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25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? #4313208
01/26/17 01:08 PM
01/26/17 01:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA
veryHeavy Offline OP
veryHeavy  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA

I have Amsoil Signature 5W-20 sitting in my e-cart, but should I go to a thicker 5W-30? What is likely to happen after such a long interval? The oil gets thinner over time (or thicker)?

2003 Civic Hybrid 1.3 liter

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313212
01/26/17 01:12 PM
01/26/17 01:12 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,123
Upstate NY
Donald Online content
Donald  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,123
Upstate NY
Go with what's in the owners manual. You need to do UOA during the 25000 miles.


2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313214
01/26/17 01:14 PM
01/26/17 01:14 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,349
NoVA
Jimzz Offline
Jimzz  Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,349
NoVA
I personally would use 5w30 but the 5w20 should also work if you check its level and do a UOA.


yup
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313221
01/26/17 01:30 PM
01/26/17 01:30 PM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,490
Toronto Canada
WobblyElvis Offline
WobblyElvis  Offline
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,490
Toronto Canada

When I have done long drain intervals, 12-15,000 miles, the oil has gotten thinner.

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313224
01/26/17 01:33 PM
01/26/17 01:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 436
Indianapolis, IN
09_GXP Offline
09_GXP  Offline
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 436
Indianapolis, IN
Oil viscosity will end up going down initially before rising again late in the OCI. Think of a NIKE swoosh in reverse. The degree of the viscosity drop and subsequent rise is highly dependent on the oil, engine, and operating environment so getting a good prediction can be tough.


2017 Miata Global Cup Car #02 - Castol A3/B4 5w30 w/ OEM Fitler
2017 Miata RF - PP 0w20 w/ M1 Filter
2015 F-150 2.7L Ecoboost - PPPP 5w30 w/ MC
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313235
01/26/17 01:40 PM
01/26/17 01:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,566
MN
oil_film_movies Offline
oil_film_movies  Offline
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,566
MN
If you have leaky fuel injectors, then you would get fuel dilution, and viscosity goes down.
Fuel dilution and reduction of viscosity from excessive blowby can also occur from worn rings.
You have an older car, so I'd go with 5w30 there just in case.

If you don't get fuel dilution, then gradual oxidation increases viscosity over time.

Its usually "safe" for bearing/wear for an increase in viscosity, but a decrease in viscosity can be bad enough to cause more wear, maybe even a spun bearing (guessing when HTHS<2.3)! That's why a 5w30 is really safer here for long runs.

I'd recommend putting in a seal conditioner on an old car going 25k between oil changes. Put it in halfway thru your long interval when the original oil's seal conditioner chemicals might be broken down. http://www.stp.com/products/oil-additives/high-mileage-oil-treatment

Fram Ultra oil filter beats Amsoil Eao on 4548-12 tests.

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313246
01/26/17 01:52 PM
01/26/17 01:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,995
Chicago, IL
Brybo86 Online content
Brybo86  Online Content
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,995
Chicago, IL

Yikes! Lots of random stuff for friends!

But seriously I would pass on the Amsoil if you really are just looking for 4 stroke PCMO.

Go with the M1 from walmart with rebate. Especially if you are planning on running typical OCI.

23,780 miles on Amsoil same engine


08 Honda Accord EX-L 2.4L M1 EP 0w20 145k
01 Kymco People 50
95 Lexus LS400 M1 AFE 0w30 193k
95 Yamaha Jog
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313261
01/26/17 02:08 PM
01/26/17 02:08 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,171
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,171
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
I have Amsoil Signature 5W-20 sitting in my e-cart, but should I go to a thicker 5W-30? What is likely to happen after such a long interval? The oil gets thinner over time (or thicker)? 2003 Civic Hybrid 1.3 l


Curious.... have you ever done a UOA? I'd like to see the results.


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: oil_film_movies] #4313264
01/26/17 02:13 PM
01/26/17 02:13 PM
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA
veryHeavy Offline OP
veryHeavy  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA
Same engine.... good to see the oil held up in an 08 Civic hybrid. And it got thicker with time.
Quote:
If you don't get fuel dilution, then gradual oxidation increases viscosity over time.

There's the answer I was looking for. At 30,000 miles Blackstone said the car had no fuel dilution in the oil, and at 80,000 it's probably still good. It sounds like the 5W-20 will gradually move towards a thicker oil (due to oxidation).

Honda recommends 0W-20 but the 0W costs $2/gallon more than the 5W, so I chose the 5W. It's interesting how Amsoil SS changes the price based on the viscosity. Strangely 0W-40 is the cheapest of all, even with its wide Viscosity Index:

0W-40 $2035 (fifty-five gallon drum)
10W30 $2076
5W-30 $2076
0W-30 $2156

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313286
01/26/17 02:35 PM
01/26/17 02:35 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,995
Chicago, IL
Brybo86 Online content
Brybo86  Online Content
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,995
Chicago, IL
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
It's interesting how Amsoil SS changes the price based on the viscosity. Strangely 0W-40 is the cheapest of all, even with its wide Viscosity Index:

0W-40 $2035 (fifty-five gallon drum)
10W30 $2076
5W-30 $2076
0W-30 $2156


I dont think amsoil prices based on viscosity per say

I think their prices were based on what it costs them to produce X product.

Last edited by Brybo86; 01/26/17 02:36 PM.

08 Honda Accord EX-L 2.4L M1 EP 0w20 145k
01 Kymco People 50
95 Lexus LS400 M1 AFE 0w30 193k
95 Yamaha Jog
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313292
01/26/17 02:47 PM
01/26/17 02:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,569
'Stralia
Shannow Offline
Shannow  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 41,569
'Stralia
If your manual is 5W20, I'd go with that.

Here's a long term test...
http://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html

different engine, different location, different operation, and also 100ml top-up every 1,000 miles to replace the sample for the UOA.

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: Brybo86] #4313293
01/26/17 02:48 PM
01/26/17 02:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA
veryHeavy Offline OP
veryHeavy  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 479
MN, CA
23,780 miles on Amsoil same engine

Now that I see AMSoil held-up 25000 miles without problem, it seems silly to repeat the test. Maybe I'll try Mobil Extended Performance for 25000 instead. (ponder)

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313351
01/26/17 04:26 PM
01/26/17 04:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,340
USA
slacktide_bitog Offline
slacktide_bitog  Offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,340
USA
This does not seem like a good idea. What is your driving conditions? If you do all highway miles, hundreds of miles a day, 60k a year, then 25k might work. Use a long life synthetic filter like Fram Ultra or WIX XP

Either way, please get a UOA for us at the end of the 25k OCI. Napa has the best price on it, $14, and it includes TBN. Ask for part #4077

Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: veryHeavy] #4313366
01/26/17 04:43 PM
01/26/17 04:43 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,737
Phoenix, Arizona - USA
SirTanon Online content
SirTanon  Online Content
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,737
Phoenix, Arizona - USA
I drive 110 miles round trip to work / day, 5 days a week.. usually end up with about 600 miles on the clock per week including trips to the store/lunch.. and there is no way I would ever run a 25k OCI, even using Mobil EP. 15k, MAYBE.. using a Fram Ultra.. but never 25k.

I don't care what AMSoil says, 25k is too long on any SN/SM oil.


2010 Ford Fusion SE - 2.5 liter/6F35 Trans - 266,000mi
2014 Nissan Altima SL - 2.5 liter/CVT - 60,000mi
Re: 25000 miles on same oil - what viscoity? [Re: SirTanon] #4313845
01/27/17 08:28 AM
01/27/17 08:28 AM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,171
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,171
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: SirTanon
.. and there is no way I would ever run a 25k OCI, even using Mobil EP. 15k, MAYBE.. using a Fram Ultra.. but never 25k. I don't care what AMSoil says, 25k is too long on any SN/SM oil.


That's a wonderful opinion, But I've seen vehicles go MUCH further than 25,000 miles on Mobil 1 - back in the 1990's.(SG-SH oil?)

There was no such thing as synthetic filters back then. Two vehicles I know of first hand ran over 50,000 with Mobil 1 and the engines seemed to be fine from a cursory examination.

I'm not saying it's a good idea for everyone, but there's probably enough science to suggest that it's possible without causing major problems.


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
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