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Back Spec oil weights. #4505180
09/02/17 07:26 AM
09/02/17 07:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 14,046
Illinois
tig1 Offline OP
tig1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 14,046
Illinois
Toyota and Honda back spec'd oil wt to 0-5-20 several years ago. Doesn't CAFE have effect on a current model year or does CAFE go back several years from the present? If only the current year, why back spec oil weights.


2007 Ford Fusion 236,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 62K
M1 0-20 EP
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and Valvoline LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505186
09/02/17 07:31 AM
09/02/17 07:31 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,933
'Stralia
Shannow Offline
Shannow  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,933
'Stralia
I've posted those rules before.

You could use the search function.

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505189
09/02/17 07:32 AM
09/02/17 07:32 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
HerrStig Offline
HerrStig  Offline
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
Beats me. Plenty of good 5W 30 around. My 08 Camry V6 manual indicates 5W 30 and I'm sticking with it.

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: Shannow] #4505207
09/02/17 07:54 AM
09/02/17 07:54 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 14,046
Illinois
tig1 Offline OP
tig1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 14,046
Illinois
Originally Posted By: Shannow
I've posted those rules before.

You could use the search function.


That doesn't help me. Refresh us. I've never had success doing that.

Last edited by tig1; 09/02/17 08:01 AM.

2007 Ford Fusion 236,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 62K
M1 0-20 EP
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and Valvoline LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505293
09/02/17 09:28 AM
09/02/17 09:28 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,428
VA
Gebo Offline
Gebo  Offline
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,428
VA
Tig1, I'm with you. I'll go back through Shannow's old posts and see if I can find it or us.

Last edited by Gebo; 09/02/17 09:28 AM.

'98 LEX LS400 280K
'02 4Runner 225K
'05 Lex LS430 85K
'06 Toyota Highlander 145K
'09 Lex IS350 85K
'07 Lex GX470 60K
Amsoil in all engines, transmissions and differentials

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505308
09/02/17 09:48 AM
09/02/17 09:48 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,428
VA
Gebo Offline
Gebo  Offline
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,428
VA
Oops, I give up. I forgot how many posts he has! frown


'98 LEX LS400 280K
'02 4Runner 225K
'05 Lex LS430 85K
'06 Toyota Highlander 145K
'09 Lex IS350 85K
'07 Lex GX470 60K
Amsoil in all engines, transmissions and differentials

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505314
09/02/17 09:55 AM
09/02/17 09:55 AM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
ndfergy Offline
ndfergy  Offline
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
Use Google search instead.

In this case try:

cafe site:bobistheoilguy.com


2015 Toyota Yaris 5spd Manual
Summer: Mobil Super 1000 10w30
Winter: Mobil Super 1000 5w30
OEM Filter
Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505363
09/02/17 10:27 AM
09/02/17 10:27 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,242
Dallas,Tx USA
aquariuscsm Offline
aquariuscsm  Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 19,242
Dallas,Tx USA
Originally Posted By: tig1
Toyota and Honda back spec'd oil wt to 0-5-20 several years ago. Doesn't CAFE have effect on a current model year or does CAFE go back several years from the present? If only the current year, why back spec oil weights.


I'm with tig on this one. That Acura oil chart confused me even more haha. 10W30-5W30 was the only spec at first,and said 20wts were "usable and acceptable". Now they all spec 20wts without the terms "usable and acceptable".

1. Did they figure out that 20wts control wear better?
2. Have oils excelled to the point that today's thin oils have a concoction of additives that don't rely on viscosity?
3. Is the movement to thinner oils purely CAFE?

Now I'm even more confused shocked2


1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Quaker State Ultimate Durability 10W30
2012 Honda Accord Coupe EX-L 2.4,auto,San Marino Red
Pennzoil Platinum 5W20

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: aquariuscsm] #4505400
09/02/17 10:51 AM
09/02/17 10:51 AM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 12,027
In the shop
53' Stude Offline
53' Stude  Offline
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 12,027
In the shop
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: tig1
Toyota and Honda back spec'd oil wt to 0-5-20 several years ago. Doesn't CAFE have effect on a current model year or does CAFE go back several years from the present? If only the current year, why back spec oil weights.


I'm with tig on this one. That Acura oil chart confused me even more haha. 10W30-5W30 was the only spec at first,and said 20wts were "usable and acceptable". Now they all spec 20wts without the terms "usable and acceptable".

1. Did they figure out that 20wts control wear better?
2. Have oils excelled to the point that today's thin oils have a concoction of additives that don't rely on viscosity?
3. Is the movement to thinner oils purely CAFE?

Now I'm even more confused shocked2


I believe it's CAFE

I'm fine running 5w and 10w30's in my Camry with no ill effects


09' Camry LE

ST 5w30 and TG 4386(filter on for second 5k run)
Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505438
09/02/17 11:47 AM
09/02/17 11:47 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 822
Ozark Mountains
callbay Offline
callbay  Offline
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 822
Ozark Mountains
It seems like I am hearing about more new vehicles are calling for 5-30 now.

I have run 5-30 in everything I have ever owned that called for 5-20 and no blown engines. A few I have run 5-40 in some and no problems either. 100reds of thousands of miles.

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505439
09/02/17 11:47 AM
09/02/17 11:47 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,224
Houston, TX
Coprolite Offline
Coprolite  Offline
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,224
Houston, TX
IIRC CAFE only matters for the current model year. As it is on average sold, I guess the definition of that would be most recent full model year?

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505455
09/02/17 12:12 PM
09/02/17 12:12 PM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
ndfergy Offline
ndfergy  Offline
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
Although I'm not literate on all the machinations of cafe credits, I agree, it seems kind of goofy to back spec oil recommendations if no monetary incentive is involved...or is there?

Here's a theory:
Since Toyota USA et al are separate entities within the corporate infrastructure they have their own set of rights, profits and liabilities to consider in determining their business model. Given that, at the dealer level profits could be increased if expenses are lowered. One way of doing that is to maximize bulk oil purchase to as few grades as possible.

To illustrate this, I requested an oil change with synthetic oil for my Yaris at the dealership back in 2015. They were prepared to put in 0W20 instead of the recommended 5W30. When asked why they claimed they only carry 0W20 synthetic.


2015 Toyota Yaris 5spd Manual
Summer: Mobil Super 1000 10w30
Winter: Mobil Super 1000 5w30
OEM Filter
Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: Coprolite] #4505726
09/02/17 06:04 PM
09/02/17 06:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,933
'Stralia
Shannow Offline
Shannow  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,933
'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Coprolite
IIRC CAFE only matters for the current model year. As it is on average sold, I guess the definition of that would be most recent full model year?


https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/2658661/Re:_CAFE_has_Little_to_do_with#Post2658661

Quote:
What are CAFE credits?

Manufacturers can earn CAFE “credits” to offset deficiencies in their CAFE performances. Specifically, when the average fuel economy of either the passenger car or light truck fleet for a particular model year exceeds the established standard, the manufacturer earns credits. The amount of credit a manufacturer earns is determined by multiplying the tenths of a mile per gallon that the manufacturer exceeded the CAFE standard in that model year by the amount of vehicles they manufactured in that model year. These credits can be applied to any three consecutive model years immediately prior to or subsequent to the model year in which the credits are earned. The credits earned and applied to the model years prior to the model year for which the credits are earned are termed “carry back” credits, while those applied to model years subsequent to the model year in which the credits are earned are known as “carry forward” credits. Failure to exercise carry forward credits within the three years immediately following the year in which they are earned will result in the forfeiture of those credits. Credits cannot be passed between manufacturers or between fleets, e.g., from domestic passenger cars to light trucks.


So yes, they can get credit for backspeccing...

Nice try 'though tig1...

Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: Shannow] #4505740
09/02/17 06:21 PM
09/02/17 06:21 PM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
ndfergy Offline
ndfergy  Offline
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 484
burlington ,ontario, canada
Thanks. Theory buster extraordinaire. I mean that in a good way smile


2015 Toyota Yaris 5spd Manual
Summer: Mobil Super 1000 10w30
Winter: Mobil Super 1000 5w30
OEM Filter
Re: Back Spec oil weights. [Re: tig1] #4505754
09/02/17 06:39 PM
09/02/17 06:39 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,517
USA
slacktide_bitog Offline
slacktide_bitog  Offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,517
USA
Toyota Canada even back spec'd the Mk4 Supra turbo 2JZ to 5w20 crzy LOL

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