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Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... #4210088
09/23/16 11:29 PM
09/23/16 11:29 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline OP
BrocLuno  Offline OP

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
I a thread over on iBoats, there was an ongoing discussion of a iffy engine. One of the posters said something about adding Marvel Mystery Oil (MMO). Got a rash of stuff back, but this was interesting:

MMO contains solvents such as such as kerosene, naphthalene, xylene, acetone or isopropanol. It always kills me that there's always people that think MMO (and other Snake-oils) are some kind of special double secret magic sauce that does something remarkable in an engine when added to either the oil or the fuel ...

Another poster responds:

Some years ago, MMO was added to fuel in an aircraft engine and the NTSB had the following to say about it at http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?...02LA181&akey=1

According to the FAA inspector, the additive that was added to the fuel was Marvel Mystery Oil. An empty 1 gallon can of Marvel Mystery Oil was found in the operator's trash. Instructions found on the can stated that the correct ratio for mixing with fuel was 1 part additive to 100 parts fuel. The contents of Marvel Mystery Oil were 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard.

Well OK, maybe you should not use MMO in an aircraft engine or aircraft fuel, but in an oil burner/beater, why not ...

The Stoddard Solvent will free stuff ( laugh ), and the lard will be poor mans AutoRX (bio-oils), so that's cause to go get some all by itself. I think it's a bargain for what it does smile

I have used it on and off for decades on oil burners and rough running engines. About 75% of the time it'll help in one oil change interval.

I have moved on to BG109 and my fix in a can smile

But under some circumstances, I'd grab a can of MMO and go for it again laugh


Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210104
09/24/16 12:21 AM
09/24/16 12:21 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,415
WA (USA)
Y_K Offline
Y_K  Offline

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,415
WA (USA)
WD40 is another kerosene gimmick. Folks still buy into its 'lubrication' property.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Y_K] #4210116
09/24/16 12:39 AM
09/24/16 12:39 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,098
Central Wisconsin
dwendt44 Offline
dwendt44  Offline

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,098
Central Wisconsin
WD-40 isn't a real 'lubricant', it's a 'water displacement' compound.
It has an oily component though and works as a light lube in some cases. Its overused, though that's my opinion.


There's no such thing as:
Too big of a battery,
Too large of a gas tank,
or too loud of a horn,
or too bright headlights.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210131
09/24/16 01:55 AM
09/24/16 01:55 AM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 985
England
UltrafanUK Offline
UltrafanUK  Offline

Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 985
England
If you have sludge up engine it is much safer to use a flush designed for use at idle rather than a drive around oil scourer like MMO. If your engine is sludged up an oil scourer can easily dislodge the sludge and block the oil filter or even the oil pump intake screen.
MMO is also going to thin out the oil which is not good news if your oil is already on the thin side. I definitely would not use it if you are using an Xw20.
Liqui Moly are the best company in the oil additives game and they do make a drive around oil scourer in additive to their popular idle flushes, BUT their PDS has a specific warning that when used in a badly sludged up engine the sump and oil pump intake screen should be cleaned first and the driver should avoid high RPM's.


Shell Ultra 0 or 5w40 or Liqui Moly 5w40 plus Ceratec every long OCI.
LM idle flush every 100K km.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210145
09/24/16 03:10 AM
09/24/16 03:10 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,462
KingCake Offline
KingCake  Offline

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,462
99% of additives are witches brews of light-medium hydrocarbons.

Only good stuff is PEA/Glycol-Ether based.

Last edited by KingCake; 09/24/16 03:11 AM.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210219
09/24/16 07:47 AM
09/24/16 07:47 AM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 5,842
Waterloo, ON
Bluestream Offline
Bluestream  Offline

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 5,842
Waterloo, ON
Stay away from the snake oils, they dont do anything that a good PCMO will do


2000 VW Beetle 1.8T M5
2006 Pathfinder 4X4
1991 BMW 735iL
"A fool and his money are soon parted" - Thomas Tusser
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210234
09/24/16 08:06 AM
09/24/16 08:06 AM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,256
Central NY
Miller88 Offline
Miller88  Offline

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,256
Central NY
MMO is a nice light weight oil and has it's purpose. WD40 was never much much use to me until I got a winch on the Jeep. It's good to keep the cable from getting too wet with moisture


18 Forester 2.5I 6M
00 Jeep XJ
01 F-350 4x4 5M
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210238
09/24/16 08:13 AM
09/24/16 08:13 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,027
PENNSYLVANIA
JeepWJ19 Offline
JeepWJ19  Offline

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,027
PENNSYLVANIA
So what exactly was revealed about MMO that hasn't already been stated?


2002 Jeep WJ 4.0 | Mobil 1 HM 5w30 |
TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

Software Engineer :]
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210241
09/24/16 08:15 AM
09/24/16 08:15 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline OP
BrocLuno  Offline OP

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
The Lard part laugh


Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: JeepWJ19] #4210242
09/24/16 08:16 AM
09/24/16 08:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,320
Champlain/Hudson Valley
Kira Offline
Kira  Offline

Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,320
Champlain/Hudson Valley
I use WD-40 mostly for soaking the adjustable wheel hardware on my lawn mower. That sheet metal will rust away. Mine's still intact.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Kira] #4210250
09/24/16 08:23 AM
09/24/16 08:23 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 6,351
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Offline
DoubleWasp  Offline

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 6,351
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Originally Posted By: Kira
I use WD-40 mostly for soaking the adjustable wheel hardware on my lawn mower. That sheet metal will rust away. Mine's still intact.


Give Boeshield T9 a shot. WD40 can't whiz on the same sidewalk as T9 when it comes to preventing corrosion on metal components.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210257
09/24/16 08:30 AM
09/24/16 08:30 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,092
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,092
Marshfield , MA
Heh heh I usually sneer at snake oil. Heck, I purposely buy store brand stuff because it doesn't support an advertising staff. But I have have fallen hook line and sinker for MMO. Believe me, it doesn't "scour". I totally get the Mystery. The wintergreen smell evokes nostalgic memories of liniment used on horses and humans. Salacyllic acid,aka aspirin, for cars. Smells trigger memories of when they were last smelt. 5-6 bucks for a qt of stuff that evokes nostalgia? I use it religiously in my OPE gas. Is the decline in carb trouble a coincidence? Thats another mystery I thin out out the 20w50 for the winter with a pint of it. Read the label. Used as directed, its harmless at worst.


'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210271
09/24/16 08:43 AM
09/24/16 08:43 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
FWIW, the Techron Fuel Injector Cleaner that is slightly cheaper than the PEA-laden Fuel System Cleaner has a <50% dose Stoddard solvent according to its MSDS (and is less than 10% PEA). The way those things are written is weird to me, the FIC is also <80% light distillates, so take your guess as to what the actual typical dose of Stoddard solvent is.


2014 Forester XT, 100000 miles
Last Change;
M1 10W30 HM SN+
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210293
09/24/16 09:00 AM
09/24/16 09:00 AM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 22,114
Upstate NY
Donald Online content
Donald  Online Content

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 22,114
Upstate NY
The only mystery is why people still use the stuff other than in seized engines due water/rust.


2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210316
09/24/16 09:24 AM
09/24/16 09:24 AM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,983
Columbus,Nebraska
Yah-Tah-Hey Offline
Yah-Tah-Hey  Offline

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,983
Columbus,Nebraska
Stoddard solvent is just a trade name for mineral spirits. I believe another trade name for same product is Varsol.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Yah-Tah-Hey] #4210323
09/24/16 09:32 AM
09/24/16 09:32 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,495
Texas
4WD Offline
4WD  Offline

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,495
Texas
Yes, put it in your parts washer tank. wink

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210379
09/24/16 10:46 AM
09/24/16 10:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 9,808
New Jersey
crazyoildude Offline
crazyoildude  Offline

Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 9,808
New Jersey
I have used MMO for many years and all the old time mechanics still use it..
I have used MMO on many engines that had stuck valves or lifters over the years and saved people thousands because of it..I won't argue with anyone about MMO because everyone has their own opinion about it. If you like it use it ..I do...If you don't like it don't use it.

I use it in my lawnmowers snowblowers and generator's gas tanks also and when the power went out last year i have the same generator installed on my house that my two neighbors have all installed around the same time mine automatically started up within a couple of minutes and theirs did not start , Period!


Check To See That The Oil Jugs You Buy Have The Exact Amount Of Oil In Them And Have An Inner Seal Under The Cap. I Use Mobil 1 And Fram Ultra Filters
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210414
09/24/16 11:38 AM
09/24/16 11:38 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline OP
BrocLuno  Offline OP

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 6,202
Kalifornia Kollective
Yeah, it's odd - but many folks have not used it and never will ... Those of us that have been around for a while know what it's good for and reach for it when needed. I'm with you. Use it when it's needed, before tearing down an engine if you can help it smile


Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210449
09/24/16 12:30 PM
09/24/16 12:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,306
oh
roadrunner1 Offline
roadrunner1  Offline

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,306
oh
I use MMO in everything I own thats gas powered as I have a bulk tank that I mix it in. My carb/valve issues have all but disappeared.


'15 F350 6.7
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210648
09/24/16 06:37 PM
09/24/16 06:37 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 244
Cold Lake, Alberta, Canada
Surestick Offline
Surestick  Offline

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 244
Cold Lake, Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
I a thread over on iBoats, there was an ongoing discussion of a iffy engine. One of the posters said something about adding Marvel Mystery Oil (MMO). Got a rash of stuff back, but this was interesting:

MMO contains solvents such as such as kerosene, naphthalene, xylene, acetone or isopropanol. It always kills me that there's always people that think MMO (and other Snake-oils) are some kind of special double secret magic sauce that does something remarkable in an engine when added to either the oil or the fuel ...

Another poster responds:

Some years ago, MMO was added to fuel in an aircraft engine and the NTSB had the following to say about it at http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?...02LA181&akey=1

According to the FAA inspector, the additive that was added to the fuel was Marvel Mystery Oil. An empty 1 gallon can of Marvel Mystery Oil was found in the operator's trash. Instructions found on the can stated that the correct ratio for mixing with fuel was 1 part additive to 100 parts fuel. The contents of Marvel Mystery Oil were 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard.

Well OK, maybe you should not use MMO in an aircraft engine or aircraft fuel, but in an oil burner/beater, why not ...

The Stoddard Solvent will free stuff ( laugh ), and the lard will be poor mans AutoRX (bio-oils), so that's cause to go get some all by itself. I think it's a bargain for what it does smile

I have used it on and off for decades on oil burners and rough running engines. About 75% of the time it'll help in one oil change interval.

I have moved on to BG109 and my fix in a can smile

But under some circumstances, I'd grab a can of MMO and go for it again laugh


IIRC that airplane issue was down to way too much MMO being added to the fuel (the link you provided doesn't work for me). I've never tried MMO so I can't speak to its efficacy but I don't think you can use that as an example of why not to use MMO. Any additive used in sufficiently high quantities is going to have negative effects.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210665
09/24/16 07:00 PM
09/24/16 07:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
Ducked  Offline

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Havn't used it. Don't think I ever saw it in the UK, and certainly havn't here.

Nothing against it in principle, but it seems to me, if you want to put lard in your engine, then you put lard in your engine.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Virtus_Probi] #4210682
09/24/16 07:22 PM
09/24/16 07:22 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,462
KingCake Offline
KingCake  Offline

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,462
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
FWIW, the Techron Fuel Injector Cleaner that is slightly cheaper than the PEA-laden Fuel System Cleaner has a <50% dose Stoddard solvent according to its MSDS (and is less than 10% PEA). The way those things are written is weird to me, the FIC is also <80% light distillates, so take your guess as to what the actual typical dose of Stoddard solvent is.


The stoddard solvent is just the solvent carrier for the PEA.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210725
09/24/16 08:24 PM
09/24/16 08:24 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,560
OH
fdcg27 Offline
fdcg27  Offline

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,560
OH
NTSB comes to a lot of half-baked conclusions, so I'm not sure that I'd give too much weight to anything published by them.
I've never used MMO, but there are serious long-time members of this site who swear by it as both a fuel add and a cleaner add in engine oil, so who knows?


18 Accord Hybrid 10K HGMO 0W-20
17 Forester 24K VME 0W-20
12 Accord LX 96K SSO 0W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: KingCake] #4210806
09/24/16 10:52 PM
09/24/16 10:52 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
FWIW, the Techron Fuel Injector Cleaner that is slightly cheaper than the PEA-laden Fuel System Cleaner has a <50% dose Stoddard solvent according to its MSDS (and is less than 10% PEA). The way those things are written is weird to me, the FIC is also <80% light distillates, so take your guess as to what the actual typical dose of Stoddard solvent is.


The stoddard solvent is just the solvent carrier for the PEA.


I have to correct myself here...I just looked up the latest MSDS for the products mentioned above.
The Fuel Injector Cleaner now shows that it is 70-99% light distillates, 3-7% 01154100-5179P (which I tentatively identified as the PEA previously), and 0.1-1% a new trade secret ingredient coded as 01154100-5323P.
The Fuel System Cleaner is now shown as 25-75% light distillates, 30-60% 5179P/PEA, 1-5% 5323P, and 0.5-1.5% naptha.


2014 Forester XT, 100000 miles
Last Change;
M1 10W30 HM SN+
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Virtus_Probi] #4210960
09/25/16 07:45 AM
09/25/16 07:45 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
Ducked  Offline

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
"25-75% light distillates"

So plus or minus 50% percent. Pretty tight and consistent quality control then.

Or is that the amount of "noise" they are allowed to get away with when reporting the numbers?

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4210966
09/25/16 07:49 AM
09/25/16 07:49 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 19,371
Sunny Florida
SteveSRT8 Online content
SteveSRT8  Online Content

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 19,371
Sunny Florida
If you think about it it is unlikely they would ever tell the exact formula.

I don't know about MMO, but in my biz they are allowed to claim secrecy on MDS sheets to avoid helping competitors...


"In a democracy, dissent is an act of faith."
J. William Fulbright
Best ET-12.79 @ 111 mph
4340 pounds, Street tires
Just like we go to Publix
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4211058
09/25/16 10:12 AM
09/25/16 10:12 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,047
New England
Originally Posted By: Ducked
"25-75% light distillates"

So plus or minus 50% percent. Pretty tight and consistent quality control then.

Or is that the amount of "noise" they are allowed to get away with when reporting the numbers?


Seems like companies are allowed to give the percentages in bizarrely wide ranges in these sheets so they can avoid giving away their exact formula.
Like the older one that said less than 50% of Stoddard solvent...well, that can be 0%, too!
FWIW, the name Stoddard in that solvent comes from a dry cleaner who helps develop the formula...it was originally developed to replace more dangerous dry cleaning fluids and was used for that purpose for decades.

Last edited by Virtus_Probi; 09/25/16 10:14 AM.

2014 Forester XT, 100000 miles
Last Change;
M1 10W30 HM SN+
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Virtus_Probi] #4211117
09/25/16 11:11 AM
09/25/16 11:11 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,129
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
kschachn  Offline

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,129
Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: Ducked
"25-75% light distillates"

So plus or minus 50% percent. Pretty tight and consistent quality control then.

Or is that the amount of "noise" they are allowed to get away with when reporting the numbers?

Seems like companies are allowed to give the percentages in bizarrely wide ranges in these sheets so they can avoid giving away their exact formula.
Like the older one that said less than 50% of Stoddard solvent...well, that can be 0%, too!

I used to write MSDS at a previous job, trust me when I say no company gives away trade secrets in those sheets. They are strictly for firefighters, shippers and emergency responders, and are specifically written for those groups.

Moreover, if you can intentionally deceive your competitors by the description (yet truthfully describe for a firefighter) then all the better.


1994 BMW 530i, 241K
1996 Honda Accord, 267K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 410K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 280K
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4211541
09/25/16 10:14 PM
09/25/16 10:14 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,884
Iowegia - USA
MolaKule Offline
Global Moderator
MolaKule  Offline
Global Moderator

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,884
Iowegia - USA


The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4211609
09/26/16 01:26 AM
09/26/16 01:26 AM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,224
Oregon
MrQuackers Offline
MrQuackers  Offline

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,224
Oregon
MolaKule approved


Master the 1000 yard stare

coffeeMobil 1 USA
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: kschachn] #4211627
09/26/16 04:33 AM
09/26/16 04:33 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,495
Texas
4WD Offline
4WD  Offline

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,495
Texas
And then this data gets moved into Haz Comm systems around the industrial site and used in pre job "Toolbox Talks"
(Operative word being safety) ...
Some of the detective work and sharing of knowledge gets interesting here - like the posting saying Mobil never had or will have mPAO - but it is on their public website ...

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: MolaKule] #4211636
09/26/16 05:19 AM
09/26/16 05:19 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
Ducked  Offline

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Can you confirm the lard?

I suppose the phosphorus could be lard phospholipid, but you might need GC/GLC/HPLC to confirm.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4215774
10/01/16 09:50 AM
10/01/16 09:50 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,092
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,092
Marshfield , MA
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Can you confirm the lard?

I suppose the phosphorus could be lard phospholipid, but you might need GC/GLC/HPLC to confirm.
Heh heh, Maybe they should make a high Cholesterol version for older cars. grin2

Last edited by andyd; 10/01/16 09:51 AM.

'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4216521
10/02/16 01:31 PM
10/02/16 01:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,475
Morris County NJ
steve20 Offline
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Morris County NJ
FWIW---one of my experiences with MMO; had a 70 Cougar with the 351C-4V & 4 speed which was quite a rare combo--always had valve 'issues' prolly from me over-revving the poor beast ---> used to bend random pushrods. On the advice of a then very old mechanic, I added MMO to the oil and the bent pushrods stopped. Well, I kept adding it with every oil change. In the mid-eighties leaded fuel disappeared and there were no lead substitutes on the market--in went approx. 4 oz of MMO in every premium unleaded tank of fuel.
Drove the car for 14 years and ended up with 140K, which was unusual for that vintage car. IMO it would not have lived that long without MMO.
BTW, I heard chlorinated solvents are leaving the market in 2017, so even though I have no use for MMO today, I purchased 10 bottles--which should be a lifetime supply.
Steve



Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: steve20] #4217248
10/03/16 12:22 PM
10/03/16 12:22 PM
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New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
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New England
Originally Posted By: steve20
FWIW---one of my experiences with MMO; had a 70 Cougar with the 351C-4V & 4 speed which was quite a rare combo--always had valve 'issues' prolly from me over-revving the poor beast ---> used to bend random pushrods. On the advice of a then very old mechanic, I added MMO to the oil and the bent pushrods stopped. Well, I kept adding it with every oil change. In the mid-eighties leaded fuel disappeared and there were no lead substitutes on the market--in went approx. 4 oz of MMO in every premium unleaded tank of fuel.
Drove the car for 14 years and ended up with 140K, which was unusual for that vintage car. IMO it would not have lived that long without MMO.
BTW, I heard chlorinated solvents are leaving the market in 2017, so even though I have no use for MMO today, I purchased 10 bottles--which should be a lifetime supply.
Steve


Wow, I had no idea that MMO was used as a lead substitute...learned something new today!


2014 Forester XT, 100000 miles
Last Change;
M1 10W30 HM SN+
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Virtus_Probi] #4217286
10/03/16 01:20 PM
10/03/16 01:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,129
Upper Midwest
kschachn Offline
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Upper Midwest
Me neither. Out of all the marvel-ous benefits listed on their website that isn't one of them. Steve should send in a testimonial, maybe he'll get a hat or something.

Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: steve20
FWIW---one of my experiences with MMO; had a 70 Cougar with the 351C-4V & 4 speed which was quite a rare combo--always had valve 'issues' prolly from me over-revving the poor beast ---> used to bend random pushrods. On the advice of a then very old mechanic, I added MMO to the oil and the bent pushrods stopped. Well, I kept adding it with every oil change. In the mid-eighties leaded fuel disappeared and there were no lead substitutes on the market--in went approx. 4 oz of MMO in every premium unleaded tank of fuel.
Drove the car for 14 years and ended up with 140K, which was unusual for that vintage car. IMO it would not have lived that long without MMO.
BTW, I heard chlorinated solvents are leaving the market in 2017, so even though I have no use for MMO today, I purchased 10 bottles--which should be a lifetime supply.
Steve

Wow, I had no idea that MMO was used as a lead substitute...learned something new today!


1994 BMW 530i, 241K
1996 Honda Accord, 267K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 410K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 280K
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4217592
10/03/16 08:29 PM
10/03/16 08:29 PM
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Iowegia - USA
MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Can you confirm the lard?

I suppose the phosphorus could be lard phospholipid, but you might need GC/GLC/HPLC to confirm.


You're joking, right? ???


Last edited by MolaKule; 10/03/16 08:29 PM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4217699
10/03/16 10:46 PM
10/03/16 10:46 PM
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Pindorama
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Pindorama
Lard, like that from the odd FAA accident report?

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4219240
10/06/16 12:09 AM
10/06/16 12:09 AM
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Marco620 Offline
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workbench CZ-USA KS KC
For engines,Liquimoly Motor Oil Saver is BOSS. It cleans up an engine and seals leaks and helps TBN. If your looking for a cleaning right before oci then Gumout Multitune with PEA is the way to go.Follow as directed and use rest in gas tank.


15' Civic 1.8 i-vtec 229,500 mi Redline oil & M1 3:1/BP transmax cvt fluid & Archoil9100
Say no to drugs, union made cars and amsoil.
Son of a Navy Corpsman. Support vets!


Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Marco620] #4220817
10/08/16 03:16 AM
10/08/16 03:16 AM
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Posts: 985
England
UltrafanUK Offline
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England
Originally Posted By: Marco620
For engines,Liquimoly Motor Oil Saver is BOSS. It cleans up an engine and seals leaks and helps TBN. If your looking for a cleaning right before oci then Gumout Multitune with PEA is the way to go.Follow as directed and use rest in gas tank.


LM Motor Oil Saver was not designed to clean up an engine, it is a stop leak additive. If you want to clean up an engine they do make several different flush additives.


Shell Ultra 0 or 5w40 or Liqui Moly 5w40 plus Ceratec every long OCI.
LM idle flush every 100K km.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: MolaKule] #4220833
10/08/16 05:46 AM
10/08/16 05:46 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,825
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
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Taiwan
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Can you confirm the lard?

I suppose the phosphorus could be lard phospholipid, but you might need GC/GLC/HPLC to confirm.


You're joking, right? ???



No, I just read the thread. Its mentioned in the OP.

Of course I don't know its true, but the source isn't obviously suspect, and I don't see it as especially unbelievable. Not for something called Marvel Mystery Oil, anyway.

IIRC tallow (essentially the same thing) is used as a lubricant in steel rolling mills. It'll be polar, so might be quite a good boundary lubricant/friction modifier, and compensate for the high solvent content of MMO, which might otherwise compromise lubricity,...er lubrication, I mean. (or whatever the contemporary phrase for lubricity is).

Thermal stability might be a problem, though.

Always meant to try it (tallow, not MMO, which AFAIK I can't get anyway) as a chain lube, but I ride motorcycles too seldom to give it much of a test.

Last edited by Ducked; 10/08/16 05:49 AM.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4220867
10/08/16 07:34 AM
10/08/16 07:34 AM
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Taiwan
Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Can you confirm the lard?

I suppose the phosphorus could be lard phospholipid, but you might need GC/GLC/HPLC to confirm.


You're joking, right? ???


Thermal stability might be a problem, though.


Oxidative stability/rancidity too, though the other components might protect the lard a bit, and I think some lards are protected by anti-oxidants.

Then there's the hydrogenation / trans-fats modifications, a la Crisco, which are supposed to increase stability.

I'd rather have that stuff in my engine than in my arteries.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4222853
10/10/16 07:33 PM
10/10/16 07:33 PM
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Iowegia - USA
MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
I a th

...and the lard will be poor mans AutoRX (bio-oils), so that's cause to go get some all by itself....

I have used it on and off for decades on oil burners and rough running engines. About 75% of the time it'll help in one oil change interval.

I have moved on to BG109 and my fix in a can smile

But under some circumstances, I'd grab a can of MMO and go for it again laugh


I don't know how anyone could assume there is any lard in MMO. ???

Last edited by MolaKule; 10/10/16 07:34 PM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4223011
10/11/16 12:35 AM
10/11/16 12:35 AM
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Oregon
MrQuackers Offline
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Oregon
"According to an NTSB post aircraft accident investigation published in 2003, a Marvel Mystery Oil sample tested was composed of 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_Mystery_Oil

Last edited by MrQuackers; 10/11/16 12:39 AM.

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coffeeMobil 1 USA
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: MrQuackers] #4223226
10/11/16 11:02 AM
10/11/16 11:02 AM
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Iowegia - USA
MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted By: MrQuackers
"According to an NTSB post aircraft accident investigation published in 2003, a Marvel Mystery Oil sample tested was composed of 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_Mystery_Oil




Quote:
NTSB Identification: NYC02LA181
On September 3, 2002, about 1200 eastern daylight time, a Piper PA-18, N5428H, operated by Aerial Sign Company of Hollywood, Florida, was substantially damaged during a forced landing in Belmar, New Jersey. The certificated commercial pilot was not injured. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed for the flight that departed Allaire Airport, Belmar, New Jersey. No flight plan had been filed for the positioning flight that was conducted under 14 CFR Part 91.

According to the pilot, the airplane was used for banner towing and was being repositioned to Hollywood, Florida, with intermediate stops at Norfolk, Virginia, and Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. The pilot departed on runway 32, and performed a right downwind departure. He switched fuel tanks while climbing, and leveled the airplane at 1,200 feet mean sea level (MSL). As the airplane neared the coast line, the engine "smoothly" lost power. The pilot turned the airplane back toward the departure airport. However, he was unable to restore engine power, and set up for a forced landing in an open field. On final approach, he saw the field was uneven, and turned the airplane to land in a soccer field. The airplane touched down without incident; however, due to people on the right, a building straight ahead, and a chain link fence to the left, the pilot turned the airplane to the left. The airplane struck the fence and came to rest on its nose.

The pilot reported that the airplane had 3 fuel tanks, each with a capacity of 18 gallons. One was located in the left wing, and two were located in the right wing. During his preflight inspection of the airplane, he noticed that the fuel in one tank was pink in color. He attributed that to the addition of a fuel additive. The fuel in the other tanks were blue in color. Departure was made on the left wing tank, and he switched to the right inboard tank on the climb.

According to an inspector from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), the left elevator was crushed and bent, the left wing struts were bowed, and the firewall was wrinkled. He reported that the fuel in the left wing tank, the carburetor, and the main fuel strainer was red in color, and had an oily feel when touched. In addition, the fuel selector was checked and found to operative with no blockage; the main fuel sump was not blocked; no problems were noted with the carburetor float, and the main jet on the carburetor was absent of debris.

Although the pilot and FAA inspector did not report the same fuel tank as containing the red colored fuel, both were in agreement that the one tank contained the red colored fuel.

The operator told the FAA inspector that the red color was from an additive placed in the fuel tank, at a rate of one quart for each refueling. Examination of the engine revealed low compression on all cylinders, ranging from 44/80 to 5/80. Air bypass was noted on all exhaust valves, and on two of the intake valves. The number two cylinder was removed, and evidence consistent with detonation was found on the surface of the piston, and on the valves.

According to the FAA inspector, the additive that was added to the fuel was Marvel Mystery Oil. An empty 1 gallon can of Marvel Mystery Oil was found in the operator's trash. Instructions found on the can stated that the correct ratio for mixing with fuel was 1 part additive to 100 parts fuel. The contents of Marvel Mystery Oil were 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard.

In a telephone interview, the pilot reported that the manager of Aerial Signs told him that the oil had been added.

The Chief Pilot reported that there were no specific procedures for the use of Marvel Mystery Oil, no written direction, and it was not being used anymore.

The Manager of Aerial Signs reported that he had told his pilots to not use Marvel Mystery Oil any more. In addition, he talked to the mechanics, and they had not added it and the pilot reported that he had not added it.

According to Lycoming Service Instruction No. 1014M, dated May 22, 1995, the use of fuel additives was not recommended, and voided the engine warranty.


OK, enough of this ridiculous internet misinformation. The above quote is the actual NTSB report with certain sentences emphasized.

Here is what we know:

1. Marvel Mystery Oil contains the components listed in the Lab analysis and nothing more. No form of any triglyceride was found in the OTS samples we tested. The formula has not changed since it's original brew. Even the old TCP form of phosphates are still being used.

Conclusion: If lard was found in the MMO samples by the NTSB, it had to have been put into the 1 Gal. can by someone doing a "homebrew" mix.

Was one or more of the mechanic's at the Operator's facility doing an experiment?

Was some mechanic at the Operator's facility not happy with this specific pilot or a previous pilot? Had a previous pilot added this mix at the conclusion of a previous flight?

Notice this specific sentence below:

Quote:
...The Manager of Aerial Signs reported that he had told his pilots to not use Marvel Mystery Oil any more.In addition, he talked to the mechanics, and they had not added it and the pilot [of the failed flight] reported that he had not added it...


AaaHaa. So the Manager was apparently aware of MMO's use at THIS facility.

Last edited by MolaKule; 10/11/16 11:17 AM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4223240
10/11/16 11:24 AM
10/11/16 11:24 AM
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MolaKule Offline
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editor timeout so this is repeated here:

Notice this specific sentence below:

Quote:

...The Manager of Aerial Signs reported that he had told his pilots to not use Marvel Mystery Oil any more. In addition, he talked to the mechanics, and they had not added it and the pilot [of the failed flight] reported that he had not added it...



AaaHaa. So the Manager was apparently aware of MMO's use at THIS facility, and the piliot reported that the manager had "encouraged" the use of MMO to the fuel. Ignorance of adding an OTC fuel additive almost got this pilot killed.

Quote:
...In a telephone interview, the pilot reported that the manager of Aerial Signs told him that the oil had been added...


So now everyone at this facility is denying the use of MMO in order to stay out of the Hot Seat, which is typical, even though Lycoming said not to use ANY fuel additive.

Last edited by MolaKule; 10/11/16 11:35 AM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4224442
10/13/16 03:52 AM
10/13/16 03:52 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
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Taiwan
Ducked Offline
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Some sloppy wording floating around here. You'd think they'd be more careful in this sort of context, especially in the USA, where I've heard there are one or two lawyers.

This is apparently "official" text, though there is probably a fuller version.

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviati...A181&akey=1

"An empty 1 gallon can of Marvel Mystery Oil was found in the operator's trash. Instructions found on the can stated that the correct ratio for mixing with fuel was 1 part additive to 100 parts fuel. The contents of Marvel Mystery Oil were 74 percent mineral oil, 25 percent stoddard solvent, and 1 percent lard."

That's ambiguous. It unclear whether it's talking about the contents of this "empty" can or whether its intended to be a general statement on the composition of Marvel Mystery Oil, or based on another sample.

Strictly speaking (which is how you should speak, and certainly write, in this context) if they meant this can they should have said so, and the phrase Marvel Mystery Oil should not be there, since it precludes the addition of anything else.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: MolaKule] #4224519
10/13/16 07:44 AM
10/13/16 07:44 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
enough of this ridiculous internet misinformation.


Why ridiculous? Even if its untrue for the sample or samples you have tested, that doesn't make it ridiculous.

As I am sure you are more fully aware than just about anybody, there's a long history of animal and vegetable fat use in lubricant, and a lot of current interest in improving the performance of biolubricants by genetic or chemical modifications such as esterification, epoxidation, and hydrogenation.

At first sight, a National Transportation Safety Board report doesn't easily fit into the category "ridiculous internet misinformation". though considered more closely it does look a bit dodgy.


Originally Posted By: MolaKule


Here is what we know:

1. Marvel Mystery Oil contains the components listed in the Lab analysis and nothing more. No form of any triglyceride was found in the OTS samples we tested. The formula has not changed since it's original brew. Even the old TCP form of phosphates are still being used.



No, that is what you knew, but have only just now revealed, perhaps because it took you three goes and some very direct pointers to work out what was being discussed.

Unless I missed it, the lab report info you originally shared gives the concentrations of the elements phosphorus and potassium but gives no indication as to what compounds they were present in, nor does it contain any of the other information above.

All that said, looked at more closely, the accident report summary that sparked this discussion does look surprisingly dodgy. Sloppy wording aside, IF they did an analysis of anything, why not the fuel in the aircraft (carburettor or tank) rather than a can they found in the rubbish?

As it is, they seem to have concluded that this incident was caused by fuel additive, but have not confirmed

(a) that additive was in use (though it seems likely)
(b) how much was in use
(c) that the engine damage reported was caused, or was likely to have been caused, by the additive
(d) that the engine damage reported caused the crash.

I suppose resources for light aircraft incident investigation are limited, and the rules of evidence only apply if there's a court case, but even so, its not very convincing.

Last edited by Ducked; 10/13/16 07:48 AM. Reason: CMA
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4224603
10/13/16 10:42 AM
10/13/16 10:42 AM
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MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
Unless I missed it, the lab report info you originally shared gives the concentrations of the elements phosphorus and potassium but gives no indication as to what compounds they were present in, nor does it contain any of the other information above.


No, more than just those two elements were revealed.

I think Ducked did miss the point and didn't read the linked reference. Physical Chemistry entails the use of Analytical Chemistry instrumentation and was used to analyze the samples right out of the bottles.

In analyzing the molecular structure we used analytical instrumentation such as
1. spectroscopic instrumentation which analyzes the Rotational, Vibrational, and Electronic structure,
2. spectroscopic instrumentation that analyzes the Magnetic domain, such as NMR.

If any "lardic" components had shown up, the triglycerides would have shown up in one or more of the spectroscopic studies. You might want to google "lard" and "triglycerides."

By comparing the structure of the virgin chemistry (such as the various phosphates) with the resulting structures and graphics resulting from analysis of the compounds (MMO), we can determine the exact makeup of the resulting compound.

The main point Ducked missed is that it is apparent that the MMO was contaminated or doctored with something over and above than what comes from the manf./blender.

To make a sweeping statement to say that MMO contains lard, as it comes from the manf./blender, is ludicrous, and this is the Internet misinformation to which I was pointing.

So I await Ducked's analysis to refute our Lab's analysis, or to shed light on other compounds that our quarter-mil+ Lab instrumentation failed to find.


The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4224607
10/13/16 10:51 AM
10/13/16 10:51 AM
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MolaKule Offline
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Quote:
No, more than just those two elements were revealed.


Editor timeout again.

Other compounds were revealed in "addition" to those two elements mentioned.


Originally Posted By: Ducked
As I am sure you are more fully aware than just about anybody, there's a long history of animal and vegetable fat use in lubricant, and a lot of current interest in improving the performance of biolubricants by genetic or chemical modifications such as esterification, epoxidation, and hydrogenation.


And that has zero reference with respect to the contamination of this compound.

And yes, the wording of the NTSB investigation and report was sloppy in terms of analysis and the chain-of-evidence.

If the MMO has been 'doctored" I can see where the lard would have lowered the pour point of the fuel and clogged the fuel line and carb passageways.

Last edited by MolaKule; 10/13/16 11:02 AM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: MolaKule] #4225194
10/14/16 06:43 AM
10/14/16 06:43 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule


So I await Ducked's analysis to refute our Lab's analysis, or to shed light on other compounds that our quarter-mil+ Lab instrumentation failed to find.


Not necessary.

As I thought I made quite clear, my objection was to your use of the word "ridiculous". If you thought I was questioning your laboratories analytical competence or the price tag on your equipment, then you again missed the point.

My point was mainly that there is nothing inherently ridiculous in the idea of animal fats in a product like MMO, and secondarily that the rather limited analytical information you originally provided didn't seem to exclude that possibility.

If you now say you can, I have no reason to disbelieve you.

Re the light aircraft accident, with that quality of investigation and reporting, who knows? But IIRC the report specifically says that the carburettor was not clogged.


Last edited by Ducked; 10/14/16 06:52 AM.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4225497
10/14/16 04:21 PM
10/14/16 04:21 PM
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MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
[quote=MolaKule]

...My point was mainly that there is nothing inherently ridiculous in the idea of animal fats in a product like MMO, and secondarily that the rather limited analytical information you originally provided didn't seem to exclude that possibility...





Bottom line is, is there was anything else found in our analysis, then the chemistry would have been reported, so it did exclude the possibly of fatty acids or esters.


Last edited by MolaKule; 10/14/16 04:26 PM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4225730
10/14/16 10:11 PM
10/14/16 10:11 PM
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Ducked Offline
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quote=MolaKule]
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


...My point was mainly that there is nothing inherently ridiculous in the idea of animal fats in a product like MMO, and secondarily that the rather limited analytical information you originally provided didn't seem to exclude that possibility...





Bottom line is, is there was anything else found in our analysis, then the chemistry would have been reported, so it did exclude the possibly of fatty acids or esters.



OK, but you didn't give the source of the phosphorous in the original analysis, which allowed the speculation that at least some of it could have been from animal fat phospholipid, though I think there's far too much there to have come from 1% lard alone.

The source of the phosphorous wasn't given until page 4 of the thread, after speculation by some other posters, where you wrote

"It's TCP because there is was no appreciable sulfur found."

I'm afraid I didn't read that far the first time, but on current form you'll be able to relate to that.

Anyway, my original question was "Can you confirm the lard" and you've er...disconfirmed it, so we got there in the end.

Re the light aircraft accident, Speculation City (that should be an actual city in the US, surely?) but IF it was used at 1:100, and IF there was 1% lard in the original can, that's only, what, 100mg/L?

Is that likely to be enough to significantly lower pour point?

Last edited by Ducked; 10/14/16 10:12 PM.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4225806
10/15/16 01:55 AM
10/15/16 01:55 AM
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It could fall out of suspension in the cold fuel lines/Filter and clog them like cholesterol in arteries


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Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Jetronic] #4225972
10/15/16 10:10 AM
10/15/16 10:10 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: Jetronic
It could fall out of suspension in the cold fuel lines/Filter and clog them like cholesterol in arteries


Maybe, but I'd expect petrol (with or without MMO) would be quite a good fat solvent, the conditions and altitude were not extreme, and 4WIW the report is quoted above as saying

"the main fuel sump was not blocked; no problems were noted with the carburetor float, and the main jet on the carburetor was absent of debris. "

However, I suppose a cold-precipitated material could go back into solution when warmed up on the ground.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4226701
10/16/16 11:39 AM
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Iowegia - USA
Originally Posted By: Ducked



...OK, but you didn't give the source of the phosphorous in the original analysis, which allowed the speculation that at least some of it could have been from animal fat phospholipid, though I think there's far too much there to have come from 1% lard alone.

The source of the phosphorous wasn't given until page 4 of the thread, after speculation by some other posters, where you wrote...


Anyway, my original question was "Can you confirm the lard" and you've er...disconfirmed it, so we got there in the end.



I didn't think I had to give the source of the phosphorus since the original analysis was to answer the question: is there a lab analysis of MMO without the "hype" and misinformation provided by the Internet.

Speculation of phos-based lipids was brought up much later after the original analysis.

If there were any questions about the results of the MMO lab analysis, why not go to that thread and ask the question there?

BTW, here are how the tests went down.

Nine advanced Physical Chemistry students were divided into three groups. These three groups were given directions to go to retail stores on the weekend and randomly list a series of hydrocarbon-based products they would like to test. Why hydrocarbon-based products? Because this was one of three subject matter topics for this course. (The other two subject matter topics for the semester delt with pharmaceuticals and personal care products).

A committee of profs from the Chemistry, Physics, and Mechanical Engineering departments, plus lab assistants, culled the list to make the list fit within the allotted budget. The Uni provided a check to procure three of each of the products on the culled list.

Each of the three teams then had to analyze each of the three samples from the culled list with the lab's instrumentation. Each of the three teams could not discuss their ongoing analysis with any other team. Each team's results were then inspected for familiarity with instrumentation, accuracy, and the thoroughness of their reports.


I can assure you that shortly after the time of the phos-based lipids statement, there was internet misinformation going around about lard in MMO simply because someone mentioned it on BITOG.

Last edited by MolaKule; 10/16/16 11:54 AM.

The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4227209
10/16/16 10:34 PM
10/16/16 10:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 195
New Mexico USA
CCI Offline
CCI  Offline

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 195
New Mexico USA
Quote:
Then there's the hydrogenation / trans-fats modifications, a la Crisco, which are supposed to increase stability.


As an aside that some folks here might find interesting, I have been building old Harley (Panhead / Shovelhead / Ironhead) motors for a little over 30 years. I use a Sunnen hone on the cylinders, works better than anything else I've found, can't beat it for accuracy of fit or longevity of the finished product.

And the best honing lubricant I have found for cast iron? Crisco and ATF. Seriously. I rub a thin layer of Crisco all over the cylinder wall, squirt in a little ATF, and off we go. The stones last longer, the cut stays nice and cool, very smooth, no chatter, great cutting speed, minimal clean up with the Flex hone, works great.

I am of course wondering if the nickel hydrogenation process has anything to do with it.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: Ducked] #4227636
10/17/16 01:21 PM
10/17/16 01:21 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,653
down in the park
Jetronic Offline
Jetronic  Offline

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Posts: 3,653
down in the park
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
It could fall out of suspension in the cold fuel lines/Filter and clog them like cholesterol in arteries


Maybe, but I'd expect petrol (with or without MMO) would be quite a good fat solvent, the conditions and altitude were not extreme, and 4WIW the report is quoted above as saying

"the main fuel sump was not blocked; no problems were noted with the carburetor float, and the main jet on the carburetor was absent of debris. "

However, I suppose a cold-precipitated material could go back into solution when warmed up on the ground.


I suppose the anniline point could be determined for the fuel, and that could give a clue about how soluble the fuel is at cold temperatures.


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Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4227806
10/17/16 06:21 PM
10/17/16 06:21 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 666
Pindorama
Ohle_Manezzini Offline
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Posts: 666
Pindorama
Or maybe the guy was trying to do a piston soak while in flight. How much add should have to make a blue fuel to become pink in a fuel tank. I believe way more than 50%. Avgas is designed to become transparent incolor, when some other liquid as fuel od add is added to it.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4229894
10/20/16 01:13 PM
10/20/16 01:13 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,265
Rabbit Creek, Alaska
jayg Offline
jayg  Offline

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Rabbit Creek, Alaska
Originally Posted By: JeepWJ19
So what exactly was revealed about MMO that hasn't already been stated?


Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
The Lard part laugh


The rumors of their recipe has been out there for years and has been brought up on here many times over the last decade.


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Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4242753
11/06/16 07:26 AM
11/06/16 07:26 AM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,131
Southeast Texas
gfh77665 Offline
gfh77665  Offline

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,131
Southeast Texas
LARD HAVE MERCY!!!

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: gfh77665] #4242758
11/06/16 07:36 AM
11/06/16 07:36 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 24
U.K.
dervdave Offline
dervdave  Offline

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 24
U.K.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
LARD HAVE MERCY!!!


Haha !

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: gfh77665] #4242796
11/06/16 08:23 AM
11/06/16 08:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,884
Iowegia - USA
MolaKule Offline
Global Moderator
MolaKule  Offline
Global Moderator

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,884
Iowegia - USA
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
LARD HAVE MERCY!!!
crackmeup


The only limitations we have are the ones we place upon ourselves.
Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #4243096
11/06/16 03:54 PM
11/06/16 03:54 PM
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 666
Pindorama
Ohle_Manezzini Offline
Ohle_Manezzini  Offline

Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 666
Pindorama
Lard, plus the esters that forms from gasohol combustion = clean engine, rsrsrsrs.

Re: Marvel Mystery Oil revealed ... [Re: BrocLuno] #5000901
02/04/19 03:14 AM
02/04/19 03:14 AM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 42
AR
Sayonara_Sonata Offline
Sayonara_Sonata  Offline

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 42
AR
Love a good MMO thread, so I thought I'd share the latest, perhaps dare I say, greatest thing to come down the pike since MMO?
I present a video that could only be mo' bettah if the new & improved solvent had been mixed w/ATF.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ql_gDzIufo

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