12 Pentastar, Magnatec 5w30 high copper

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Australia
2012 Journey 3.6L
6 Month 6600km
Severe service


Al 3
Ni 1
Cr Fe 8
Cu 36
Pb Sn 1
Ti
Si 17
Na 3
K 1
Mo 86
B 128
Mg 11
Ca 2326
Zn 974
Ph 806
S 4174

Water Fuel Soot 0.5%
KV40 53
KV100 9.0
VI 150
TBN 6.3
PQ <10
 
They use a copper oil cooler, and in some instances show higher than normal copper readings for years and many thousands of miles. If this is your first UOA for the vehicle keep an eye on it and see if it slowly trends down. It's normal for a Pentastar.
 
Lead is low so the copper is not from engine bearings. If it has a oil cooler that could be the source, some are pure copper and seemingly leach forever.
Its not a bronze or brass bushing as the tin is low. I am not familiar with this engine but I cant think of any part with a high copper content other than a cooler or some sort of fittings.
 
Originally Posted By: Trav
Lead is low so the copper is not from engine bearings. If it has a oil cooler that could be the source, some are pure copper and seemingly leach forever.
Its not a bronze or brass bushing as the tin is low. I am not familiar with this engine but I cant think of any part with a high copper content other than a cooler or some sort of fittings.


Remember how high my copper was on the first UOA for the Rubicon? 145, everything else was fine. They shed a lot of copper and for a long time, it comes from the oil cooler.
 
Pentastar engines often give high copper.

Which Oz Magnatec 5W30 did you use ? The semi-synthetic GF-5 "Fuel Saver"' or the full synthetic A3/B4 "Stop Start" ?

That is decent zinc for an SN oil.
 
It's Fuel Saver GF-5.
Yeah the lab commented it could be from the oil cooler. I wasn't sure if it had a copper oil cooler or not.
I'm glad to see healthy TBN. It seems to have done well after 6 months, I think I could try GTX 10w30 next time.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
They use a copper oil cooler, and in some instances show higher than normal copper readings for years and many thousands of miles. If this is your first UOA for the vehicle keep an eye on it and see if it slowly trends down. It's normal for a Pentastar.


Nice! You saved the day:)
 
Phos is over ILSAC GF5 limits No Biggie.

Did the OP run a HD oil before this run causing a carryover?

I enjoyed my last run with Magnatec 5w30 GF5 better than anything before or after.

The QSUD aint no slouch either.

Great to find decent oils these days for 20 quid a jug!
 
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I would not sweat the copper either. My 14 Jeep Wrangler with the Pentastar also puked high copper for quite awhile. 40 ppm was the universal average for it and mine hovered around 30-45 ppm every oil analysis.
 
Its not just the Pentastar, a lot of engines show high copper these days because oil coolers are more and more common. I remember some of the first vehicles that this showed up on were late Gen-IV GM F-bodies when the LS engine first came out.
 
The only other source of copper could be the piston pin bushings, but as already mentioned the corresponding alloyed metals are not showing up in same proportions as the copper.
 
Originally Posted By: supercity
It's Fuel Saver GF-5.
I'm glad to see healthy TBN. It seems to have done well after 6 months, I think I could try GTX 10w30 next time.


Hey Mate,

Yes a very strong TBN (6.3 after 6600 km) and lots of zinc (974 ppm).

Castrol Australia seem to have a heavy hand when it comes to the add pack, they seem to approach the ILSAC limits from above, rather than below which may be more typical in other countries.

At KV100 = 9.0 cSt you have just gone out of grade (9.3 cSt limit), but that is not a big problem as these engines are mostly run on 20 grade oil in North America from what I have read here on BITOG. It's probably fuel dilution due to lots of short tripping which I assume is the severe service you are talking about.

I think the new Castrol GTX 10W30 "UltraClean" would be a great choice for this engine. It's SN and GF-5, plus Castrol list it as a semi-synthetic on their Oz web site.

BTW nice low iron at 8 ppm.
 
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Originally Posted By: Curtis Newton
Not to alarm the OP, but perhaps my Pentastar may be an exception???

5,000 mile runs on a mix of PP/PYB.





The oil cooler (or its presence) may differ between the Journey and the GC.
 
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