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So how bad is it? #4099686 05/18/16 12:15 AM
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Kuato Offline OP
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OK so this is the 2.4L I-4 in the Wrangler in signature. Did a short interval (yes, it's a waste of Amsoil SS but wanted apples to apples from the last UOA) to check on the trend.

A little history: Had to run this Jeep on 3 cylinders once for around 200 miles when the electronic distributor failed on #4; at the same time had the head gasket failing and both were replaced around 168k. Prior to that as you can see the wear metals were very low, but they've jumped up since. I'm thinking that #4 is suffering a bit.

It still runs fine but is noisy at startup (was not noisy prior to 190k or so) for about a minute until it warms up.

Opinions?

edit: Forgot to mention that the only difference between the pre- and post- head gasket is that it was SS 5w30 prior and is now 0w30. Current fill is 5w30 and will sample again this fall.




I know what my opinion is - but would like to hear from those who know more than I.



Last edited by Kuato; 05/18/16 12:27 AM.

Thick vs Thin test: 15k / 43k miles complete
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099694 05/18/16 12:32 AM
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Marco620 Offline
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Something is going on,but I cant tell what. Could indicate rebuild but im a probee and dont know full extent. Hope it levels out though.


15' Civic 1.8 i-vtec 262,000 mi Redline 5w20, BP Cvt fluid, Archoil9100
Tornado Chaser/Doberman Whisperer
Son of a Navy Corpsman.


Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099719 05/18/16 01:09 AM
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CT8 Offline
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I wouldn't spend the money on the Amsoil or the uoas.

Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099725 05/18/16 01:18 AM
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MuzzleFlash40 Offline
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I'm going to say there was some damage caused during your break down. The combo of unburned fuel washing down #4 and coolant leaking from the head gasket. IMHO there is going to be a rebuild/replacement in it's near future.

If you're going to run it until it breaks, I would just use whatever 5w30 is the cheapest such as supertech.


18 Sonata SEL 2.4-20k
Napa Syn 5w30 & OEM
16 Santa Fe Sport AWD 2.4-75k
Syntec 5w30 & OEM
09 Silverado LT 4x4 4.8-106k
ST HM 5w30 & Fram



Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099746 05/18/16 02:02 AM
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Colt45ws Offline
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When you ran it with a dead cylinder, did you unplug the injector to prevent fuel wash down? If you had coolant in the oil, then that was probably the majority of the problem.
Agree that it is probably bearing wear since lack of chromium makes me think the pistons are fine.
This just reinforces my opinion that unless the headgasket leak was caught really early via UOA, say under a couple % coolant concentration, then replacing headgaskets just buys time. The bearings get hurt very very quickly. The money would better be put into a full rebuild or another engine.

Or a new vehicle.


I would throw in some 15W40 and run it until starts knocking.

Last edited by Colt45ws; 05/18/16 02:11 AM.

-Colton
2002 Ford Crown Vic PI 207k, Ex-Kootenai County, ID Unit #42
Down for engine swap
2003 Ford Crown Vic PI 86k
Pennzoil Conv HM 5W30, Fram XG2
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099820 05/18/16 06:19 AM
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Donald Offline
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Normally bearing wear is indicated by copper and/or lead. Neither is high enough to indicate that. Aluminum would be from the pistons and iron from the cylinder.

I am not sure there is much you can do for this engine expect to run it until is no longer runs well. Depending upon the age and condition of the vehicle a remanufactured engine may be a good idea.


2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099871 05/18/16 07:29 AM
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A_Harman Offline
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Stop wasting your money on AMSoil for this engine. Run Valvoline MaxLife from the red jug and wait for the end to come. It may surprise us all how long it will go, though.

Maybe do a compression test in cylinder 4 to see if it is low.

Last edited by A_Harman; 05/18/16 07:31 AM.

1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Colt45ws] #4099903 05/18/16 08:06 AM
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vintageant Offline
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Originally Posted By: Colt45ws



I would throw in some 15W40 and run it until starts knocking.


Agree 100% Been using HDEO 15W40 in my old engines for many years.


1925 Alvis HDEO 15W40
1937 Alvis Speed 25 20W50 w LM MoS2 & LM MOS
1970 VW Peking - Paris Rally Beetle HDEO 15W40 w LM MoS2
1987 Porsche 924S HDEO 15W40
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: vintageant] #4099955 05/18/16 09:07 AM
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Canadastang Offline
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I'd just keep on with a cheap conventional 5W30 and run it till it blows.

Honestly, it's not that bad. It could be way worse.

Re: So how bad is it? [Re: CT8] #4099963 05/18/16 09:13 AM
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69GTX Offline
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Originally Posted By: CT8
I wouldn't spend the money on the Amsoil or the uoas.


Ditto.

If you have access to Walmart M1 ($10.88/jug after $12 rebate) run the 0w-40 which is fairly close to the Amsoil SS VOA though somewhat less in Phos/Zinc. The PP/PU equivalent of that would run you about $12.


----------------

2001 Lincoln Cont 4.6L DOHC/ 50K mi / QS HM 5w30 / FUG XG2
1999 Camaro SS M6 /19K /Mobil 1 0w40 /Fram UG /GM MTL-ATF
1969 Ply GTX/RRs
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: CT8] #4099967 05/18/16 09:17 AM
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A_Harman Offline
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Originally Posted By: CT8
I wouldn't spend the money on the Amsoil or the uoas.


I think he should continue to do UOA's to monitor wear metals. 6000 mile intervals, though.


1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099979 05/18/16 09:30 AM
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KCJeep Offline
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The only thing that concerns me is the aluminum. I'd run a thick 10w30 in it if it were mine, something like Rotella or PHM.


2018 VW Passat GT VR6 - 14k - Castrol Pro OE 5w40 - VW OEM filter
2012 KIA Sedona 101k - Valvoline Maxlife 5w30
2009 Ford Focus 138k - Valvoline 5w30
2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee, gone but not forgotten.
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: A_Harman] #4099985 05/18/16 09:37 AM
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CT8 Offline
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Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: CT8
I wouldn't spend the money on the Amsoil or the uoas.


I think he should continue to do UOA's to monitor wear metals. 6000 mile intervals, though.
The engine is getting to the end of its life.

Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4099986 05/18/16 09:39 AM
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440Magnum Offline
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When you say "2.4L" I assume you mean "2.5L" The Chrysler 2.4 was a DOHC engine used in front-drives like the PT Cruiser, Cirrus/Stratus and so on. The 2.5L is a pushrod 4-cylinder derived from the 4.0L I6 and used in Jeeps (and the Dakota pickup after the older Chrysler SOHC 2.5 was dropped in the late 90s).

It got hurt by a blown head gasket. But that engine has a TON of hurt to give, just keep driving it with a good 5w30 or HDEO and I believe you'll never actually notice any problem. I'm more and more convinced that UOAs are like full-body MRI scans. They make people worry over things that will ultimately have NO impact on lifespan whatsoever.


'66 Dodge Polara & '69 Dodge Coronet R/T both 440/727
'08 Ram 1500 4.7/545RFE
'12 Challenger SRT8 392/6-speed
'99 XJ 4x4 4.0/AX15, '14 WK2 4x4 3.6/8HP
Re: So how bad is it? [Re: Kuato] #4100001 05/18/16 10:07 AM
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Miller88 Offline
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2004 Wrangler is going to have the 2.4L DOHC engine. They stopped the good AMC 2.5 in 2001. 2002+ are the 2.4.

The "Neon" family of engines are pretty good at blowing head gaskets.


18 Forester 2.5I 6M
00 Jeep XJ
01 F-350 4x4 5M
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