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#4456515 - 07/11/17 05:56 PM CAFE by any other name...
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39928
Loc: 'Stralia
http://www.smh.com.au/business/australia...20170711-gx9bx2

Quote:
The Turnbull government is considering new hardline carbon-emission rules so tough it may cause the price of Australia's most popular cars to soar by thousands of dollars, according to a leading automobile industry body.

Under standards slammed by car sellers as "unrealistic and ill-considered", the government proposes to dramatically increase within eight years the cost of selling high-CO2 emitting petrol vehicles to help Australia meet its Paris climate change commitments.


And it will be measured by measuring the fuel economy input.

As an aside, my Lease Colorado, the deal to get it through direct pay from my employer was that it be carbon offset...$750 over 5 years to make my car a ZEV !!!

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#4456520 - 07/11/17 06:04 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
HerrStig Offline


Registered: 08/24/11
Posts: 9560
Loc: Boston, MA
I've read a bit on the history of Australia, when did the populace turn hard left.

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#4456530 - 07/11/17 06:14 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: HerrStig]
MarcS Offline


Registered: 11/18/16
Posts: 183
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
I've read a bit on the history of Australia, when did the populace turn hard left.


Probably when the Great Barrier Reef started to die and they realized that all their major cities are waterfront properties and the rest is a desert.

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#4456531 - 07/11/17 06:17 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: HerrStig]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39928
Loc: 'Stralia
Rather keep politics out of it, but the current leaders aren't left.

The populace don't get what it actually takes to keep their lights on. I can't talk about my profession to my family, as they are convinced of the sound bites from their favourite "journalists" in the media.

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#4456540 - 07/11/17 06:32 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
Panzerman Offline


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 4203
Loc: Port Orange, Florida
I am hoping we hit the peak of our Enviro-mental interests with the canning the Paris Agreement and that car makers and oil makers start go pro bussiness in America.
_________________________

2006 Dodge Ram 2500 Hemi 4x4
2016 Dodge Challenger Scat Pack

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#4456549 - 07/11/17 06:45 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
BrocLuno Offline


Registered: 09/06/15
Posts: 5528
Loc: Kalifornia Kollective
When Florida is under water from melted polar ice, will you still feel the same ...

The issue is people. With three people on the planet, they could burn forests forever and it would mean nothing. With 8 bn folks, and 1/2 wanting cars, it will have to be some other system ...

EV's may make a difference ... But we'll have to look at power production. Coal won't cut it soon. Oil will have to be pared back.

Nuke would work if they would build small low pressure reactors and allow disposal of glass encased waste deep into the Pacific Abyssal Plain ...

The tectonic transport of that formation is way beyond the 1/2 life of most fuels smile

Since I don't see "the common man" believing that 15,000 feet down in a mile of mud is good enough ...

But, since I have no actual political views that make sense according to my wife, I guess I'll just keep playing with gas powered rollers and and having fun thinking about slippery liquids laugh


Edited by BrocLuno (07/11/17 06:47 PM)
_________________________
Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.

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#4456556 - 07/11/17 06:51 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: BrocLuno]
car51 Offline


Registered: 03/12/15
Posts: 10267
Loc: Southwest PA
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
When Florida is under water from melted polar ice, will you still feel the same ...

The issue is people. With three people on the planet, they could burn forests forever and it would mean nothing. With 8 bn folks, and 1/2 wanting cars, it will have to be some other system ...

EV's may make a difference ... But we'll have to look at power production. Coal won't cut it soon. Oil will have to be pared back.

Nuke would work if they would build small low pressure reactors and allow disposal of glass encased waste deep into the Pacific Abyssal Plain ...

The tectonic transport of that formation is way beyond the 1/2 life of most fuels smile

Since I don't see "the common man" believing that 15,000 feet down in a mile of mud is good enough ...

But, since I have no actual political views that make sense according to my wife, I guess I'll just keep playing with gas powered rollers and and having fun thinking about slippery liquids laugh


How about something called "Hydro electric"?

Lots of rivers around wink


Edited by car51 (07/11/17 06:52 PM)
_________________________
2009 Toyota Camry LE

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#4456573 - 07/11/17 07:13 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
Ducman Offline


Registered: 03/18/13
Posts: 496
Loc: Australia
I saw it on the news this morning and thought it was also like CAFE by any other name.
It appears as though it's not quite the same as it will have a more profound effect on the end result.
To that, it's actually worse than CAFE as from my understanding of the idea the manufacturers don't have any capacity to work within reasonable parameters at all.

At the end of the day if one wishes to drive a taboo style of vehicle one will have to be prepared to pay a one off premium at the point of sale. The onus is entirely on the end user and their choice.
It's more of a tax by any other name.

I'm glad I picked up my new HSV Maloo before Christmas as my last vehicle I will ever buy. None of this business will ever affect me in the least going forward.

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#4456579 - 07/11/17 07:17 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Ducman]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39928
Loc: 'Stralia
Yeah, the carbon tax at the pump at least gave you the opportunity to control your spend...

This lump sum at car purchase is, as you say, a tax not determined by actual fuel consumed/carbon produced.

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#4456587 - 07/11/17 07:25 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: car51]
Ducman Offline


Registered: 03/18/13
Posts: 496
Loc: Australia
Hydro is all well and good until they need to dam up a river in a wilderness area.
Then the greenies will want to stop that as well.

As I've been saying for a very long time, I can only see Atomic power as the only universally viable alternative to go forward with.
Especially on a large and geologically stable continent like OZ.
Unfortunately there is too much politics and fear around the subject for the populace to logically think it through.

Personally I have bypassed all the garbage around power production, distribution and pricing that's currently going on in this country.
I have installed a large high tech Solar system on my house with a plan/view to expanding it in the future as required.
It's compatible with the Tesla Power wall and as soon as prices come down for the battery storage technology and a case can be made to become totally self sufficient then it will be all go from my point of view.

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#4456604 - 07/11/17 07:33 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: car51]
Jarlaxle Offline


Registered: 02/02/12
Posts: 8163
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: car51
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
When Florida is under water from melted polar ice, will you still feel the same ...

The issue is people. With three people on the planet, they could burn forests forever and it would mean nothing. With 8 bn folks, and 1/2 wanting cars, it will have to be some other system ...

EV's may make a difference ... But we'll have to look at power production. Coal won't cut it soon. Oil will have to be pared back.

Nuke would work if they would build small low pressure reactors and allow disposal of glass encased waste deep into the Pacific Abyssal Plain ...

The tectonic transport of that formation is way beyond the 1/2 life of most fuels smile

Since I don't see "the common man" believing that 15,000 feet down in a mile of mud is good enough ...

But, since I have no actual political views that make sense according to my wife, I guess I'll just keep playing with gas powered rollers and and having fun thinking about slippery liquids laugh


How about something called "Hydro electric"?

Lots of rivers around wink


Nope-greenies won't permit it.
_________________________
1979 Coupe de Ville, 542 stroker, Super Tech 15W40, Delco
2011 Crown Vic P71, 5W-20 NextGen, Motorcraft
2014 Harley Sportster 1200T, dealer fill

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#4456636 - 07/11/17 07:50 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Ducman]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39928
Loc: 'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Ducman
I have installed a large high tech Solar system on my house with a plan/view to expanding it in the future as required.
It's compatible with the Tesla Power wall and as soon as prices come down for the battery storage technology and a case can be made to become totally self sufficient then it will be all go from my point of view.


Soon as you are ready for storage, give me a yell...my employer does PW 1 and 2, and will soon launch Redback.

We are buying a new (75 year old) house soon, and am thinking of using the expansive shed roof.

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#4456640 - 07/11/17 07:53 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
Silk Online   content


Registered: 07/26/03
Posts: 4567
Loc: New Zealand
People aren't buying EV's, they are far too expensive. To make them affordable, they won't be any cheaper, but your petrol powered car will soon be more expensive than an EV. Sorted.
_________________________
1987 BMW R65 - Penrite V Twin 20/50
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.

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#4456684 - 07/11/17 08:29 PM Re: CAFE by any other name... [Re: Shannow]
wwillson Offline

Administrator


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 2164
Loc: Naperville, IL
Politics - lock time

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