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Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles #4113696 06/02/16 09:32 PM
Joined: Sep 2014
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Oro_O Offline OP
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Cut open below is a new Super Tech 3614 I ran on our 2002 Lexus ES300 for 1,550 miles. The fill was Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30, and some ATF and Kerosene flush at the end.

Miles on filter: 1,550
Miles on Oil: 7,150
Miles on engine: 256,300 (Toyota 1mz-fe)
Fill: Pennz. Platinum 10w-30, and some ATF and K-1 to flush at end of run.
Refill: M1 10w-30 HM and CarQuest Premium Blue (Wix)

Skip on down to the pics if you don't need petty detail, which follows here: wink

The reason for the short filter interval was that I had a Motorcraft FL-400S on it prior, intending to use it the full 7,500 OCI, 256,300 miles total on engine. It would leak down after more than a day sitting idle. Since this is a rare occurrence, I did not rush to change it. When it got worse, I put this filter on to finish out the OCI. The dissection of the FL-400s that couldn't hold oil is here. There are some links in the thread to others who are currently having the same drain-back problem with MC filters:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4078766/Motorcraft_FL-400s_that_leaked

The filter may have a red tinge to it because I ran 1/2 qt of ATF in it the last 50 miles. it's usually used that amount in the OCI so I make up the difference with ATF for the 50 miles before I drain it for a little extra cleaning. After that, and this is not normal practice, I also drained a quart of the fill out and added a quart of K-1 kerosene and idled it 20 minutes before draining. Results of this were, on this particular car, negligible because this is a clean engine, easy on oil, and has been on synthetics a while, and I have been adding a small amount of ATF before the change for several years.

It's sturdily built as all Wix filters seem to be. The media was a bit "hairier" than I've seen on any other filter, but to no ill effect I can imagine. And importantly, the base and ADBV did not leak down overnight!

Lots of room to stretch out between the pleats; a man could get comfortable:


Seam was solid; I poked at it so spread it a bit:





Pliable, effective ADBV (base points down on this engine):

Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4113718 06/02/16 09:50 PM
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nwjones18 Offline
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I cannot fathom needing/wanting to run a quart of kerosene or top off with ATF on any car, but if it works for you have at it. Filter looks solid. Thanks for the cut and post.


2016 Ram 1500 5.7 Hemi 30k QSUD 5w-20 and Mopar filter
1988 F-150. 4.9 I6 251k. 10w-40 QSHM Motorcraft FL1A
2007 Mazda 3 2.3 130k 5w-30 syn-blend and Denso filter
Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: nwjones18] #4113719 06/02/16 09:52 PM
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crazyoildude Offline
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i would never run atf in a motor either although kerosene was popular years ago i understand. With me it was always MMO

Did that super tech have louvers?

Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4113729 06/02/16 10:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 462
oilmutt Offline
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Thanks for sharring,did you ever think of using baake fluid as a cleaner?


'05 Chevy Malibu 6cyl,119k, Syn. Oil (owned)
'16 Toyota Camry,4cyl 25k Syn oil (leased)
'92 Ford Tempo ,4cly 26k Conv oil (managed)
Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: crazyoildude] #4113794 06/02/16 11:31 PM
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Oro_O Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
i would never run atf in a motor either although kerosene was popular years ago i understand. With me it was always MMO

Did that super tech have louvers?


ATF/MMO about the same effect in the sump. The ATF is cheaper so I put it once in a while for the different addpac and dispersants. This practice is ages-old, too - many older mechanics have done it since the 50s.

If you look clearly, it has circular punches in the center tube. Other than the cheap-ish media, it was quite a sturdy unit.

Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4113811 06/03/16 12:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,310
gathermewool Offline
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Originally Posted By: Oro_O
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
i would never run atf in a motor either although kerosene was popular years ago i understand. With me it was always MMO

Did that super tech have louvers?


ATF/MMO about the same effect in the sump. The ATF is cheaper so I put it once in a while for the different addpac and dispersants. This practice is ages-old, too - many older mechanics have done it since the 50s.

If you look clearly, it has circular punches in the center tube. Other than the cheap-ish media, it was quite a sturdy unit.


This ain't the 50s. ATF and other useless additions to a lubricating oil sump are simply a waste with no benefit. Do what makes you happy - I'm not posting to bash you - but anyone else reading this thread should know that very few people on this forum will condone any type of flush for normal use, and will oppose the addition of ATF for any purpose due to it having less benefit than an equivalent quantity of regular old motor oil.


'14 Forester XT FA20DIT (Cobb Stage 1)
Edge 0W-40 + FU filter (64,774 miles)
'15 Legacy FB25 (OEM Stage, uh, neg. 7?)
Magnatec 5W-20 + FU filter (47,300 miles)
Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4113828 06/03/16 01:23 AM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,267
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Dyusik Offline
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Filter looks good. Thanks for the c&p.
I read on here a bit ago that the atf ep add pack(sulfur I think ) will counter act the aw formulations of motor oil. Not only the oil is additive depleted (cancelled ) but also thinned. I'd just use a thinner oil grade...


95 Cherokee 190K DELO 10W30, XG8
07 IS250 111K Frankenbrew, WIX 57173 (4 sale)
04 YZF-R1 20K Frankenbrew 20w50ish, XG7317
14 RX450h 41k Idemitsu 0w20, WIX 57047
18 RAM 3500 2k VWB 15w40, DBL7349
Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4113922 06/03/16 07:04 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
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Sayjac Offline
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Value tier filter at ~$2.85, that in mind looks respectable to me. As did the virgin ST3614 posted recently.

As for cleaning procedure, not one I'd personally choose, but to each their own.

Lastly, regarding the louver query, even my ancient Toshiba laptop still with Windows XP, can clearly see the tube type in pic #3. crazy Might lead one to wonder if pwd or pwi is involved.

Thanks for pics.

Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: gathermewool] #4114040 06/03/16 09:40 AM
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Oro_O Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: gathermewool


This ain't the 50s. ATF and other useless additions to a lubricating oil sump are simply a waste with no benefit. Do what makes you happy - I'm not posting to bash you - but anyone else reading this thread should know that very few people on this forum will condone any type of flush for normal use, and will oppose the addition of ATF for any purpose due to it having less benefit than an equivalent quantity of regular old motor oil.


The problem is, the empirical evidence doesn't back your statement.

The vehicle is closing in on 300,000 miles and runs like new, and uses virtually no oil between changes - 1/2 qt. in 7.5k. It has worked on many cars for many years, mine and others. I'd love to see learn why 60 years of evidence suddenly is invalidated because a parroting of some information on internet forums is against it. If it doesn't work, I'd LOVE to see someone demonstrate that with real evidence.

Basically, you are using a fresh and slightly different additive package in a lighter carrier oil for better penetrating ability for a brief period. That it works where others fail is not surprising. The forums have MANY more "how do I fix my sticking lifters/clogged oil screen/etc." threads than they do "my engine is too clean and wore out" threads.

Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4114113 06/03/16 10:47 AM
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FutureDoc Offline
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Originally Posted By: Oro_O


The problem is, the empirical evidence doesn't back your statement.

The vehicle is closing in on 300,000 miles and runs like new, and uses virtually no oil between changes - 1/2 qt. in 7.5k. It has worked on many cars for many years, mine and others. I'd love to see learn why 60 years of evidence suddenly is invalidated because a parroting of some information on internet forums is against it. If it doesn't work, I'd LOVE to see someone demonstrate that with real evidence.

Basically, you are using a fresh and slightly different additive package in a lighter carrier oil for better penetrating ability for a brief period. That it works where others fail is not surprising. The forums have MANY more "how do I fix my sticking lifters/clogged oil screen/etc." threads than they do "my engine is too clean and wore out" threads.


Nope. Research does not work that way. You can not prove a null. You can reject it or fail to reject but that does not prove a null. So, saying there is no benefit is in line with noting the lack of solvents/dispersants in ATF compared to modern oil and the lack of benefits and riskes of kerosene. Thus, gathermewool does not have to prove "no benefit" with his comment, the burden falls to the person making a claim that there is a benefit. Now, if he was saying "harm" then maybe you can ask for evidence.

So, your claims lacks empirical evidence as well. That is why folks say no benefit. So please post your empirical evidence where you are able to say with some confidence(heck, we can keep it to a p of .95) that the method is beneficial over using a modern oil/technique.


'15 Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8 - Havoline 5w-30 & OEM
'14 Subaru Outback 2.5 - NAPA 0w-20 & Wix
'01 Toyota MR2 Spyder - Havoline 5w-30 & Wix
'82 Chevy C10
Re: Cut Open: Super Tech 3614, 1,550 miles [Re: Oro_O] #4114463 06/03/16 07:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,310
gathermewool Offline
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Originally Posted By: Oro_O
Originally Posted By: gathermewool


This ain't the 50s. ATF and other useless additions to a lubricating oil sump are simply a waste with no benefit. Do what makes you happy - I'm not posting to bash you - but anyone else reading this thread should know that very few people on this forum will condone any type of flush for normal use, and will oppose the addition of ATF for any purpose due to it having less benefit than an equivalent quantity of regular old motor oil.


The problem is, the empirical evidence doesn't back your statement.

The vehicle is closing in on 300,000 miles and runs like new, and uses virtually no oil between changes - 1/2 qt. in 7.5k. It has worked on many cars for many years, mine and others. I'd love to see learn why 60 years of evidence suddenly is invalidated because a parroting of some information on internet forums is against it. If it doesn't work, I'd LOVE to see someone demonstrate that with real evidence.

Basically, you are using a fresh and slightly different additive package in a lighter carrier oil for better penetrating ability for a brief period. That it works where others fail is not surprising. The forums have MANY more "how do I fix my sticking lifters/clogged oil screen/etc." threads than they do "my engine is too clean and wore out" threads.


Empirical, in this context, means nothing more than hearsay. What additives in ATF are doing more for your engine than any motor oil?

The vast majority of people I know have used motor oil and nothing else and driven a combined million+ miles. There's your empirical evidence.

Those who didn't check their oil or change at any appropriate interval (or ever) had issues, though they were very rare. I only know one person who seized her engine, and when asked she THOUGHT she might have had her oil changed once in the 45k+ miles she'd owned the car.

The few who decided to add motor honey or some other useless additive to fix a problem that didn't exist...also no problems.


'14 Forester XT FA20DIT (Cobb Stage 1)
Edge 0W-40 + FU filter (64,774 miles)
'15 Legacy FB25 (OEM Stage, uh, neg. 7?)
Magnatec 5W-20 + FU filter (47,300 miles)
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