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Message to computer geeks... #4448554
07/03/17 05:27 PM
07/03/17 05:27 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
OneEyeJack Offline OP
OneEyeJack  Offline OP

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
I was at an extended care facility today and there was a young man berating his elderly mother about her lack of skill using the Internet.

Her answer: Son, just remember I'm the one that potty trained you. The know it all son looked up to see a half dozen or so nurses, a doctor and a few visitors trying not to laugh.

Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448569
07/03/17 05:44 PM
07/03/17 05:44 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 3,772
MD
AirgunSavant Offline
AirgunSavant  Offline

Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 3,772
MD
Apparently the computer didn't teach him any manners or respect for his elders.

Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: AirgunSavant] #4448574
07/03/17 05:49 PM
07/03/17 05:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 384
DFW
Timo325 Offline
Timo325  Offline

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 384
DFW
Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
Apparently the computer didn't teach him any manners or respect for his elders.


Agree.


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Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448581
07/03/17 06:02 PM
07/03/17 06:02 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,475
OH
fdcg27 Offline
fdcg27  Offline

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,475
OH
A lot of geeks seem to think they have mad skills.
They don't.
PCs are so easy to use as is the 'net for anything one might want.
Real skills, like those involved in actually repairing something or in understanding how it works are something else.
This is the difference between "software engineers" and real engineers.
My ninety year old mother monitors her bank and brokerage accounts online and pays her bills that way as well.
She is someone who learned to type on an Underwood and who learned PC use with something like Word Perfect.
These things aren't at all hard to use, as evidenced by the many users we have here.
Boy should get back on his meds and get a real job.


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Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448585
07/03/17 06:05 PM
07/03/17 06:05 PM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,802
NJ
Leo99 Offline
Leo99  Offline

Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,802
NJ
My wife thinks I have mad skills.


Without data you're just another person with an opinion. W. E. Deming

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Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448598
07/03/17 06:16 PM
07/03/17 06:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
Should I take this message to heart? Does this apply to me?

As someone who most would consider a "computer geek" but one who was raised under the guiding hands of strict, loving, supporting parents;seems most of these types of issues are parenting problems.

Too much pride and not enough humility, supported by the parents who think their children can do no wrong.


2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: fdcg27] #4448604
07/03/17 06:19 PM
07/03/17 06:19 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
A lot of geeks seem to think they have mad skills.
They don't.

This is the difference between "software engineers" and real engineers.


Hmmm, software engineers aren't real engineers? Care to explain?

Last edited by JeepWJ19; 07/03/17 06:19 PM.

2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448614
07/03/17 06:32 PM
07/03/17 06:32 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,172
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline
BrocLuno  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,172
Kalifornia Kollective
Software engineers can't drive a locomotive w/o help laugh


Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: JeepWJ19] #4448615
07/03/17 06:33 PM
07/03/17 06:33 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,475
OH
fdcg27 Offline
fdcg27  Offline

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,475
OH
Sure.
Real engineers have recognized professional qualifications.
Software "engineers" don't.
Show me someone who calls themselves a software "engineer" who can put PE or ME or LE after their name and I'll admit to being wrong.


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Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: fdcg27] #4448635
07/03/17 06:50 PM
07/03/17 06:50 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Sure.
Real engineers have recognized professional qualifications.
Software "engineers" don't.
Show me someone who calls themselves a software "engineer" who can put PE or ME or LE after their name and I'll admit to being wrong.


1) the certification industry lagging behind isn't our fault (plus, they have certification for SE for years now...)
2) vast majority of engineers don't bother with that
3) so you mean that all sorts of non-software people have been using their PE to sign on stuff they don't understand?

4) IEEE: https://www.computer.org/web/education/software-engineering-master-certification
5) NCEES PE for Software Engineering: http://ncees.org/ncees-introduces-pe-exam-for-software-engineering/

Would you like to to go further in detail or is IEEE or the National Council of Examiners for Engineering and Surveying enough for you?

Last edited by JeepWJ19; 07/03/17 06:53 PM.

2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: BrocLuno] #4448666
07/03/17 07:20 PM
07/03/17 07:20 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Software engineers can't drive a locomotive w/o help laugh


what's a locomotive? ;]

Last edited by JeepWJ19; 07/03/17 07:20 PM.

2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: JeepWJ19] #4448679
07/03/17 07:28 PM
07/03/17 07:28 PM
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,686
'murica
Ethan1 Offline
Ethan1  Offline

Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,686
'murica
Mmmyeah it's not engineering. I seem to remember a quote from one of the pioneers of computing that went something like this: "I don't know what to call it, but I know that it is neither engineering nor science". It was Alan Turing or someone like that. I'll have to google a bit.

Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: OneEyeJack] #4448694
07/03/17 07:42 PM
07/03/17 07:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 13,150
NH
supton Offline
supton  Offline

Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 13,150
NH


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Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: Ethan1] #4448729
07/03/17 08:04 PM
07/03/17 08:04 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,025
PENNSYLVANIA
Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Mmmyeah it's not engineering. I seem to remember a quote from one of the pioneers of computing that went something like this: "I don't know what to call it, but I know that it is neither engineering nor science". It was Alan Turing or someone like that. I'll have to google a bit.


So you're going to completely disregard IEEE or the NCEES? Did you look at the links I provided? Is there anything in those requirements from either of them that you find is not worthy of certification?

May you, in your own words, define what REAL engineering is that isn't already specified by the IEEE or the NCEES? Can you explain how, specifically, software engineering is excluded from that?

Also can you, in your own words, explain why it's not real engineering?

Saying 'whatever computing thing' isn't engineering because someone that did computing stuff awhile back said that something wasn't quite engineering... Is just a tad vague.

I don't know how much more evidence I need to silence the elitism/ignorance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_engineering_branches



Last edited by JeepWJ19; 07/03/17 08:13 PM.

2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Message to computer geeks... [Re: JeepWJ19] #4448739
07/03/17 08:12 PM
07/03/17 08:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 26,867
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Garak Offline
Garak  Offline

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 26,867
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: JeepWJ19
Should I take this message to heart? Does this apply to me?

As someone who most would consider a "computer geek" but one who was raised under the guiding hands of strict, loving, supporting parents;seems most of these types of issues are parenting problems.

My dad and I were opposites on a lot of things. He was a technological paradox, as was I. I'd always have to have a computer, and know what I'm doing with it. Yet, I never went hog wild with consumer electronics of other sorts. I still don't have a cell phone. My dad never turned a computer on, yet he had to have the first brick phone, the first VHS VCR, the first hand held GPS, you name it.

And, he taught me most of what I know about vehicles, so I couldn't berate his skills. wink


Plain, simple Garak.

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