Oil question please

[hunter29]

I have been told oil can go bad just sitting on a shelf, it this true ? Not so much the oil but the ad pack.. I found some CJ-4 oil but don't know how old it is or if its good to use.. any advice?

Also can CJ-4 oil be used in a gas engine? Like an old golf cart?

thanks guys.

 

[Linctex]

No, but some additives can settle out.

Shake the bottle well before pouring.

 

[SR5]

I would have no problem using 10 year old oil (for example). Give it a shake before use.

If it's a dual rated HDEO with a Sx spec like CJ-4 / SL then you are good to go in a gaser, assuming you don't need a special OEM cert like Dexos or something.

 

[SR5]

Hey OP, enlisted 2014, first post 2017.
Welcome !!

 

[hunter29]

Originally Posted By: SR5
I would have no problem using 10 year old oil (for example). Give it a shake before use.

If it's a dual rated HDEO with a Sx spec like CJ-4 / SL then you are good to go in a gaser, assuming you don't need a special OEM cert like Dexos or something.


I believe it's John Deere tractor oil,10w-30 I'll have to take a look again but it just said CJ-4 on the front label, I would like to use it in a Kawasaki golf cart engine .. I did not know you could use a diesel oil in a gas engine, not any gas engine of course..

 

[hunter29]

Originally Posted By: SR5
Hey OP, enlisted 2014, first post 2017.
Welcome !!


Thank You

 

[pbm]

I believe that additives can settle out but I don't think oil "goes bad".
The only problem with older oil is that it doesn't meet the newest specs.
I have used oil that was nearly 20 years old and had very good UOA's....

PS: Proper storage is also important....I wouldn't use oil that was stored in an unheated garage or shed for years...the constant temperature fluctuations can deteriorate the additives.
I once read that 68* is the ideal storage temp. for oil...

 

[hunter29]

Originally Posted By: pbm
I believe that additives can settle out but I don't think oil "goes bad".
The only problem with older oil is that it doesn't meet the newest specs.
I have used oil that was nearly 20 years old and had very good UOA's....

PS: Proper storage is also important....I wouldn't use oil that was stored in an unheated garage or shed for years...the constant temperature fluctuations can deteriorate the additives.
I once read that 68* is the ideal storage temp. for oil...


Thats what I am wondering, the oil was stored in a barn in Michigan weather, for how long, 5, 6 7 years, I just don't know. thats why I want to use it in an old golf cart, or as make up oil..or maybe mix it with new oil.. at 25%.. hate to waste it..

 

[Dyusik]

Just think of your oil pan, in Michigan or Alaska winter weather, sitting at a toasty 68 degree temperature. Must be a creation of Iffy Lube brought to you with the 3k mi sticker.

 

[Linctex]

I'd run John Deere CJ-4 oil in my 2008 F150 and not even blink an eye. That's excellent oil.

 

[The motor guy]

How long does it take for the additives to settle out? According to Blackstone once they settle out they can't be put back in.

 

[BrocLuno]

Yeah, but a golf cart prolly does not need all the additives anyway

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: motor_oil_madman
How long does it take for the additives to settle out? According to Blackstone once they settle out they can't be put back in.
From the Blackstone Old Oil Test:

Originally Posted By: Blackstone
It’s hard to say, but from that test I learned that when it’s done right, the additives actually become part of the oil during blending and time/gravity alone won’t cause them to separate back out.

 

[beanoil]

Originally Posted By: pbm


PS: Proper storage is also important....I wouldn't use oil that was stored in an unheated garage or shed for years...the constant temperature fluctuations can deteriorate the additives.
I once read that 68* is the ideal storage temp. for oil...


RutRoh, I started my truck at 20 degrees last winter, and the oil got to 195. Quite a few starts this summer from 80 to 205 as well. And that pesky piston oiler that sprays the underside of the piston, I bet I get pretty warm quickly in that zone too. Hot, HOTTER, cooled, hot again.. Dang it, I guess I better change it.
To the OP, check for an "S" rating, like SG, SH, SJ, and use it. Oil does not go bad in storage.

 

[dnewton3]

A few years ago Ryan Stark at Blackstone bought a bunch of old, unopened oil cans from various places (ebay, etc). I'm talking about cans as old that they dated back to the time when they were foil-lined cardboard canisters with metal tops and you had to pierce the spout into the can! They tested them and actually found out that the additives didn't fall out nearly as badly as most suspected.
https://www.blackstone-labs.com/Newsletters/Gas-Diesel/April-1-2012.php

Now, the base stock has a lot to do with this. PAOs do a terrible job of holding stuff in suspension, so they actually have some group II blended in them for that very purpose. However, most decently made dino oils will hold stuff quite well. Don't ask me to explain it; I'm not a chemist.

I'm sure there is a practical limit where it's not worth the risk. But oil that is 5-7 years old would not bother me at all.

 

[BrocLuno]

Depends on whether it has gone through a wax stage separation during a long cold spell. Oils that have a paraffin content can separate if they cool at just the right rate and stay cold (below zero) for a prolonged period.

If you pour one out and it comes out with waxy lumps, it must be re-heated to 180* F and stirred to get it all back together. Can be done on a hot plate in a pot. Nothing wrong with the oil, it has just separated.

I suspect some folks saw this years ago and thought everything had fallen out of suspension ... But it does not work that way. Once heated and mixed, it's as good as new

 

[dnewton3]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Depends on whether it has gone through a wax stage separation during a long cold spell. Oils that have a paraffin content can separate if they cool at just the right rate and stay cold (below zero) for a prolonged period.

If you pour one out and it comes out with waxy lumps, it must be re-heated to 180* F and stirred to get it all back together. Can be done on a hot plate in a pot. Nothing wrong with the oil, it has just separated.

I suspect some folks saw this years ago and thought everything had fallen out of suspension ... But it does not work that way. Once heated and mixed, it's as good as new

Interesting. Would it be possible to just put the lube into the crankcase and let the engine mix it up?
1) drive your car/truck to heat up the engine to full temp
2) OCI; old lube out and the "new" (separated) lube in
3) drive it around again for perhaps 20+ minutes; fully warming and mixing the new lube

Would not putting the separated oil into a warm engine not have the same effect as a hot plate? The key to this would be the sump temp, right? Doing this on a hot summer day with a fully warmed engine would probably have the desired result, whereas doing this on a cold winter day may not get the oil pan warm enough to melt the wax enough?

Now, granted, if the oil came out of the jug in total clumps of wax, it would not be a good idea. But if the lube has only small wax separation, would it not work?

I cannot imagine that there would be harm to the engine, presuming a fully warmed state at the beginning. It may not be optimum for the first few minutes, but I don't believe the engine would be irreparably damaged.

Thoughts?

 

[bullwinkle]

I actually did this earlier this spring with some 10W30 Synpower that had been stored in the unheated garage-shook it as much as possible, dumped it in (the 6.2 GMC), drove it until it got hot, used it for around 3K. Definitely didn't hurt anything. Not sure I'd risk it in a variable cam timing engine, though.

 

[BrocLuno]

Originally Posted By: dnewton3

Interesting. Would it be possible to just put the lube into the crankcase and let the engine mix it up?

1) drive your car/truck to heat up the engine to full temp
2) OCI; old lube out and the "new" (separated) lube in
3) drive it around again for perhaps 20+ minutes; fully warming and mixing the new lube

Would not putting the separated oil into a warm engine not have the same effect as a hot plate? The key to this would be the sump temp, right? Doing this on a hot summer day with a fully warmed engine would probably have the desired result, whereas doing this on a cold winter day may not get the oil pan warm enough to melt the wax enough?

Now, granted, if the oil came out of the jug in total clumps of wax, it would not be a good idea. But if the lube has only small wax separation, would it not work?

I cannot imagine that there would be harm to the engine, presuming a fully warmed state at the beginning. It may not be optimum for the first few minutes, but I don't believe the engine would be irreparably damaged.

Thoughts?



My thoughts are it may be gelled enough to not pour ... If it did, and the engine was hot, might be OK ... But, why would you not make sure before you poured it into an engine?

Using your method, I'd only consider topping up with say one qt into a hot crankcase. Using the standard method, it could be a whole oil change

 

[Shannow]

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3999169/Re:_Storage_of_oil_qurestion#Post3999169

You've got to get the bulk up to temperature...the film that slides over the hot surfaces might get there, but there'll still be gelation that could compromise getting up the screen to the pump from the bulk oil.

Seriously unlikely to be an issue down here in OZ...ever...