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Shell vs Sunoco #4495199
08/22/17 12:58 PM
08/22/17 12:58 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
Ursatdx Offline OP
Ursatdx  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
I was hoping someone might chime in and help me compare these two Brands of oil.
Shell Conventional vs Sunoco Ultra Synthetic Blend
Thanks for any help,
TDX


Sunoco Ultra Synthetic Blend

Product Code 5903 5913 5923
SAE J300 Vis Grade 5W-20 5W-30 10W-30
Viscosity, cSt @ 100 C 8.5 10.8 10.8
Viscosity, cSt @ 40 C 47 67 68
Viscosity, CCS, cP @ -30C6,200 (-30) 6,000 (-30) 4,500 (-25)
Viscosity Index 150 160 150
Flash Point, C 200 200 200
Pour Point, C -41 -41 -45
NOACK, wt.% 14.5 14.5 14.5
HT/HS, cP @150C 2.6 3.0 3.0
Density 7.16 7.17 7.25
Specific Gravity, 15.6C .86 .84 .85



Formula Shell Conventional
TEST TYPICAL RESULTS
SAE Viscosity Grade 5W-20 5W-30 10W-30
API Gravity 33.01 33.08 30.68
Viscosity, cSt, 40C 47.33 62.87 69.05
Viscosity, cSt, 100C 8.4 10.61 10.42
Flash Point, C 227 225 228
Pour Point, C -48 -38 -43
CCS Viscosity, cP (C) 5,350 (-30C) 5,820 (-30C) 6,100 (-25C)
MRV Viscosity, cP (C) 15,710 (-35C) 22,100 (-35C) 19,500 (-30C)

Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Ursatdx] #4495221
08/22/17 01:25 PM
08/22/17 01:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
I gotta say that those Sunoco oils aren't knocking my socks off based on the test results given...14.5% NOACK loss is right on the edge of the API SN limit and does not meet dexos1 requirements. 200C flashpoint is quite low and it's strange that they're all the same, maybe they're just guaranteeing >200C for the line?

Too bad NOACK is not given for the Shell conventional for a better comparison across the board.


2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Ursatdx] #4495227
08/22/17 01:31 PM
08/22/17 01:31 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,189
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,189
N.H, U.S.A.
Man, Id use FS all day over Sunoco.

SUN OIL just start marketing oil again? I don't recall seeing any on market for well over a decade. Bet you a beer they don't package their oil.


2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter
Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: ARCOgraphite] #4495294
08/22/17 02:40 PM
08/22/17 02:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
Ursatdx Offline OP
Ursatdx  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
Thoughts on Mobil Special? I move a lot of oil. Bulk and cased goods. Shell prices have increased dramatically over the last few years. I guess they (SOPUS) prefers to sell Pennz/QS. Do not want to install a sub par engine oil but the price forces me to, at the least, compare products. A bit of research tells me the NOACK% is very important. I saw Formula Shell at 14.3% but the numbers were from 2008.
Thanks again for the replies. It is very helpful for me in my decision making process.

Mobil Special 5W-20 5W-30* 10W-30*
API Service Classification SN SN SN
Gravity, API 33.1 33.0 31.3
Specific Gravity 0.8596 0.8600 0.8692
Pour Point, C (F ) -36(-33) -36(-33) -33(-27)
Flash PointC (F)ASTMD92 224(435) 220(428) 220(428)
Viscosity
cSt at 40C 49.2 60.42 69.4
cSt at 100C 8.6 10.2 10.6
CCS, cP [email protected] C [email protected] C [email protected] C
MRV, cP 26,[email protected] C 29,[email protected] 19,[email protected] C
Viscosity Index 153 157 141
Resource Conserving YES YES YES

Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Ursatdx] #4495308
08/22/17 03:05 PM
08/22/17 03:05 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
The PQIA looked at the Mobil Special 5W30 a couple of years ago and the NOACK loss was nothing special at 14.4%...I would guess that a lot of conventional SN oils are just under 15%.
http://www.pqiadata.org/MobilSpecial5W30.html
Between the Mobil and Shell oils, I'd probably just pick the cheaper one...I guess Shell might have slightly more impressive results for the specs shown. I noticed that the Mobil 5W30 has a modest dose of moly and no boron while the PQIA shows the Shell 10W30 has healthy doses of both, but they don't have identical grades to compare head to head. The Mobil 5W30 has a strong virgin TBN of 8.6 if stretching OCIs might be a concern.


2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Virtus_Probi] #4495431
08/22/17 05:36 PM
08/22/17 05:36 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
Ursatdx Offline OP
Ursatdx  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 153
New Jersey
Thanks VP for the PQIA website.
Great way to compare different brands.
Appreciate all the responses.



Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
The PQIA looked at the Mobil Special 5W30 a couple of years ago and the NOACK loss was nothing special at 14.4%...I would guess that a lot of conventional SN oils are just under 15%.
http://www.pqiadata.org/MobilSpecial5W30.html
Between the Mobil and Shell oils, I'd probably just pick the cheaper one...I guess Shell might have slightly more impressive results for the specs shown. I noticed that the Mobil 5W30 has a modest dose of moly and no boron while the PQIA shows the Shell 10W30 has healthy doses of both, but they don't have identical grades to compare head to head. The Mobil 5W30 has a strong virgin TBN of 8.6 if stretching OCIs might be a concern.

Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Ursatdx] #4495437
08/22/17 05:40 PM
08/22/17 05:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Originally Posted By: Ursatdx
Thanks VP for the PQIA website.
Great way to compare different brands.
Appreciate all the responses.


You are welcome, glad to be of help!

The Russian Oil Club has a lot of very detailed VOAs with NOACK loss and cold cranking results, too, seems like kind of a weird source but they match up well with other published numbers when a direct comparison is possible. May not be the best place to look for US conventional oils, though.


2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Ursatdx] #4495641
08/22/17 09:50 PM
08/22/17 09:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,409
San Antonio, TX
Nyogtha Offline
Nyogtha  Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 2,409
San Antonio, TX
Originally Posted By: Ursatdx
Thoughts on Mobil Special? I move a lot of oil. Bulk and cased goods. Shell prices have increased dramatically over the last few years. I guess they (SOPUS) prefers to sell Pennz/QS. Do not want to install a sub par engine oil but the price forces me to, at the least, compare products. A bit of research tells me the NOACK% is very important. I saw Formula Shell at 14.3% but the numbers were from 2008.
Thanks again for the replies. It is very helpful for me in my decision making process.

Mobil Special 5W-20 5W-30* 10W-30*
API Service Classification SN SN SN
Gravity, API 33.1 33.0 31.3
Specific Gravity 0.8596 0.8600 0.8692
Pour Point, C (F ) -36(-33) -36(-33) -33(-27)
Flash PointC (F)ASTMD92 224(435) 220(428) 220(428)
Viscosity
cSt at 40C 49.2 60.42 69.4
cSt at 100C 8.6 10.2 10.6
CCS, cP [email protected] C [email protected] C [email protected] C
MRV, cP 26,[email protected] C 29,[email protected] 19,[email protected] C
Viscosity Index 153 157 141
Resource Conserving YES YES YES


One thing about Mobil Special is XOM only warratees it for 4K miles or OEM OCI (whichever is longer) not 5K. Dunno if this matters to you for your use.

https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-special-limited-warranty

https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-super-oil-warranty


"No matter how paranoid you are you're not paranoid enough. Tell the truth. Reach as many people as you can with it. That's your weapon." - Susanne Modeski, aka "Holly" to The Lone Gunmen
Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: ARCOgraphite] #4495876
08/23/17 07:37 AM
08/23/17 07:37 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,491
DELAWARE
Hootbro Offline
Hootbro  Offline
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,491
DELAWARE
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Man, Id use FS all day over Sunoco.

SUN OIL just start marketing oil again? I don't recall seeing any on market for well over a decade. Bet you a beer they don't package their oil.


Outside Sunoco branded gas stations, I have never seen their oil on any retailers shelf.


2018 RAM 2500 Cummins 6.7L (Factory Fill 5W-40)
2017 Jeep Renegade 2.4L (Idemitsu 0W-20)

Re: Shell vs Sunoco [Re: Hootbro] #4495895
08/23/17 07:56 AM
08/23/17 07:56 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Originally Posted By: Hootbro
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Man, Id use FS all day over Sunoco.

SUN OIL just start marketing oil again? I don't recall seeing any on market for well over a decade. Bet you a beer they don't package their oil.


Outside Sunoco branded gas stations, I have never seen their oil on any retailers shelf.


Just noticed that the PQIA looked at their conventional 5W30 about 6 years ago and the 5W20 very recently.
Both have pretty good doses of sodium (like Valvoline and Royal Purple), NOACK losses between 14-15%, very little boron or moly, and modest virgin TBNs around 7. Going to Mobil Special looks to give you a small dose of moly, while Pennzoil looks to have quite healthy doses of moly and boron. Doesn't mean that the latter brands necessarily have better conventional oils, but it seems like a lot of BITOGers are more comfortable with seeing moly and boron compounds...although some of the formulators on here have mentioned that newer organic compounds can do the same jobs well.


2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter

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