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#4314163 - 01/27/17 03:20 PM Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius
veryHeavy Offline


Registered: 11/04/16
Posts: 479
Loc: MN, CA
The lithium-upgraded Prius Eco is rated 53 for highway MPG. I thought that was impressive until I saw the Hyundai Ioniq blue's score:

59 highway MPG
WOW.

Only the manual-shift Honda Insight ever scored higher (61). Hyundai does it by using an exhaust intercooler to improve EGR efficiency by 200%. They also have two separate water jackets for the block & the head, so the block can run hotter (220), the oil can run hotter, and reduce viscosity losses. Plus each cylinder has multiple holes to inject the fuel where it needs to be. WARRANTY: When your battery eventually needs replaced 10+ years from now, other carmakers will charge you $2500-to-3000 replacement cost. Hyundai warranties their batteries forever (if it's the original owner).

I never imagined an upstart Korean company would be able to out-engineer the Japanese working at Toyota.





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#4314173 - 01/27/17 03:40 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
09_GXP Offline


Registered: 12/14/10
Posts: 431
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Time will tell what the real-world fuel economy figures are but this seems to be a good application of technology. Both the cooled EGR and variable-multi hole injectors are from the diesel world.

There are some trade-offs such as ditching the 12V lead-acid battery, it is now lithium-ion under the back seat. More $$$ to replace when needed. The cooling system will also be something to watch out for with having different loops. The thermal stresses between the head and block will also make for some interesting engineering challenges to keep that joint sealed but assuming it all works out it will be a great feat.
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#4314175 - 01/27/17 03:43 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
skyactiv Offline


Registered: 03/02/13
Posts: 4501
Loc: The Midwest
Competition is good.
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#4314180 - 01/27/17 03:47 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
supton Offline


Registered: 11/09/08
Posts: 12169
Loc: NH
My first thought is, Hyundai has had issues with claimed mpg.

But competition is good. Hopefully ALL hybrids will raise their mpg. wink
_________________________
2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 163k, hers
2010 Toyota Tundra DC, 4.6L/6AT, 144k, ours
1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 185k, his

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#4314191 - 01/27/17 04:06 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
Smokescreen Offline


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 3393
Loc: Alberta, Canada
With the hotter temps I wonder if what oil weight they recommend...if its a 20wt, I'll be surprised.


Edited by Smokescreen (01/27/17 04:10 PM)
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All with mpg > EPA

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#4314192 - 01/27/17 04:06 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: 09_GXP]
CR94 Offline


Registered: 03/20/16
Posts: 1180
Loc: Western S.C. since 1996
Originally Posted By: 09_GXP
... Both the cooled EGR and variable-multi hole injectors are from the diesel world. ...
Toyota hybrids use cooled EGR, too. It's rumored to be prone to clogging after it gets a few miles (at least on 3rd-generation Prii).
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#4314209 - 01/27/17 04:25 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
wemay Offline


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8998
Loc: Southeast Florida
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy

I never imagined an upstart Korean company would be able to out-engineer the Japanese working at Toyota.


Boy, me either. Then i realized i'm on my third Hyundai and it has been the most issue free brand I've owned. (This is my second Toyota)
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#4314212 - 01/27/17 04:29 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 12728
Loc: NE,Ohio
Its possible but call me skeptic until they are in the real world for a few years.
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#4314223 - 01/27/17 04:41 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
madRiver Offline


Registered: 07/11/15
Posts: 3609
Loc: New England
It's a bad comparison because Hyundai is a plug in hybrid so you have that hassle to achive the MPG.

If you compare the non plugin Hyundai hybrid to Toyota Prius the Hyundai still beats it slightly but numbers are closer.

Apples to Oranges my friend!

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#4314228 - 01/27/17 04:43 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
Skid Offline


Registered: 06/10/11
Posts: 434
Loc: USA - Southern California
For hybrids, the critical questions are (1) how long does the battery last, and (2) what is the replacement cost?

If one car's battery lasts 200k and costs $3k to replace, that's 1.5 cents per mile.
If another car's battery lasts 70k and costs $7k, that's 10 cents per mile.

I know someone who got screwed on a hybrid. I won't name the manufacturer. But, he bought used and did a little Ubering and found out (a) warranty was not transferable and (b) commercial use voids the warranty anyway. The 70k/$7k was his actual number.

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#4314238 - 01/27/17 04:57 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
Vuflanovsky Offline


Registered: 12/15/14
Posts: 1189
Loc: California
If Hyundai holds to battery replacement for the original owner for the life of the car...that sounds pretty enticing if this car turns out to be a true Prius fighter.

From what I've seen, this vehicle has been favorably reviewed with one of the big takeaways being it drives like a regular car in the handling and ride department...in comparison to a Prius or i3 for example. That might be a big plus for someone who's on the fence about owning a hybrid.

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#4314240 - 01/27/17 05:00 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: madRiver]
veryHeavy Offline


Registered: 11/04/16
Posts: 479
Loc: MN, CA
Originally Posted By: madRiver
It's a bad comparison because Hyundai is a plug in hybrid
You are mistaken. Perhaps this link will clear things up for you: http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?a...31&id=37309

The Prius, Ioniq are standard hybrids. The Prius Prime and Volt are plugins. Notice the difference in the EPA sticker? It's an entirely different top level & modified format for plugin cars

IONIQ's OIL: 5W-30 with ACEA A5/B5 spec

My Honda battery cost $2000 + labor == $2500 total. I could have bought a third-party battery for $1500 reburbished cells or $2000 new cells. (They also offered a battery with double capacity for $2500.)

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#4314270 - 01/27/17 05:49 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: skyactiv]
OneEyeJack Offline


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 7485
Loc: S California
Originally Posted By: skyactiv
Competition is good.


Real world performance over a few years will be the more important metric.

As skyactiv writes, "Competition is good." Owner experience will settle the question of which vehicle is the best. For me best would be a lot more then miles per gallon.

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#4314273 - 01/27/17 05:53 PM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: veryHeavy]
aquariuscsm Offline


Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 18296
Loc: Dallas,Tx USA
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
Hyundai warranties their batteries forever (if it's the original owner).


thumbsup

That's how all hybrids should be.
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#4314585 - 01/28/17 07:00 AM Re: Hyundai hybrid beats Toyota Prius [Re: aquariuscsm]
supton Offline


Registered: 11/09/08
Posts: 12169
Loc: NH
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
Hyundai warranties their batteries forever (if it's the original owner).


thumbsup

That's how all hybrids should be.


Why?

Thought of another way: For every system that has a "lifetime" fluid in it, should the OEM warranty that item for as long as the original owner has it? I wouldn't mind that!
_________________________
2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 163k, hers
2010 Toyota Tundra DC, 4.6L/6AT, 144k, ours
1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 185k, his

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