Just had a tire balance with ZERO weight added

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Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. Hunter Road Force balance machine, so they may have re-mounted the tire on the wheel per the procedure.

Either way, I've heard about this happening, but only once, and never on one of my tires. Pretty awesome IMO!

Anyone had this happen on one of their tires?
 
Michelin are the greatest tires in the world.

No extra charge for dry rot......
 
I had the spare tire replaced on my 96' Silverado a few years ago. I had a brand new BFG Mud Terrain mounted (my brother's previous unused spare from his Jeep) and it took no weight either. I watched from inside Discount Tire when the tech balanced it and made a funny look on his face at the 0's.
 
It happens from time to time. Usually the higher quality, smaller sized tires is when you see it happen. It always makes me chuckle when I see the 0.0g on the Hunter. To make 100% sure ill spin the tire/rim 2 more times.
 
I had it happen years ago with one tire each on separate Corvettes. I always thought I should have bought a lottery ticket on those days...the stars were definitely in alignment.
 
The only time it happened to me was with a high-dollar set of Dunlops on a Saturn Ion Redline. Dunlop Sportmax II I think ? 2 of the tires could be road force balanced with zero weight, the other two with like .25 oz or something very small.

Then again, I had 4 Goodyear Wrangler RT/S LT for a Suburban: 3 of the tires exceeded the upper limit of 80 lbs of force and had to be returned, the last one was just in the limit. Of the next 3, 2 were bad. I seem to recall going back and forth exchanging tires and went through a total of 12 tires before all were good. They still felt like [censored]. I must say that Tire Rack came through for me- covered the total cost of replacement tires and labor with my installer. I can only guess that the factory had a bad batch and every one got shipped to Tire Rack. The original factory set of Firestone LT tires were pretty too. Next set were Michelin LT tires which were very smooth and perfect from the start. All of the tires came in at 6 lbs or less road force, which is supposed to be pretty good for LT tires. I was a lifelong customer of Goodyear until that happened: now I avoid them at all costs.
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. Hunter Road Force balance machine, so they may have re-mounted the tire on the wheel per the procedure.

Either way, I've heard about this happening, but only once, and never on one of my tires. Pretty awesome IMO!

Anyone had this happen on one of their tires?


Was this with only one tire or all 4?

I have Michelin MXV4 OE on my Altima and 2 of them have at least 7 wgts on them. I was kind'a shocked. However, they're all nice & smooth!
 
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I had that one time too. A thirty years old 13 inch Speedline alloy wheels from a scrapyard (Renault three stud fitment) and a set of who knows what tyres but, they couldn't be premium as at 18 I was broke and had other priorities. Two balanced zero, two only small weight added. Wheels from that age were great.
 
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Was this with only one tire or all 4?

Just one.
 
Originally Posted By: chrisri
I had that one time too. A thirty years old 13 inch Speedline alloy wheels from a scrapyard (Renault three stud fitment) and a set of who knows what tyres but, they couldn't be premium as at 18 I was broke and had other priorities. Two balanced zero, two only small weight added. Wheels from that age were great.

Yeah, this is one of the many reasons it's such a shame that wheels have gotten so huge in recent years.

What surprised me about my case is that it's a 19" wheel. It's forged, so it's very light for its size, but still huge and heavier than those smaller rims would be. Quite a bit tougher to get everything right with so much more size and mass.
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: chrisri
I had that one time too. A thirty years old 13 inch Speedline alloy wheels from a scrapyard (Renault three stud fitment) and a set of who knows what tyres but, they couldn't be premium as at 18 I was broke and had other priorities. Two balanced zero, two only small weight added. Wheels from that age were great.

Yeah, this is one of the many reasons it's such a shame that wheels have gotten so huge in recent years.

What surprised me about my case is that it's a 19" wheel. It's forged, so it's very light for its size, but still huge and heavier than those smaller rims would be. Quite a bit tougher to get everything right with so much more size and mass.


What brand balancing machine was used?

A RoadForce brand machine can tell the operator to move the tire position on the rim and balance with less weight.

New car tires are mostly all balanced using a RoadForce machine.
 
I've got mixed feelings about bigger rims. On the one hand you get better cornering because the tire is lower profile, but man are 17" tires pricey.

I don't like cars that go past 18". Expensive and impractical for a street car.

Saw a Camaro driven by an African-American in town. It was lifted on what must have been 35" or more wheels. Why a person would choose to spend thousands to ruin the ride and handling characteristics of their car I don't know.

My other chief complaint is I'll see cars on giant rims out in front of a run down trailer with a gaggle of kids running around. You'd think they would spend those thousands on improving their families situation.
 
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Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: chrisri
I had that one time too. A thirty years old 13 inch Speedline alloy wheels from a scrapyard (Renault three stud fitment) and a set of who knows what tyres but, they couldn't be premium as at 18 I was broke and had other priorities. Two balanced zero, two only small weight added. Wheels from that age were great.

Yeah, this is one of the many reasons it's such a shame that wheels have gotten so huge in recent years.

What surprised me about my case is that it's a 19" wheel. It's forged, so it's very light for its size, but still huge and heavier than those smaller rims would be. Quite a bit tougher to get everything right with so much more size and mass.

Actually with 19 wheels you are in better position (generally speaking) than with 17s or even 18s. With 19 size most are HQ forged types, simply because cast would be a tonne heavy. 17 and 18 are usually cast except maybe some high end cars.
Still even with forged wheel most of the mass is farther away from the wheel centre compared to the small sizes. Centrifugal force comes into play, especially on small compacts that aren't really mechanically engineered for such a wheels. Except for the massive arches that needs to be filled.
 
I have occasionally come across tires needing no weights. Mostly upmarket ones, but some budget ones too. Kind of like getting a winning lotto ticket, most unlikely to be yours, but happens all the time.

Claud.
 
Veering off a bit, but........

Why can't all 4 tires and all 4 wheels be balanced on their own THEN matched to make 4 mounted tires using as little weight as possible?

Don't yell at me. I know the answer is that I created 12 balancing tasks where 4 did the job before and necessitated the need for a jig which holds unmounted tires.

But hey, if lead is so deadly....????
 
Originally Posted By: Donald
What brand balancing machine was used?

A RoadForce brand machine can tell the operator to move the tire position on the rim and balance with less weight.

New car tires are mostly all balanced using a RoadForce machine.


Donald, I'm not trying to pick on you, but this post is mostly wrong.

RoadForce is about uniformity (Think runout and you'll be really close!) It has nothing to do with balance.

Rotating the tire relative to the wheel reduces the amount of non-uniformity of the assembly. It only affects the amount of balance weight needed because those 2 components are now in a different position relative to each other - and while the weight needed to balance each component separately remains the same, they add or subtract the amount of weight needed depending on their relative position.

Further, OE tires and wheels - as the come on a new vehicle from the factory - are marked by each supplier for uniformity (not balance), and matched up in the vehicle assembly plant - THEN balanced. The machines used to measure uniformity are in the supplier's factory. Those suppliers also have a balance machine (a separate machine) - and there are specs for both properties. There is also a balance machine in the vehicle assembly plant - BUT - I am not aware of any vehicle manufacturer using a uniformity machine at the assembly plant level. If a vehicle manufacturer has a uniformity machine, it will be in their R&D center. Last time I checked, production level uniformity machines cost $600K - probably a million, now - and while they also probably have a Hunter GSP9700 RoadForce machine at their ride evaluation center - and maybe at the factory garage - they don't have them as part of the assembly line - Too slow!
 
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Originally Posted By: Donald
What brand balancing machine was used?

A RoadForce brand machine can tell the operator to move the tire position on the rim and balance with less weight.

New car tires are mostly all balanced using a RoadForce machine.

Covered all this in the first post. :]
 
Originally Posted By: SilverFusion2010
I've got mixed feelings about bigger rims. On the one hand you get better cornering because the tire is lower profile, but man are 17" tires pricey.

AFAIK:

A bigger wheel with a lower profile tire CAN improve cornering, but only in one respect: less sidewall movement, making things slightly sharper and more consistent. But that's only all else equal. A bigger wheel needs to be more rigid or it'll flex, and it needs to be lighter or you'll get gyro effects and all the other problems with unsprung rotating mass. Needless to say, a bigger wheel with the right strength and weight vs. a smaller one gets awfully expensive.

A stiffer tire sidewall can give you all the rigidity you need while letting you run a smaller rim. So, in the abstract, there are only two reasons for a bigger wheel:

1. Clearance for bigger brakes, and
2. Looks.

Of course, it's now getting to the point that the best tires only come in large sizes. Tire selection for small sizes is really starting to suck. Bit of a vicious cycle.

IMO, with VERY few exceptions:

- If a passenger vehicle needs wheels bigger than 17" to look right, it's too big; and
- If it needs brakes that wouldn't fit under a 17" wheel, it's too heavy.
 
Originally Posted By: Kira
Veering off a bit, but........

Why can't all 4 tires and all 4 wheels be balanced on their own THEN matched to make 4 mounted tires using as little weight as possible?

Isn't that more or less what already happens?
 
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