Rotella no longer gas engine rated?

wwillson

Staff member
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Messages
6,807
Location
Colorado
This is post made by the Rotella Team (BITOG user ChrisGuerrero) in the "Motorcycles, Boating, Small Engine, Aviation, Power Sports" forum as an answer to the question in the subject. I've also posted the answer here so that more of us can see Chris's response.

Quote:
Previously, heavy duty engine oil marketers could claim an API gasoline performance standard on their products if they met CJ-4 and the required performance tests for gasoline standards. Additionally, a waiver was granted for claims of API gasoline performance in cases where products did not meet the chemical restrictions for gasoline specifications (specifically phosphorous limits required for SN).

The recommended viscosity grades for modern gasoline engines are XW-20s and XW-30s. As such, this waiver process is being phased out. Heavy duty engine oils which are XW-30s (and which claim API CK-4 approval) cannot also claim API gasoline standards unless they meet the current phosphorous requirements/limits. The new fully synthetic Shell ROTELLA® T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 is one such product that meets the performance requirements of API CK-4 as well as API SN and is formulated with 800 parts per million of phosphorous, which meets the API SN requirements.

While the industry waiver is still currently in existence for heavy duty engine oils that are XW-40’s, this remains in discussion to be addressed by the API in the near future. However, the Shell ROTELLA® brand has made the decision to remove API SN claims, regardless of viscosity, from our other products which do not meet the preferred low-phosphorous chemistry for gasoline engines. It is important to note that there is no change in formulation associated with this change. It simply means that Shell ROTELLA® products will no longer claim formal API SN approval for products other than our fully synthetic Shell ROTELLA® T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 on labels, technical data sheets, rotella.com and marketing materials moving forward.


- The Shell Rotella Team
 
Originally Posted By: wwillson
This is post made by the Rotella Team (BITOG user ChrisGuerrero) It is important to note that there is no change in formulation associated with this change. It simply means that Shell ROTELLA® products will no longer claim formal API SN approval for products other than our fully synthetic Shell ROTELLA® T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 on labels, technical data sheets, rotella.com and marketing materials moving forward.


- The Shell Rotella Team



Thanks for posting that explanation Wayne!
 
This is good news to me!

Thank you SOPUS for making a great diesel oil that us motorcycle owners can find readily at any store and has proven to be stout!
 
JASO MA is fit for use in gassers, having a pre requisite of api/acea/ilsac, so since they claimed that MA was ok, I never believed the claim that it was diesel only. But is reformulated, and is friendlier to catcons than the previous gas certified version. That's why I wouldn't want it over CJ/CI.
 
I've been saying it all along - MA means gas engines (99.9% of the time). So who needs API
laugh.gif
 
So when are we going to see diesel only shell rotella? Doesn't the CK-4 formula still have reduced ZDDP compared to CJ-4 or is that only because they made it SN certified?

I'll switch over to shell rotella from now on then. Maybe they realized how many people would buy it if they got rid of the gas certification.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
I've been saying it all along - MA means gas engines (99.9% of the time). So who needs API
laugh.gif



I agree, MA covers you for a petrol / gas engine.

Why don't they start claiming something like a Euro A3/B3 spec with less restrictions on Phos and avoid the API Sx thing altogether ?
 
Originally Posted By: motor_oil_madman
So when are we going to see diesel only shell rotella? Doesn't the CK-4 formula still have reduced ZDDP compared to CJ-4 or is that only because they made it SN certified?

I'll switch over to shell rotella from now on then. Maybe they realized how many people would buy it if they got rid of the gas certification.


CK-4 does not limit ZDDP. I know for certain that the T4 15W40 CK4 is just as stout as the old CJ-4 stuff.
 
My reading of it is that the CK-4/SN 30 weight Rotella might not be the greatest oil to use in a diesel either, 800 PPM phosphorus is weak! 40 weight is probably still 1000-1200 PPM, it's likely OK.
 
Chris: some of us here use the Shell Rotella (for instance I use T4) in our classic and muscle cars which need higher levels of zinc and phosphorous. So, does this mean that Rotella T5 and T4 still have more than 1000 PPM of zinc and phosphorous, and that only the T6 is below that level? Thanks for the clarification.
 
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
I've been saying it all along - MA means gas engines (99.9% of the time). So who needs API
laugh.gif


Ed Hackett and I said much the same thing. If it's E7, E9 now and was E7, E9 before, and we weren't worried about using it in a gasser then, we really shouldn't now, unless we're hung up on a specific new car warranty requirement, and there aren't a lot of vehicles calling for 5w-40 in SM or SM, with nothing beyond that.

Of course, API gasoline certification or even simply claims to be "suitable for" can be helpful. Someone wouldn't want to put a locomotive oil or certain marine lubes in a gasser, but those won't be E7, E9 or anything like that.

This is one time I wish the oil companies would adopt the "suitable for use" wording, but I don't think they'll be jumping on that, given that the big three all have a 5w-40 in SN already, with varying degrees of availability and convenience.
 
Originally Posted By: Building3
So, does this mean that Rotella T5 and T4 still have more than 1000 PPM of zinc and phosphorous, and that only the T6 is below that level?


He's saying only the Rotellas certified for SN have the lower level of phosphorous - and as of now that's only the 5W-30 T6 Multi-Vehicle. The 5W-40 T6 has the higher level.
 
Originally Posted By: jeff78
Originally Posted By: Building3
So, does this mean that Rotella T5 and T4 still have more than 1000 PPM of zinc and phosphorous, and that only the T6 is below that level?

He's saying only the Rotellas certified for SN have the lower level of phosphorous - and as of now that's only the 5W-30 T6 Multi-Vehicle. The 5W-40 T6 has the higher level.

CK-4 and CJ-4 have the same limits on P, S, and SA. CK-4 is just CJ-4 with stricter limits and more modern tests on engine protection.

xW-40 and thicker is exempt from P limits for SM and SN.

So, that's not the reason.

They probably figured out that it was not worth spending money on all the additional SN tests for gasoline engines on an oil made and intended for HD diesel engines, as few people use such thick oils in their cars these days anyways.
 
Or maybe they figured out that the faithful old BMW, Mercedes and turbo Subie users have enough savvy to look beyond the absence of an API S license in judging the suitability of this oil to their engines?
 
Quote:
It simply means that Shell ROTELLA® products will no longer claim formal API SN approval for products other than our fully synthetic Shell ROTELLA® T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 on labels, technical data sheets, rotella.com and marketing materials moving forward.

- The Shell Rotella Team

Okay, but has anyone spotted this T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 in the wild yet?
 
Originally Posted By: Astro_Guy
Quote:
It simply means that Shell ROTELLA® products will no longer claim formal API SN approval for products other than our fully synthetic Shell ROTELLA® T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 on labels, technical data sheets, rotella.com and marketing materials moving forward.

- The Shell Rotella Team

Okay, but has anyone spotted this T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 in the wild yet?


Nope. If Rotella moves as slow as Pennzoil did with their 0w40, it'll hit grocery store shelves in the form of jugs about 1.5-2 years after being $9.50 a quart at parts stores.
 
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Or maybe they figured out that the faithful old BMW, Mercedes and turbo Subie users have enough savvy to look beyond the absence of an API S license in judging the suitability of this oil to their engines?


+1
 
Originally Posted By: Astro_Guy
Okay, but has anyone spotted this T6 Multi-Vehicle 5W-30 in the wild yet?

I haven't "seen" it in person yet, but I did get a very nice price quote from a Shell distributor.
 
Back
Top