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WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? #4117744 06/07/16 01:25 PM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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So I've been battling with my WISP for two months now regarding an unstable connection. I'm wanting three opinions: what is wrong, what should be done, and who is at fault.

The problem:
I am served by an old TV tower 5 linear (as the bird flies) miles away. Driving, it's 7 miles (3 East, 4 North). My radio is on a 25' tall pole. I have had this service for a year now. There have been issues, but all unrelated, and all were solved. My issue is an erratic ping/latency and UL speed. Let me stress my DL speed is/has been excellent. After some extensive research and testing, I have discovered jitter is also erratic.

This company strives to give you the bandwidth you pay for, even allowing a 1/2 Mbps over your plan for both DL and UL speeds. My plan is 2 Mbps Up/Down for $50/month. I do use this service for gaming, among other things. And before anyone says it's not fast enough, let me say when it works properly it IS. (Note: I am actually set to 3.4 up/down due to what they called "interference" from the beginning.) But a poor UL, ping, and jitter definitely contribute to an unusable environment. And a key stat here is my UL has a major hesitation (measured sometimes in whole seconds) before actually transmitting any data.

They have tried to help, but shrug off the problem (even citing my router to be at fault). For two months I've gone WAY out of my way to prove nothing on my end is wrong (countless speed tests, using different methods, sites, and stats). Then after slapping them with this concrete evidence their connection is lousy, they finally admit fault.

Their solution? Raise the radio higher. They are claiming foliage is blocking the line of sight. But what is totally [censored] off is they will NOT fix it on their own. They want ME to pay for BOTH equipment and labor! I'm no expert, but if foliage was truly the answer, wouldn't that affect my DL speed as well? Because again, it is virtually perfect. And I'm sorry, but when I paid $200 for installation, it should have been installed correctly the first time. What do I mean? Trees don't grow 50' in 1 year. If I was that close to a bad signal, why weren't preventive measures taken originally? Why wasn't it raised higher in the first place?

Let me also state that this company is my ONLY source of internet. NOBODY else can provide service. Period. So I can't just switch to someone else.

So again what I'm after is what do you think the problem is (does foliage interference sound correct)? Do you feel they should be responsible for fixing it? I feel over $100 to raise my radio ($75 service fee + equipment) is wrong. I'm honestly considering just dropping them. But I want outside opinions, maybe I'm crazy... Thanks for reading, and thanks in advance for your input!


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
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Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4117745 06/07/16 01:33 PM
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cpayne5 Offline
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RF is tricky. Any idea what frequency they're using? 900mhz, 2.4ghz, 5ghz

Can you do a traceroute? If their entire network is routed, and they have a bad link somewhere, a trace route may reveal it.

Could very well be foliage. Could be a hundred other things, too, though.

Here's a WISP users forum. You can post anonymously - no need to register.
https://www.dslreports.com/forum/wireless

Good luck.

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4117750 06/07/16 01:39 PM
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Pop_Rivit Offline
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Your service tech should be able to determine if foliage is an issue by looking at the signal strength of the receiver. If you can access the receiver location safely, you can also just sight along it and make sure the line of sight is clear. Line of sight can affect jitter and latency without having a major impact on download speed.

It should be pretty easy to determine if the issue is with your router-just plug a laptop or computer directly into the receiver-if the results are the same then it's the ISP's issue, not yours.

And if it's not? Then any equipment upgrades are on your dime, including raising your antenna to the proper height. I would require a guarantee that raising it will fix the issue if I were you.

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4117752 06/07/16 01:43 PM
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Kool1 Offline
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If you are being blocked by foliage on someone else's property, neither you nor the internet service provider can get them to remove the foliage. Even if you raise your radio higher, if foliage is the problem, the problem will return in time.

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4117758 06/07/16 01:49 PM
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mk378 Offline
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What kind of radio is it? Some Ubiquiti radios (mostly NanoStation loco) made 1 or 2 years ago had a bug where the Ethernet port would shut down for up to 5 seconds at a time. The only solution is to replace the hardware.

You can test that by trying to ping the radio's IP (not a remote IP). If the port is offline it will not answer pings until it resets itself.

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: cpayne5] #4117860 06/07/16 05:01 PM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: cpayne5
RF is tricky. Any idea what frequency they're using? 900mhz, 2.4ghz, 5ghz

Can you do a traceroute? If their entire network is routed, and they have a bad link somewhere, a trace route may reveal it.
I think they said 5.8ghz. If not then 5. I don't know what a traceroute is or how to do it, but I am a quick learner and am fairly technically savvy. Explain?


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
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Current stash: 216 quarts
Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: Pop_Rivit] #4117866 06/07/16 05:04 PM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
Your service tech should be able to determine if foliage is an issue by looking at the signal strength of the receiver. If you can access the receiver location safely, you can also just sight along it and make sure the line of sight is clear. Line of sight can affect jitter and latency without having a major impact on download speed.

It should be pretty easy to determine if the issue is with your router-just plug a laptop or computer directly into the receiver-if the results are the same then it's the ISP's issue, not yours.

And if it's not? Then any equipment upgrades are on your dime, including raising your antenna to the proper height. I would require a guarantee that raising it will fix the issue if I were you.
As I stated, it IS their problem. They have admitted something is wrong and it's not my router (the only equipment I'm responsible for). So that being said, who should flip the bill? The tip on the written guarantee is interesting though, will do.


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
\/SP & WIX FTW
Current stash: 216 quarts
Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: mk378] #4117868 06/07/16 05:07 PM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: mk378
What kind of radio is it? Some Ubiquiti radios (mostly NanoStation loco) made 1 or 2 years ago had a bug where the Ethernet port would shut down for up to 5 seconds at a time. The only solution is to replace the hardware.

You can test that by trying to ping the radio's IP (not a remote IP). If the port is offline it will not answer pings until it resets itself.
I'm not sure what model, but know they only use Ubiquiti equipment. How do I ping the radio IP? Sorry, learning as I go...

Edit: I think it is a NanoBridge. That's the Google result that looks closest.

Last edited by tony1679; 06/07/16 05:14 PM.

'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
\/SP & WIX FTW
Current stash: 216 quarts
Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4117924 06/07/16 06:38 PM
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dave1251 Offline
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Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
Your service tech should be able to determine if foliage is an issue by looking at the signal strength of the receiver. If you can access the receiver location safely, you can also just sight along it and make sure the line of sight is clear. Line of sight can affect jitter and latency without having a major impact on download speed.

It should be pretty easy to determine if the issue is with your router-just plug a laptop or computer directly into the receiver-if the results are the same then it's the ISP's issue, not yours.

And if it's not? Then any equipment upgrades are on your dime, including raising your antenna to the proper height. I would require a guarantee that raising it will fix the issue if I were you.
As I stated, it IS their problem. They have admitted something is wrong and it's not my router (the only equipment I'm responsible for). So that being said, who should flip the bill? The tip on the written guarantee is interesting though, will do.


How have you determined it is their problem? Have you tested with a spectrum analyzer? ETE testing? What was done to definitely say it is their problem?


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Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4118058 06/07/16 09:54 PM
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BeerCan Offline
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nanobridge has a spectrum analyzer built in. Do you have access to airos?


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Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: dave1251] #4118168 06/08/16 02:33 AM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: dave1251
How have you determined it is their problem? Have you tested with a spectrum analyzer? ETE testing? What was done to definitely say it is their problem?
Care to explain what this stuff is? I am genuinely trying to learn in order to aid the process. No, none of this was done (that I know of). But shouldn't my WISP do that before assuming and charging me $100+? shrug All I know is that they have admitted there is a problem, and that the only thing I am responsible for is my router, which has been proven good (by eliminating it for testing, identical bad results).


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
\/SP & WIX FTW
Current stash: 216 quarts
Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: BeerCan] #4118169 06/08/16 02:34 AM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: BeerCan
nanobridge has a spectrum analyzer built in. Do you have access to airos?
Never heard of it. So...no? I will look into this. What would this shed light on?


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 83k
'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
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Current stash: 216 quarts
Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4118232 06/08/16 06:33 AM
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madRiver Offline
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There is no cell reception with LTE or 3G locally?

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: tony1679] #4118420 06/08/16 10:57 AM
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mk378 Offline
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Originally Posted By: tony1679
I'm not sure what model, but know they only use Ubiquiti equipment. How do I ping the radio IP? Sorry, learning as I go...

Edit: I think it is a NanoBridge. That's the Google result that looks closest.


The radio is like a router it has an IP and a tiny web page server that (if you have the password) can be used to examine status, change settings, and activate the spectrum analyzer feature. Depending on how the network is set up, you may see the radio's IP as the WAN IP on your router. Or you may not. The company could tell you.

Re: WISP Internet Problems (Technical) WWYD? [Re: madRiver] #4118455 06/08/16 11:27 AM
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tony1679 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: madRiver
There is no cell reception with LTE or 3G locally?
Yes, LTE is available, so I guess technically I was wrong, but I can't use anything with a low data cap. There are some months where I can chew 70+GB.


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'13 Honda Civic 1.8L 55k
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