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95 F355 oil and coolant analysis #4492583
08/19/17 08:03 AM
08/19/17 08:03 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
f355 Offline OP
f355  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
Hey guys,

Just signed up and curious would you think of these results.

I'm in the process of inspecting to buy a 95 Ferrari F355. The car has little maintenance history so I thought it prudent to send off some fluids to get an idea if there were any critical issues that perhaps wouldn't be picked up by eye or through compression/leakdown.

Unless the community has something to say about the oil, I think it looks reasonable. In terms of the coolant, lead (Pb) content is really high. The seller has indicated that there was a small radiator leak, which he had used some Holts Conditioner to treat. However, I think that the Pb corrosion is what's at issue and require new coolant system (rads, heater core, other exchangers).

What do you guys think?

https://media.trillian.im/media/?m=aW1hZ2UvcG5nLDE0NTUsNTU5LAjbzOZcMTAto%2FNqGOjDQ7uw4NxUh9emqlsazT%2FymaRb

edit: I can't seem to make the image link work.

Last edited by f355; 08/19/17 08:05 AM.
Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492630
08/19/17 08:50 AM
08/19/17 08:50 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 33,074
ME
eljefino Offline
eljefino  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 33,074
ME
You sound like you want additional challenge or drama in your life!

I can't comment on the Holt's conditioner. Good luck though.

IDK who'd put stop leak in a Ferarri. Lowball this deal.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492635
08/19/17 08:54 AM
08/19/17 08:54 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,053
Lyndhurst NJ
Audios Offline
Audios  Offline
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,053
Lyndhurst NJ
Run. Run far away. If someone was actually cheap enough to use stop leak in a ferrari god knows what elder they cheaped out on. Keep in mind timing belts are due every 15k in this car, usually in the 5000-7500 range depending on what needs to be done. The exhaust manifolds crack, O2 sensors fail constantly, and if its an SMG trans the clutches are easily 7k. Even in manual trans its still a 5000 job. These cars are maintenance pigs, and if they've been neglected be prepared to start paying right away. Theres a yellow one at a dealer by me that my friend works at, its going for $25k because it needs 30k in repairs and maintenance. Get ready.
I see in the analysis you're at 45k, so its due for a belt no matter what.

Last edited by Audios; 08/19/17 08:55 AM.

2002 VW Golf TDI-Mobil 1 5/40 TDT
2007 Mercedes GL320 CDI Fuchs 5/40 GT Pro XTL
2005 BMW M3 BMW Twin Power 10/60
2003 BMW M5-Fuchs 5/40
1998 BMW M3/4/5 Fuchs 5/40
Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492640
08/19/17 09:06 AM
08/19/17 09:06 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,941
Houston, Texas
motor_oil_madman Offline
motor_oil_madman  Offline
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,941
Houston, Texas
Yeah Ferraris are junk. Or at least were never designed to be a daily driver.


2007.5 dodge cummins 6.7 liter. Chevron Delo400 15w40. 7000 mile or 250-300hr intervals.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492641
08/19/17 09:07 AM
08/19/17 09:07 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,941
Houston, Texas
motor_oil_madman Offline
motor_oil_madman  Offline
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,941
Houston, Texas
Buy a Porsche.


2007.5 dodge cummins 6.7 liter. Chevron Delo400 15w40. 7000 mile or 250-300hr intervals.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492706
08/19/17 10:17 AM
08/19/17 10:17 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,522
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,522
Marshfield , MA
Google Tom Yang Ferrari blog. He is hob nobbing at Pebble Beach presently. His specialty is older Ferraris. He is gainfully employed. Much of his trade is the result of shoddy maintenance. Not a Ferrari fan myself, but he fixes stuff that often is NLA and that interests me.


'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2
Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492709
08/19/17 10:26 AM
08/19/17 10:26 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
f355 Offline OP
f355  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
Thanks for the responses.

The car overall appears in good mechanical and overall condition for it's age and mileage. It will undergo a thorough inspection by the most well known Ferrari mechanic in the state. Apparently, the RadWeld/Coolant Conditioner is a stopgap that many Ferrari techs suggest to solve small coolant leaks - though not a permanent solution of course. Did you know that Subaru recommends that stuff at every coolant change?!?

I'm quite familiar with the maintenance requirements of these sorts of Ferraris and their associated costs. It has all of the known 'bugs' already worked out (steel guides, aftermarket headers, cats gone, interior refinishings, etc.) and has had a comprehensive major service done just over a year ago (belts, bearings, seals, water pump, etc.) The oil analysis shows good results and doesn't suggest any issues with wear or oil/water/fuel mixing. The PPI will include compression and leak down testing to be certain.

What I don't have an understanding of is what high concentrations of elemental lead would lead to long term. I *think* it's due to weldment corrosion, as suggested in the analysis, but what effects this may have is unknown to me. As I said it'll likely need a coolant system overhaul. Does anyone have any feedback on this directly?

Thanks again!

Last edited by f355; 08/19/17 10:31 AM.
Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492733
08/19/17 10:55 AM
08/19/17 10:55 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
f355 Offline OP
f355  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
Or any feedback on the oil analysis, for that matter?

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492774
08/19/17 12:07 PM
08/19/17 12:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,085
New Jersey
JHZR2 Offline
JHZR2  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,085
New Jersey
The oil sample seems suspect to me given no lead yet 17Fe and 4Al in an aluminum engine.

Coolant looks like lead solder is getting attacked, but would need to be compared against reputable standards.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: JHZR2] #4492778
08/19/17 12:08 PM
08/19/17 12:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
f355 Offline OP
f355  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
Could you elaborate on the iron and aluminum content concerns?

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492817
08/19/17 01:09 PM
08/19/17 01:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
Iron is too high, I would have capped this at 10. Don't bother with the aluminum as much as your concern should be the wrist pins here which are going to show up as Nickel. How is this car driven? Because the UOA tells me it's driven very softly and it's likely not fully seated. On these race engines, you need to really be on them often to prevent this kinds of issues from arising.

You need more detailed UOA to really get the picture, seeing strictly ICP data (wear metals) is very limited, there's many more things to UOA than just wear metals.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492882
08/19/17 02:47 PM
08/19/17 02:47 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,388
KY
MCompact Offline
MCompact  Offline
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,388
KY
Originally Posted By: f355
Thanks for the responses.

The car overall appears in good mechanical and overall condition for it's age and mileage. It will undergo a thorough inspection by the most well known Ferrari mechanic in the state. Apparently, the RadWeld/Coolant Conditioner is a stopgap that many Ferrari techs suggest to solve small coolant leaks - though not a permanent solution of course. Did you know that Subaru recommends that stuff at every coolant change?!?

I'm quite familiar with the maintenance requirements of these sorts of Ferraris and their associated costs. It has all of the known 'bugs' already worked out (steel guides, aftermarket headers, cats gone, interior refinishings, etc.) and has had a comprehensive major service done just over a year ago (belts, bearings, seals, water pump, etc.) The oil analysis shows good results and doesn't suggest any issues with wear or oil/water/fuel mixing. The PPI will include compression and leak down testing to be certain.

What I don't have an understanding of is what high concentrations of elemental lead would lead to long term. I *think* it's due to weldment corrosion, as suggested in the analysis, but what effects this may have is unknown to me. As I said it'll likely need a coolant system overhaul. Does anyone have any feedback on this directly?

Thanks again!


I enjoy seeing someone go after something that they really want. My vehicle choice wasn't nearly as exotic, but I bought a four year old M6 back in 1992. My only regret was that I sold it.


Mine:
2014 M235i
1999 Wrangler Sahara
1995 318ti Club Sport

Wife's:
2009 Cooper Clubman

Son's
2009 328i

Buy what makes you smile...
Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: danielLD] #4492925
08/19/17 03:28 PM
08/19/17 03:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
f355 Offline OP
f355  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 8
NC
Thanks. It was formerly owned by the President of the New York Times for all of the last 18 months. I think it commuted from NJ to NYC if I'm honest and probably spent some time sitting after that; no, it probably wasn't driven hard. I do know the latest owner has tracked it and wouldn't have been as easy on her as he's an experienced racing driver.

Unfortunately, there can't be another sample analysed, besides what's already been done, as the oil plug was dropped and the entire oil tank's contents ended up on the seller's shop floor! I could call Titan and speak with the tech Monday if there is anything else they would have measured besides what's on the sheet. What else should I be looking for?

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4492999
08/19/17 04:50 PM
08/19/17 04:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
danielLD Offline
danielLD  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 226
Chicago
Originally Posted By: f355
Thanks. It was formerly owned by the President of the New York Times for all of the last 18 months. I think it commuted from NJ to NYC if I'm honest and probably spent some time sitting after that; no, it probably wasn't driven hard. I do know the latest owner has tracked it and wouldn't have been as easy on her as he's an experienced racing driver.

Unfortunately, there can't be another sample analysed, besides what's already been done, as the oil plug was dropped and the entire oil tank's contents ended up on the seller's shop floor! I could call Titan and speak with the tech Monday if there is anything else they would have measured besides what's on the sheet. What else should I be looking for?


Well they gave you a partial FTIR work up. You should have received soot and AW with that reading.

You're going to want Karl Fischer, Gas Chromatography, viscosity at 40c and the index. TAN and TBN. What did this test cost?

On such a beautiful car, I'd recommend a higher quality oil. Congrats.

Re: 95 F355 oil and coolant analysis [Re: f355] #4493298
08/19/17 11:37 PM
08/19/17 11:37 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 239
Port Aransas, TX
Stevie Offline
Stevie  Offline
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 239
Port Aransas, TX
As Audios said pass on this car. That model is very high maintenance and complicated. Check out the Ferrari 360 as its a much more reliable and robust car. Belts are easy to replace on this model.

Never buy a neglected or abused Ferrari.

I bought a 2 year old Ferrari 308GTSi, owned it for 8 years and sold it for more then I paid for it.

All maintenance was done myself except for belt change $550.

I replace these myself: Water pump $170, clutch $800. Went through lots of tires!
Mine was very dependable.


A Ferrari is a joy to drive and own. I really miss mine.

Last edited by Stevie; 08/19/17 11:40 PM.
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