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Did Fram change the Ultra? #4469068
07/24/17 04:17 PM
07/24/17 04:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,740
New York
pbm Offline OP
pbm  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,740
New York
When Fram went from recommending the Ultra for 15K to 20K did anything inside the filter change?....or did they just realize that it could go further?

It seems Mobil 1 oil filters went to a 20K recommendation when they introduced Mobil 1 AP without changing anything about the filter....


'Journalism is Dead'
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469121
07/24/17 05:05 PM
07/24/17 05:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
USA
Reddy45 Offline
Reddy45  Offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
USA
Is that 20k based on using a Mobil1 filter + Mobil1 AP?

I don't trust the average end user when it comes to things like oil filters and oils.. I can see a lot of people misunderstanding something and ending up with a sludged up engine.

Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469136
07/24/17 05:28 PM
07/24/17 05:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
blupupher Offline
blupupher  Offline
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
Seems MotorKing (Jay, the Fram rep here) said they (Fram) have found that the Ultra could easily handle the 15,000 mile interval, and found even 20,000 miles was not a problem, so they changed the numbers, but nothing inside the filter itself changed.
Current Ultra with 15k on the box can be used for 20k if you so choose. Several examples here of them going that long before the box changed.

And before anyone says it, no, Fram probably would not warranty an Ultra with 15k on the box (they could check by date code) that caused an engine problem @ 18k miles, but is that really an issue?

I think it is a good thing. Many manufacturers are going to a 10,000 mile OCI, and some still also recommend changing the filter every other change, so this allows the Ultra to meet OEM intervals.
But then again, if OEM says it is OK to do 20,000 miles on an OEM filter, shouldn't all filters be able to handle it?


1994 Honda VT1100: Peak 15w-40/PSL/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI

Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469144
07/24/17 05:44 PM
07/24/17 05:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC
Vladiator Offline
Vladiator  Offline
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC
I remember reading Motorking's post where he said that even 30k miles is doable with a clean engine and good synthetic (better than SuperTech, but does not have to be RedLine/AmsOil), but due to legal stuff the filter is not advertised as a 30k filter. That is assuming the oil gets changed with the filter and is just topped off. If the oil is changed every 10k, then most synthetics will do, even SuperTech or Napa. And filter can be changed every 3rd or 4th OCI.


2000 Lexus GS300-361k
1999 Lexus GS400-213k
2006 Toyota Camry-187k
2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid-125k
2009 Scion xB-120k
2013 VW Tiguan-120k
2009 Toyota Tacoma-60k
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: Vladiator] #4469154
07/24/17 05:54 PM
07/24/17 05:54 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline
paulri  Offline
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
Could you provide a link for that? Or at least, do you remember when he posted that? I did a quick search from Google for Motorking ultra 30,000 and didn't see anything.

Originally Posted By: Vlad_the_Russian
I remember reading Motorking's post where he said that even 30k miles is doable with a clean engine and good synthetic (better than SuperTech, but does not have to be RedLine/AmsOil), but due to legal stuff the filter is not advertised as a 30k filter. That is assuming the oil gets changed with the filter and is just topped off. If the oil is changed every 10k, then most synthetics will do, even SuperTech or Napa. And filter can be changed every 3rd or 4th OCI.

Last edited by paulri; 07/24/17 06:01 PM.

2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: paulri] #4469168
07/24/17 06:05 PM
07/24/17 06:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC
Vladiator Offline
Vladiator  Offline
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC

Originally Posted By: Motorking
The reality is the Ultra could go 30k miles BUT, like all companies we have lawyers that evaluate risk and choose to err on the side of caution. Most likely in northern states that use salt on the roads, the can could rust before the filter was full.
Hope this helps and always remember that if you choose to have extended intervals, use the best quality oil that meets the vehicles specs.



https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4029169/Flow_vs_efficiency


2000 Lexus GS300-361k
1999 Lexus GS400-213k
2006 Toyota Camry-187k
2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid-125k
2009 Scion xB-120k
2013 VW Tiguan-120k
2009 Toyota Tacoma-60k
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: Vladiator] #4469185
07/24/17 06:17 PM
07/24/17 06:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline
paulri  Offline
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
Thanks. Bookmarked.


2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469213
07/24/17 06:39 PM
07/24/17 06:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
blupupher Offline
blupupher  Offline
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
From Dec 2016 talking about the ultra:
Originally Posted By: Motorking

They can go 30k provided they do not get dented, smashed, rusted, the oil is top shelf and checked added when needed. The 15k is just risk mitigation.


Also from Dec 2016:
Originally Posted By: Motorking
Originally Posted By: Familyman
Is this really good for a 15k oci (the claim on the box)?? Has any one here ran one of these for that long? What about this filter makes it capable of such a long drain ? Thanks for any insight you have. It would be sweet to only change my filter every third oci.


What gives it the ability to go that far is capacity. Most Ultra models can hold 25-32 grams of dirt to full. Given that the dirtiest of engines make around a gram per 1000 miles, they easily go the distance. Lots of filters have great capacity and still are not rated to 15k. Why? Construction and filter media. Synthetic glass microfiber media filters will never degrade when immersed in oil. Typical cellulose/synthetic blends can and will degrade over time. The silicone adbv also stays pliable forever. Stay tuned, we will be upping the mileage interval on these in 2017.


1994 Honda VT1100: Peak 15w-40/PSL/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI

Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469352
07/24/17 08:37 PM
07/24/17 08:37 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,740
New York
pbm Offline OP
pbm  Offline OP
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,740
New York
Thanks guys... so my Ultra's that say 15K are the same as the newer 20K filters.
That's good to know.

I guess the Bosch Distance Plus filters that I got at WM on 'Clearance' could also go 20K since they are rated to hold a similar amount of dirt (grams).


'Journalism is Dead'
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469361
07/24/17 08:43 PM
07/24/17 08:43 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,974
Cincinnati, OH, USA
bullwinkle Offline
bullwinkle  Offline
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,974
Cincinnati, OH, USA
It all depends on how clean your engine is-if you're cleaning out a sludge monster, it might not make 5K! I've personally taken an XG3600 to 20K on two 10K OCIs, it looked like it could have gone another 20K.


06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 93 GMC C3500 6.2, 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 18 Transit 3.7, 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2)
Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: pbm] #4469428
07/24/17 09:49 PM
07/24/17 09:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
blupupher Offline
blupupher  Offline
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,636
Katy, Republic of Texas
Originally Posted By: pbm
...
I guess the Bosch Distance Plus filters that I got at WM on 'Clearance' could also go 20K since they are rated to hold a similar amount of dirt (grams).

Yeah, they are supposed to be as good (or better) for capacity.
Only thing is they are a cellulose/synthetic blend, so per Motorkings post above, longevity (time, no so much mileage) could be a factor (but probably not).
I have 2 of the D+ that are oversize for my Scion (PH3600 size) that I am debating running for 2 oil changes (only 10,000 miles total, but over 18 months at the current use). I still have 3 CQ Blue to use before I get to that.


1994 Honda VT1100: Peak 15w-40/PSL/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI

Re: Did Fram change the Ultra? [Re: blupupher] #4473913
07/29/17 01:48 PM
07/29/17 01:48 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,399
Atlanta
DuckRyder Offline
DuckRyder  Offline
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,399
Atlanta
Originally Posted By: blupupher
...

And before anyone says it, no, Fram probably would not warranty an Ultra with 15k on the box (they could check by date code) that caused an engine problem @ 18k miles, but is that really an issue?

...


The new ones have painted markings, vs the sticker and they look more like the first version of the sticker without the light grey grid.


Robert
  • 2007 Toyota Prius Touring
  • 2005 Honda Civic Sedan
  • 1972 Ford F100

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