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#4477108 - 08/02/17 05:48 AM Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39820
Loc: 'Stralia
of unintended consequences...for those of us here, Gary Allan's universal law of unintended consequences was that the solution to a problem brings about more, and bigger consequences than it intended to solve.

This one motor vehicle HVAC systems...
* Make them more efficient, and you burn less fuel (or emit less C, whichever the bent of the boffin in charge).
* reduce cabin leakage, and they have less air to cool, taking less power.
* reduce the leakage to zero (like being locked in an icebox), and they are more efficient still.

http://articles.sae.org/15377/

"If it only saves one life" is reason to regulate something into or out of existence, then what about regulations that have directly, and measurably according to Az authorities cost lives...

(Thanks to Terry D for the article on Linkedin)

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#4477117 - 08/02/17 06:09 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
Silk Offline


Registered: 07/26/03
Posts: 4547
Loc: New Zealand
I never use recirculation, always vented, no a/c, and around town I'm a window down driver. I probably have excess cabin oxygen.
_________________________
1987 BMW R65 - Penrite V Twin 20/50
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.

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#4477128 - 08/02/17 06:35 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
SilverFusion2010 Offline


Registered: 06/29/11
Posts: 1651
Loc: Crawfordville FL
I've not suffocated yet. Now my roommate almost killed himself hauling a bunch of dry ice with the windows up. I laughed
_________________________
2010 Ford Fusion SE 3.0L V6, 178k miles M1 HM 10w-30

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#4477129 - 08/02/17 06:38 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Silk]
aquariuscsm Offline


Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 18142
Loc: Dallas,Tx USA
Originally Posted By: Silk
I never use recirculation, always vented, no a/c, and around town I'm a window down driver. I probably have excess cabin oxygen.


I'm the same way. Windows down,sunroof open,t-tops off laugh I only use the AC if my passenger requests.
_________________________
1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Quaker State Ultimate Durability 10W30
2012 Honda Accord Coupe EX-L 2.4,auto,San Marino Red
Pennzoil Platinum 0W20



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#4477141 - 08/02/17 07:20 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
E150GT Offline


Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 1088
Loc: San Antonio, TX
I use recirculate because it's hot outside. On a long trip I might take it off after a while because I get too cold. My old 86 Mercedes would turn recirculate off after a while.
_________________________
1984 Mercedes-Benz 300SD - 100k
1995 F150 XL 4.9 reg cab 5MT - 250k 5w30
2016 Mazda6 Touring 6MT - 56k 10w30

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#4477145 - 08/02/17 07:25 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
SHOZ Online   shocked


Registered: 06/28/03
Posts: 5742
Loc: Illinois
99% of the time I have the AC on it's in recirc mode. Still plenty of air moving through the car. Cars have vents in the rear usually covered by flimsy flaps under the trunk liner.
_________________________
2008 Hyundai Accent 1.6L 5 sp manual hatchback
2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe Track 2L Turbo 6sp manual

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#4477146 - 08/02/17 07:25 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
gregk24 Offline


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 5600
Loc: FL, USA
I usually leave the a/c set on 64 and the car will automatically turn on / off recirculate as needed.
_________________________
2012 Honda Accord EX-L K24z3
53,xxx miles
PPPP 0w20 / Fram Ultra

2014 VW Jetta SE 1.8T ea888
37,xxx miles
Castrol Edge 0w40 / OEM filter

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#4477148 - 08/02/17 07:30 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: SHOZ]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39820
Loc: 'Stralia
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
99% of the time I have the AC on it's in recirc mode. Still plenty of air moving through the car. Cars have vents in the rear usually covered by flimsy flaps under the trunk liner.


You didn't even red the SAE link, did you ?

(per usual)

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#4477156 - 08/02/17 07:39 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
Silverado12 Offline


Registered: 02/26/13
Posts: 3110
Loc: Central Virginia
Interesting. My pickup truck has a recirc button, but after you turn the key off it automatically resets back to fresh air. FWIW sometimes around here you need the max a/c recirculated air and I'll keep in mind to open it up to fresh air once the car is cooled down. Would have never guessed there could be a buildup of carbon dioxide.
_________________________
12 Chevy Silverado ext. cab LS, 2WD 4.3 auto
16 Challenger R/T Shaker 5.7 manual B5 blue
07 Harley Dyna Street Bob 96 c.i. 6 sp.
00 Mustang GT auto

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#4477159 - 08/02/17 07:41 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
SHOZ Online   shocked


Registered: 06/28/03
Posts: 5742
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
99% of the time I have the AC on it's in recirc mode. Still plenty of air moving through the car. Cars have vents in the rear usually covered by flimsy flaps under the trunk liner.


You didn't even red the SAE link, did you ?

(per usual)
That's a fact. I do have a CO2 meter. Tonight I'll drive around with the AC on and get some readings from it.
_________________________
2008 Hyundai Accent 1.6L 5 sp manual hatchback
2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe Track 2L Turbo 6sp manual

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#4477164 - 08/02/17 07:46 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: SHOZ]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39820
Loc: 'Stralia
It's always a fact with you...isn't it.

No facts, just opinion and rhetoric.

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#4477171 - 08/02/17 07:52 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
SHOZ Online   shocked


Registered: 06/28/03
Posts: 5742
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: Shannow
It's always a fact with you...isn't it.

No facts, just opinion and rhetoric.
I'll take pictures for you......
_________________________
2008 Hyundai Accent 1.6L 5 sp manual hatchback
2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe Track 2L Turbo 6sp manual

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#4477179 - 08/02/17 08:13 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
KrisZ Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 7456
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Interesting article indeed. I don't remember exactly, but a high concentration of CO2 causes sleepiness, delays reaction time and ultimately loss of consciousness. In a car, that will most likely lead to a crash long before someone actually suffocates from lack of oxygen.
_________________________
2015 Dodge Grand Caravan-21k miles.
2006 Mazda 3-155k miles

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#4477184 - 08/02/17 08:17 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: SHOZ]
KrisZ Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 7456
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
99% of the time I have the AC on it's in recirc mode. Still plenty of air moving through the car. Cars have vents in the rear usually covered by flimsy flaps under the trunk liner.


Those flaps are there to release the pressure when you slam the doors closed, when everything else is closed. They're not there to provide fresh air.
_________________________
2015 Dodge Grand Caravan-21k miles.
2006 Mazda 3-155k miles

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#4477188 - 08/02/17 08:22 AM Re: Fuel Economy Standard...Universal Law [Re: Shannow]
SHOZ Online   shocked


Registered: 06/28/03
Posts: 5742
Loc: Illinois
How high is too high for CO2 levels? Currently 820 ppm in the house.
_________________________
2008 Hyundai Accent 1.6L 5 sp manual hatchback
2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe Track 2L Turbo 6sp manual

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