they can see essentially well enough not to notice. When such a vehicle leaves the city and travels on highways, the situation becomes especially dangerous.

Somewhat ironically, your head lamps do illuminate unlit vehicles just as they do unlit obstacles, but if you are running without night time lighting (DRLs only) you don't have enough illumination to see another vehicle doing the same thing you are.
 
I see this so often, often on Priuses and other "appliance" cars. DRLs on, but no headlights, or even if headlights are on, no tail-lights. Awful at night especially with dark silver cars. 90% of the time even if you flash your lights at them from behind multiple times they don't get it. Every car I've owned this isn't a problem because they either have fully automatic headlights, or the dash lights are off til you turn on headlights.
 
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
I blame the manufacturers.

Many of these cars have LED gauges that are constantly lit the same whether the lights are on or not. My mom's 2011 Fit is a perfect example. The dash is the same brightness with headlights on vs. lights off. Add in day time running lights and you further confuse people because they can see that lights are on in front of them at night. I probably see about one of these phantoms a day.


You generally cannot "see the lights are on in front of them" with DRLs, which by law are low-illumination (maximum brightness is specified in regulations for CDM market compliance) and not nearly the same brightness as headlamps, including low beams.

Also in Canada's implementation of DRLs, again at the request of the Big 3 automakers who chafed at the expense, and uniquely so, DRLs can be amber or white lighting. In many cars they only use the front turn signal lamps as DRLs. Another common implementation is they wire the high beams (because the regulations require DRLs to be aimed fully forward only) in parallel, which results in 6volts being applied to them, and does not light the lamp sufficiently to be used as night illumination.

The North American brands could easily implement unique lighting in current models, because the requirements for security (immobilization, etc) differ today between USDM and CDM. For about the last five years, the Body and Frame Computers are unique parts to each market, so the changes required are merely technical adjustments; the part numbers are already unique.

Automakers decided to go that route to reduce cross-border shopping. In most cases, there is no way to convert a Big 3 USDM market vehicle to CDM standards due to the different B&F Computers, which cannot be interchanged. To import a USDM vehicle to Canada, the vehicle must be converted to all CDM standards; this situation neatly insures that cannot happen. Transport Canada has a list of vehicles that can, and cannot, be converted. Most European and Japanese makes can, most Big 3 cannot.
 
Originally Posted By: dogememe
I see this so often, often on Priuses and other "appliance" cars. DRLs on, but no headlights, or even if headlights are on, no tail-lights. Awful at night especially with dark silver cars. 90% of the time even if you flash your lights at them from behind multiple times they don't get it. Every car I've owned this isn't a problem because they either have fully automatic headlights, or the dash lights are off til you turn on headlights.


With DRL's required here, I see this so often it is crazy. Every drive at night I will see many cars driving without headlights or taillights. Worst offenders are normally newer Honda Civics or various Hyundais.
 
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