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CK-4 vs CJ-4 #4484864
08/10/17 02:47 PM
08/10/17 02:47 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 883
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 883
California
Is the chemistry on CK-4 oil better than CJ-4? I am assuming there are other compounds to make up for lowered Phosphorus, Zinc, etc. Someone perhaps thought adding some Redline engine break-in additive to boost those levels (I am not considering that myself). Was just curious if it is that simple or is the chemistry behind the two (CK-4 and CJ-4) night and day different? Appreciate it.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4484976
08/10/17 05:07 PM
08/10/17 05:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,139
USA
ArcticDriver Offline
ArcticDriver  Offline
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 1,139
USA
This is a great question and I have yet to see an explanation of what makes CK-4 a better product.

I respect the various wear test results but I wish the chemistry would be explained.


Multiple Diesel and Gasoline vehicles
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485034
08/10/17 05:58 PM
08/10/17 05:58 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,960
South Florida
bubbatime Offline
bubbatime  Offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,960
South Florida
Here is what Shell and Chevron have to say:

http://rotella.shell.com/products/pc-11....mp;gclsrc=aw.ds

http://www.deloperformance.com/en-us/pc-...us-PC-11-videos


And to make things more confusing, Rotella has REMOVED the gas SN ratings from most of their bottles. As such, it appears that Rotella is still a very stout oil, while some of of the others (like Delo) now seem watered down.

I'm really likening the new Rotella. The new dual rated oils, not so much.


17 Chrysler Pacifica Mobil 1 5W30
13 Yamaha XT250 Valv MC 10W40
10 Acura TSX 2.4 Maxlife Syn 5W30
06 GMC Sierra Nextgen 10W30


Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485035
08/10/17 05:58 PM
08/10/17 05:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,585
wv
krismoriah72 Offline
krismoriah72  Offline
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,585
wv
Comparing Rotella it looks like a higher TBN and slightly better add pack for the new CK-4.

http://www.pqiamerica.com/May%202013/rotella.htm
http://pqiadata.org/Shell_Rotella_T4_15W40_4192017.html


CJ-4 TBN- 9.4 Calcium 2321 Phosphorus 965 Zinc 1098 Boron 37

CK-4 TBN- 10.27 Calcium 2295 Phosphorus 1080 Zinc 1203 Boron 207

Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485098
08/10/17 07:05 PM
08/10/17 07:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 883
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 883
California
Thanks to all. Appreciate the links and VOAs. Night.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485134
08/10/17 07:40 PM
08/10/17 07:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,991
WI.
dblshock Offline
dblshock  Offline
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,991
WI.
but some are low SASP content.


16 Civic Coupe Touring 38k
640:1 TCW-3 E091
Edge 0/40 XG7317
Firehawk Indy 500

06 4Runner SR5 146k
640:1 TCW-3
PP 5/30 XG3614
Falken Wildpeak AT3W
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: krismoriah72] #4485167
08/10/17 08:22 PM
08/10/17 08:22 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,109
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,109
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: krismoriah72
Comparing Rotella it looks like a higher TBN and slightly better add pack for the new CK-4.

http://www.pqiamerica.com/May%202013/rotella.htm
http://pqiadata.org/Shell_Rotella_T4_15W40_4192017.html


CJ-4 TBN- 9.4 Calcium 2321 Phosphorus 965 Zinc 1098 Boron 37

CK-4 TBN- 10.27 Calcium 2295 Phosphorus 1080 Zinc 1203 Boron 207


SWEET!


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: dblshock] #4485170
08/10/17 08:24 PM
08/10/17 08:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,109
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,109
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: dblshock
but some are low SASP content.


SAPS stands for sulfated ash, phosphorus and sulfur.

Looks like the Rotella kept a decent level of phosphorus.


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: Linctex] #4485190
08/10/17 08:46 PM
08/10/17 08:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
2015_PSD Offline
2015_PSD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Originally Posted By: dblshock
but some are low SASP content.


SAPS stands for sulfated ash, phosphorus and sulfur.

Looks like the Rotella kept a decent level of phosphorus.
Only the 15W-40 flavor if I remember correctly. The 5W-40 and 10W-30 versions are less than 1000ppm phosphorus.

Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485216
08/10/17 09:31 PM
08/10/17 09:31 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,120
Houston, Texas
motor_oil_madman Offline
motor_oil_madman  Offline
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,120
Houston, Texas
I was going to run rotella but couldn't find it at walmart, so just got the delo ck4 one thing I noticed when changing the oil was that it didn't burn a drop compared to the cj4. Normally I'd be about 1.5qts low.


2007.5 dodge cummins 6.7 liter. Chevron Delo400 15w40. 7000 mile or 250-300hr intervals.

Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485288
08/10/17 11:20 PM
08/10/17 11:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 451
Balto, MD
NattyBoh Offline
NattyBoh  Offline
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 451
Balto, MD
Yeah we need to know the 5w40 info.

Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: motor_oil_madman] #4485304
08/11/17 12:52 AM
08/11/17 12:52 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 370
Texas
Neely97 Offline
Neely97  Offline
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 370
Texas
The ck4 Delo reduced the zinc so much I will stop using it in the Cummins .


6.7 cummins, Toyota 4 runner
FUMOTO
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: dblshock] #4485312
08/11/17 01:58 AM
08/11/17 01:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 26,177
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Garak Offline
Garak  Offline
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 26,177
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: dblshock
but some are low SASP content.

CJ-4 and CK-4 are both low SAPS, by ACEA E sequence definitions. They all already had a SA of 1.0 or less for years.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: Neely97] #4485836
08/11/17 02:07 PM
08/11/17 02:07 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 340
Michigan, USA
Bighorn2500 Offline
Bighorn2500  Offline
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 340
Michigan, USA
Originally Posted By: Neely97
The ck4 Delo reduced the zinc so much I will stop using it in the Cummins .


Same here, waiting for the dust to settle and see some more "CK-4" VOA's to help decide which still has a strong add pack. There will be no "CK-4/SN" going in my Cummins.

I know Schaffer changed the status of there 7000 15w40 diesel to "race engine oil" and kept the Z & P ppm still very high which may be an option. Although the 9000 5w40 diesel went CK-4, waiting to see a VOA to see what may have changed.


2012 Ram 2500 SLT 6.7L Cummins 4x4
2015 Jeep Cherokee 3.2L Latitude 4x4
Re: CK-4 vs CJ-4 [Re: mbacfp] #4485881
08/11/17 03:18 PM
08/11/17 03:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 451
Balto, MD
NattyBoh Offline
NattyBoh  Offline
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 451
Balto, MD
It amazes me that boutique oil producers are still going to ck-4 ans not keeping both. I believe they will still sell the cj-4 oila

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