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Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... #4099540 05/17/16 08:29 PM
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JXW Offline OP
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6% is huge in absolute dollars, apply sales tax to just about everything. Deep pockets in the state. LOTTERY is killing it too but where does the $$ flow to?

Teachers don't get raises. Cost of loving increase is negative, the teachers get paid less year over year. Education isn't a priority.

People just accept things but reality is ugly.


Last edited by JXW; 05/17/16 08:32 PM.

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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099548 05/17/16 08:38 PM
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I'm actually kinda cool with a tax that gets "just about everything" vs one that has tons of loopholes and is easy for rich guys to skip out on.

Yeah, sales taxes are regressive, yadda yadda, but they also catch those with under-the-table income etc.

Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099553 05/17/16 08:42 PM
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8.25% in TX for everything except some foods (0%), and new vehicles (6.5%)--not sure about real estate these days. We have a lottery too and the conditions are similar for teacher's salaries.


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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099557 05/17/16 08:46 PM
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Of course no sales tax is better than a sales tax, assuming they don't bite you elsewhere...

But I do think that no tax on "necessities" (most all unprepared foods, raw foods, most clothing, medicines, etc) is the best way to go. Tax on everything else, if its going to be taxed, OK, but stuff that people really do need is best left alone. That does, IMO benefit all.

As for total receipts, regardless of source? Well there's probably not enough gas tax receipts to cover infrastructure, so some goes to that, some to legacy costs, some to handouts and entitlements that the feds don't fully pay, etc.

Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: eljefino] #4099568 05/17/16 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted By: eljefino
I'm actually kinda cool with a tax that gets "just about everything" vs one that has tons of loopholes and is easy for rich guys to skip out on.

Yeah, sales taxes are regressive, yadda yadda, but they also catch those with under-the-table income etc.


Everybody pays sales Tax, it's not based on income or reported income. It's collected at the merchant location at the time of sale.


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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099570 05/17/16 09:01 PM
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Quattro Pete Offline
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Originally Posted By: JXW
Everybody pays sales Tax,

Unless you buy stuff on the Internet. Granted, the number of online retailers still not charging sales tax is diminishing and technically you are supposed to pay that tax anyway when you file your tax return, but very few people do.

Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099578 05/17/16 09:12 PM
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NH has sales tax on "almost nothing" IIRC

Last edited by simple_gifts; 05/17/16 09:13 PM.

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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099583 05/17/16 09:18 PM
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No sales tax at all, though NH does have a meals and hotel tax. (It's 8.5%, IIRC.) Also no income tax. laugh


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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JHZR2] #4099603 05/17/16 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2
But I do think that no tax on "necessities" (most all unprepared foods, raw foods, most clothing, medicines, etc) is the best way to go. Tax on everything else, if its going to be taxed, OK, but stuff that people really do need is best left alone. That does, IMO benefit all.



Who gets to decide what is taxed and what is not? That opens up the floodgates to shady dealings, e.g. some senator owns a lot of stock of a corporation that would see a boost in sales if there was no tax on their products. Don't you think that would sway his decision to pass the tax exemption?

It's already kinda weird with the "luxury goods" taxes that are imposed -- very subjective. Or if you want to look at it from the public health angle, consider the NYC "large soda" taxes. Who defines what's "large"? And who's to say that I'm not healthy (however that's defined) just because I want a large Coke? People will just find a way around it -- by making the cup 1 oz smaller, or just buying two mediums. Or what about a Frappucino that's got more calories than the large Coke, yet evades the tax because it's a smaller container?

There's no perfect solution, sadly. Tax it, and you cause problems. Don't tax it, and you cause problems.


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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099609 05/17/16 09:55 PM
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In exchange for my taxes, I live under the protection of the most dominant military in the history of the world. I get clean water (sorry Flint), reliable power, perfect sewage service, decent roads, and publics schools - most of the world's population is lucky to have one or two of those things. Men remove my family's trash from my front yard. Police are minutes away. Firefighters are two minutes away.

I can't imagine complaining about my taxes shrug

Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: Ethan1] #4099618 05/17/16 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted By: Ethan1
In exchange for my taxes, I live under the protection of the most dominant military in the history of the world. I get clean water (sorry Flint), reliable power, perfect sewage service, decent roads, and publics schools - most of the world's population is lucky to have one or two of those things. Men remove my family's trash from my front yard. Police are minutes away. Firefighters are two minutes away.

I can't imagine complaining about my taxes shrug
You know you could get all that paying 1/4 to 1/2 of the taxes you currently pay? Most tax money is squandered.


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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: 2015_PSD] #4099624 05/17/16 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
8.25% in TX for everything except some foods (0%), and new vehicles (6.5%)--not sure about real estate these days. We have a lottery too and the conditions are similar for teacher's salaries.

Basic sale tax is 7% in California, most counties add 1-2%. Orange County sale tax is 8% for everything except unprepared foods and drugs. Sale tax on vehicles is 8% new and used, every time a vehicle change hands state and county collects 8% sale tax.

Last edited by HTSS_TR; 05/17/16 10:28 PM.

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Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: dparm] #4099634 05/17/16 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
But I do think that no tax on "necessities" (most all unprepared foods, raw foods, most clothing, medicines, etc) is the best way to go. Tax on everything else, if its going to be taxed, OK, but stuff that people really do need is best left alone. That does, IMO benefit all.



Who gets to decide what is taxed and what is not? That opens up the floodgates to shady dealings, e.g. some senator owns a lot of stock of a corporation that would see a boost in sales if there was no tax on their products. Don't you think that would sway his decision to pass the tax exemption?

It's already kinda weird with the "luxury goods" taxes that are imposed -- very subjective. Or if you want to look at it from the public health angle, consider the NYC "large soda" taxes. Who defines what's "large"? And who's to say that I'm not healthy (however that's defined) just because I want a large Coke? People will just find a way around it -- by making the cup 1 oz smaller, or just buying two mediums. Or what about a Frappucino that's got more calories than the large Coke, yet evades the tax because it's a smaller container?

There's no perfect solution, sadly. Tax it, and you cause problems. Don't tax it, and you cause problems.


It's already implemented this way in many states.

Some states ai e lived in, VA and AL come to mind, tax everything. Some states tax nothing (DE). Others, like NJ, PA, NY, only tax necessities.

It's not brand name, it's not social engineering. It's what is considered a necessity, which is as I defined.

Want pre-prepared food? Not a necessity. Want carrots? Basic food is a necessity. Need pants? Necessity. Want a bathing suit? Not a necessity.

You can pick apart any system, but removing a tax burden on stuff that people at all levels need, isn't too bad, IMO.

Since this is a male-heavy site, I'll give this example:




Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099645 05/17/16 11:15 PM
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8.125% here including all the local level rates.

As for the taxing vs. not taxing necessities - NY is one of those that exempts many foods, when you dig into the list I scratch my head at some stuff.

Tax exempt foods includes lots of stuff that many would probably agree on (fruits and vegetables are two easy ones IMO) and then a whole gamut of other stuff (some of the head scratchers - ice cream, tang and fruit rollups) and other things are apparently taxed you might not expect based on the above (Kool-Aid and honey roasted nuts are both on the tax list - note other nuts are taxed exempt, just honey roasted are taxed).

NYS Listings of taxable and exempt food and beverages

Re: Sales Tax, Michigan 6% think about it... [Re: JXW] #4099652 05/17/16 11:24 PM
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Sales tax rate in Minnesota is 6.875%, with local taxes in various places bringing it higher.

That being said, as some of the figures JHZR2 shared, you can see Minnesota has very much picked and chosen what is taxed and what is not. Most food is not, and neither is clothing. It can be done, and it leads to some oddities, but in general it works out.

The way I look at it, we have income taxes, property taxes, and sales taxes, and they all get at different things. In the end, the way its implemented works very hard to make the overall package progressive instead of regressive (at least at the state level).

And to the poster who claims you can have all that for 1/4 your current tax bill, I'd love to see it... There is no such thing as a free lunch.

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