What is the most stringent Euro specification now?

[deven]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: deven
Just look for A3/B3-B4 spec. Can't get any tougher than this

Yes you certainly can.

OK wrong choice of words. What I meant was that most automobiles don't need anything more than a A3/B4 rated oil

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted By: deven
OK wrong choice of words. What I meant was that most automobiles don't need anything more than a A3/B4 rated oil


Agreed, but that's not really what this thread was trying to answer/discuss.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: Solarent
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Solarent
As near as I can tell there shouldn't be an issue with M1FS 0W40 meeting LL-01, it has the right base, high enough HTHS and it's not like the registrations fees are too crazy (expensive but not a big deal for someone like Mobil) maybe they let their release lapse and haven't renewed yet?

According to responses from XOM customer service, they claim there was a recent change in LL-01 specification and that's why they no longer meet it. But it's strange that they only dropped the LL-01 approval when they introduced the FS variant.



Yes that is weird. I'm pretty confident nothing has changed here except that they made the approval process available online, it is a little more rigorous and requires an audit of the manufacturing facility's quality program and samples to be sent to BMW for testing. Maybe the with the process change, the fee's also changed and Mobil wasn't happy about it? But it's really not that bad - comparable to Dexos1 or other similar OEM registrations - no where near what Cummins charges... maybe they want to push BMW owners to ESP as it has LL-04? Maybe they think that LL-01 is now close to 15 years old and not worth it?

In my opinion, and I stick to this, M1 with new FS version cannot meet LL-01 currently until they cook something better.
Also, M1 is still keeping VISOM version in EU, biggest market for BMW, and that tells a lot.
Registration fees are not problem, I think problem is much deeper and more complicated.

 

[weasley]

Perhaps XOM had an approval under the older protocol which only recently expired and for whatever reason they didn't/couldn't apply for a re-approval.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Solarent
But it's really not that bad - comparable to Dexos1 or other similar OEM registrations - no where near what Cummins charges... maybe they want to push BMW owners to ESP as it has LL-04? Maybe they think that LL-01 is now close to 15 years old and not worth it?

Imperial Oil just wants BMW people to use Mobil Super 3000 LL-01 in the big drum.

Or, maybe they're peeved at the BMW/Shell arrangement. I already said months ago what the "FS" stands for.

 

[Solarent]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Solarent
But it's really not that bad - comparable to Dexos1 or other similar OEM registrations - no where near what Cummins charges... maybe they want to push BMW owners to ESP as it has LL-04? Maybe they think that LL-01 is now close to 15 years old and not worth it?

Imperial Oil just wants BMW people to use Mobil Super 3000 LL-01 in the big drum.

Or, maybe they're peeved at the BMW/Shell arrangement. I already said months ago what the "FS" stands for.

That is hilarious.

I don't know what they would have to be mad about - it's not like they had the business before that - it was Castrol's. My oil fill cap still says "BMW Recommends Castrol"

 

[Garak]

Don't ruin my hypothesis of what "FS" stands for.

Seriously, though, if Mobil Super 3000 in the drums meets LL-01, I can't see Mobil having great difficulty making an oil to meet the spec.

 

[glxpassat]

I think there's only one reason for this - money, as they're probably more profitable losing some customers driving older BMW's and using the newer base oil. Had BMW continued to use it at the dealers and as factory fill, I'm sure it would still meet the spec.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Solarent
My oil fill cap still says "BMW Recommends Castrol"

You need to get a replacement cap ASAP!

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: glxpassat
I think there's only one reason for this - money, as they're probably more profitable losing some customers driving older BMW's and using the newer base oil. Had BMW continued to use it at the dealers and as factory fill, I'm sure it would still meet the spec.

When did BMW used Mobil1 as their oil?

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Solarent
My oil fill cap still says "BMW Recommends Castrol"

You need to get a replacement cap ASAP!

I am not sure whether my engine will perform well since that decision

 

[glxpassat]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: glxpassat
I think there's only one reason for this - money, as they're probably more profitable losing some customers driving older BMW's and using the newer base oil. Had BMW continued to use it at the dealers and as factory fill, I'm sure it would still meet the spec.

When did BMW used Mobil1 as their oil?


Whoops, my bad, I had something else on my mind.

 

[OldEuroCarLover]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Solarent
My oil fill cap still says "BMW Recommends Castrol"

You need to get a replacement cap ASAP!

I've actually been wondering if BMW are planning to update the part number for the oil cap with a version that mentions Pennzoil. I wouldn't put it past them. I once overheard someone arguing with the parts guy at the dealership over the legitimacy of BMW branded oil because the oil cap says Castrol on it.

 

[weasley]

Originally Posted By: OldEuroCarLover
I've actually been wondering if BMW are planning to update the part number for the oil cap with a version that mentions Pennzoil.


But BMW don't recommend Pennzoil, or Shell - they recommend BMW oil (which is currently supplied by Shell).
In the past they specifically recommended Castrol oil. Now it seems they would rather push their own brand.

 

[Saxon78]

Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
For gas engines, what is the most stringent oil specification nowadays?


Probably MB 229.5/51 ?

MB spec details 2012

ACEA 2012

Enjoy!

 

[UncleDave]

Originally Posted By: zveroboy
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
For gas engines, what is the most stringent oil specification nowadays?


Probably MB 229.5/51 ?

MB spec details 2012

ACEA 2012

Enjoy!

229.52 - even harder to find. Very hard to find in Cali.

UD

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: UncleDave
Originally Posted By: zveroboy
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
For gas engines, what is the most stringent oil specification nowadays?


Probably MB 229.5/51 ?

MB spec details 2012

ACEA 2012

Enjoy!

229.52 - even harder to find. Very hard to find in Cali.

UD

Actually, 229.52 is not at all more stringent then 229.51. 229.52 has to do with fuel economy. Mobil1 0W30 X1 meets this spec and you can get it on Amazon.
It is made for modern diesel engines, but considering SAPS levels I think M1 5W30 ESP is still much better oil.
As for most stringent, apparently updated BMW LL-01 is most stringent.

 

[volodymyr]

edyvw,

Originally Posted By: edyvw
As for most stringent, apparently updated BMW LL-01 is most stringent.


Do you have some links for the new spec to share with us? It seems like Lubrizol is not updated and does not contain any info about this new spec. I don't see it here http://www.oilspecifications.org/bmw.php either ...

 

[UncleDave]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: UncleDave
Originally Posted By: zveroboy
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
For gas engines, what is the most stringent oil specification nowadays?


Probably MB 229.5/51 ?

MB spec details 2012

ACEA 2012

Enjoy!

229.52 - even harder to find. Very hard to find in Cali.

UD

Actually, 229.52 is not at all more stringent then 229.51. 229.52 has to do with fuel economy. Mobil1 0W30 X1 meets this spec and you can get it on Amazon.
It is made for modern diesel engines, but considering SAPS levels I think M1 5W30 ESP is still much better oil.
As for most stringent, apparently updated BMW LL-01 is most stringent.


Pretty sure its more than economy, I've read that there is a different oxidation spec for .52 in several places including here on bitog.

http://www.ingelbeen.be/en/news/p/detail/brand-new-mb-claim-229-52-for-mobil-1-esp-0w-30

Ive been using the 2 oils that I could actually get that meet spec the M1 0w30 ESP, and the MB oil. (off Amazon) and there was a recent thread that posted an MB link with a bunch of choices, but they are still comparatively hard to find.

Most oil companies only have none to 1 product thats 229.52 compliant.

UD

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: UncleDave
I've read that there is a different oxidation spec for .52

Correct. 229.52 has stricter oxidation requirements...