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Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? #4391845
04/29/17 04:36 AM
04/29/17 04:36 AM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,985
Southeast Texas
gfh77665 Offline OP
gfh77665  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,985
Southeast Texas
Assuming no tears or separations, wouldn't uneven or wavy pleats still filter basically just as well?

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391850
04/29/17 04:40 AM
04/29/17 04:40 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,453
Gulf Coast, MS
3800Series Offline
3800Series  Offline
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,453
Gulf Coast, MS
It can effect the flow rate of the filter in some cases and even lower its ability to hold particles but this is more of the guessing side of things with no real evidence on hand.

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391886
04/29/17 05:43 AM
04/29/17 05:43 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,116
Occupied Virginia
Bottom_Feeder Offline
Bottom_Feeder  Offline
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,116
Occupied Virginia
I've long argued that it doesn't make a bit of difference.

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391889
04/29/17 05:54 AM
04/29/17 05:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,922
Florida, Cape Coral
Eddie Online sleepy
Eddie  Online Sleepy
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,922
Florida, Cape Coral
I agree with Bottom_Feeder. Ed


CX5 Touring 2.5L :-)
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: Bottom_Feeder] #4391921
04/29/17 06:52 AM
04/29/17 06:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,149
Coastal South Carolina
edwardh1 Offline
edwardh1  Offline
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,149
Coastal South Carolina
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
I've long argued that it doesn't make a bit of difference.


agree

its the filter media that does the work, -------and the home boys have no way to meaaure its efficience so we get comments like "looks nice"


These products are all new every year?? They are a revolution!!! Razor blades, mens shirts, TVs, wiper blades, gutter guards, hearing aids... according to the ads. But also all new last year
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391931
04/29/17 07:05 AM
04/29/17 07:05 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
2015_PSD Offline
2015_PSD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
I would say yes they would, however, IMHO, it also points towards lack of overall quality and/or design. Case in point are the MC filters for my PSD. They are very long and the media is wavy to say the least. I think there could be a higher risk of torn media on a long filter where the media is not properly supported (pointing towards design). Most of the WIX and Baldwin filters (certainly all of the CarQuest Blues that I have) all use wire backed media. To me this is a better design or higher quality for the application. YMMV!

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391951
04/29/17 07:36 AM
04/29/17 07:36 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 123
-
VetteElite Offline
VetteElite  Offline
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 123
-
I don't like them because even the cheapest cartridge filter achieves evenly spaced, straight pleats. So canister filters which don't just tell me that the manufacturer is being lazy and hiding poor quality behind a metal can that we can't see inside.

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4391980
04/29/17 08:00 AM
04/29/17 08:00 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 371
Washington, USA
Onug Offline
Onug  Offline
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 371
Washington, USA
I've wondered about this question too and not understood the concern about wavy pleats. Assuming the media wasn't wavy from the factory, it implies stresses are being applied. So the questions should be where is the stress coming from and is the filter not designed for the associated stresses?

My guess is the media expands as it fills with oil. The long pleats will expand more lengthwise, and with a rigid top and bottom, they're likely to start bending/bowing and creating the waves we see. The media itself is pliable, so I don't think the stress of the moving material loads the top and bottom where it's glued firmly to the metal caps. But maybe it does and this creates a stress point that can start to tear over time.

All speculation without any real science. Would be cool to know if the bends happen soon after installation or over the course of the cycle...


2016 F-150 3.5L Ecoboost
Current Oil: Castrol Magnatec 5W-30 and Fram Ultra filter
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: Bottom_Feeder] #4392157
04/29/17 11:24 AM
04/29/17 11:24 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
HerrStig Offline
HerrStig  Offline
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
I've long argued that it doesn't make a bit of difference.
+1 Only to certain Framboys who can predict the future.

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: edwardh1] #4392159
04/29/17 11:25 AM
04/29/17 11:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
HerrStig Offline
HerrStig  Offline
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,560
Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: edwardh1
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
I've long argued that it doesn't make a bit of difference.


agree

its the filter media that does the work, -------and the home boys have no way to meaaure its efficience so we get comments like "looks nice"
+1 Love the "science" there.

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: HerrStig] #4392235
04/29/17 01:53 PM
04/29/17 01:53 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 19,263
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 19,263
PNW
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
I've long argued that it doesn't make a bit of difference.
+1 Only to certain Framboys who can predict the future.


LoL, big tears in the media (along with wavy pleats) doesn't matter to Tearolator fanboys either ... grin

Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: 2015_PSD] #4392366
04/29/17 05:03 PM
04/29/17 05:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,516
Houston, Texas
WellOiled Offline
WellOiled  Offline
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,516
Houston, Texas
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
I would say yes they would, however, IMHO, it also points towards lack of overall quality and/or design. Case in point are the MC filters for my PSD. They are very long and the media is wavy to say the least. I think there could be a higher risk of torn media on a long filter where the media is not properly supported (pointing towards design). Most of the WIX and Baldwin filters (certainly all of the CarQuest Blues that I have) all use wire backed media. To me this is a better design or higher quality for the application. YMMV!

+1 Wavy and crooked pleats are a sign of poor quality or a design defect. They filter until the media ruptures. Then the filter operates in bypass depending upon the area of the rupture. In my view this is a filter failure and the filter did not perform as advertised. The wavy or crooked pleats is also a sign that under slightly more stress, the likelihood of a media rupture is higher.


2004 Ford Ranger 4.0L V6
Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic 5W30 + Fram Tough Guard
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: WellOiled] #4392534
04/29/17 07:47 PM
04/29/17 07:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,786
Texas
Dallas69 Offline
Dallas69  Offline
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,786
Texas
Wavy or perfectly straight it filters the same.
I don't think its a big deal.As long as the filter does its job I don't care what it looks like inside.


2009 Galant-ultra oil and filter
1987 Ford F-150 302
Smittys 5-30
Motorcraft filter
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4392803
04/30/17 07:38 AM
04/30/17 07:38 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 8,309
Cincinnati, OH, USA
bullwinkle Offline
bullwinkle  Offline
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 8,309
Cincinnati, OH, USA
Wavy in itself isn't bad, it's the tears & holes you have to watch out for. Otherwise this Purflux wouldn't filter at all-it's all waves!


06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 93 GMC C3500 6.2, 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 18 Transit 3.7, 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2)
Re: Are uneven or wavy pleats that big of a deal? [Re: gfh77665] #4393848
05/01/17 12:35 PM
05/01/17 12:35 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 92
Pocatello, Idaho
compratio10_5 Offline
compratio10_5  Offline
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 92
Pocatello, Idaho
The largest stresses on an oil filter come from cold starts where the oil viscosity is at least 100 times higher than at operating temperature. These repeated pressure surges when the cold engine first lights off at high idle and before the bypass valve can open causes fatigue stresses and deterioration in the filter media. Wavy filter media indicates to me that it is not adequately supported during pressure surges and could release or dump a cloud of very fine (< 10 micron) particulate, that the filter has previously captured, back into the oil stream. Until the filter companies start releasing dynamic filter test data, we will never know for sure and be left relying upon what we can see when the filters are cut open. This is one reason I check Bitog. Does anyone here have any information on the dynamic performance of lube oil filters during real life conditions?


It's not what you don't know that hurts, it's what you think you know that ain't so. Will Rogers
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