Yet another 2 cycle mix question

[1977c10phxdriver]

I was doing a google search on mixes for my new PoulanPro 42cc chain saw and read 3 replies from here. I was on my phone and now on my PC and cannot find the posts. But the OP was asking if adding a full 8 ounces of oil to TWO gallons was going to be a problem for a 50:1 mix. Some said not really, others said it was perfectly fine, a few actually said it made no difference at all, that the oil amount was not really important! [censored]! Really?
PLease clarify me if i'm wrong here. Really!

50:1 is 50 parts gas to 1 part oil. That would be 2.6 ounces of oil to one gallon.
40:1 is 40 parts gas to 1 pert oil. That would be 3.2 ounces of oil to one gallon.
32:1 (which some referred to as "minimal oil content") would be 4 ounces of oil per gallon.
Some said that 32:1 was good for about everything!
Hmmm, isn't 4 ounces kinda sloppy heavy with oil? Which is not really good for plugs and mufflers and the choking gagging you will be doing in the resulting cloud of smoke?

Anyway, My PoulanPro chain saw calls for 40:1, IE: 3.2 ounces per gallon.
as does my PoulanPro blower.

My Echo HC2000 hedge trimmers and my 21cc grass trimmer call for 50:1, 2.6 ounces per gallon.

Then I find a good site that says its fine to run EVERY TWO CYCLE ENGINE on 50:1 mixes, AS LONG AS I USE DurablendX from Echo????? (this was NOT an Echo site, BTW)

Soooooooooooooo....what say ye? Or should I go buy ANOTHER gas can for my new saw and blower with 3.2 ounces per gallon?

Mark in Phoenix

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

Forgot to ask this too. Is there a way to have this site ring me when a reply comes in? Like to my Gmail account on my dumb phone or tablet? I hope! LOL
Mark

 

[ragtoplvr]

There are internal engine changes that make leaner oil mixes possible. For example. vintage mowers and outboards may have plain bearings, these were designed for 16 to one, and can, due to better oils get, by at 24 to one. But not any leaner. Most modern stuff designed for 32 to one can take 40 to one. But not really 50 to one. 50 to one engines do well at 40 to one. I run my stuff all at 40 to one. I use a 1979 lawnboy every week.

My opinions, YMMV,

Rod

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

Thanks Rod. So you don't have any problems with the "richer oil" mix with plug fouling and muffler deposits? Interesting.

HOw about the high dollar brands vs. the generic brands of oils? and conventional petro vs. synthetic?

 

[Rock_Hudstone]

Do not use a 50:1 mix in your new Poulan Chainsaw saw, especially during the break- in period or you risk scoring the piston and burning up the saw.

I would use 32:1 for about the first 5-6 tankfuls, then use 40:1 in everything. The Echo string trimmer and such can handle the slightly heavier mix just fine.

Note:Be sure to buy oil for Air-Cooled 2 cycle engines only, not the marine WC-T3 versions or the all-purpose oils. The new Walmart Super-Tech 2 cycle full synthetic is a good deal or go with name brands if you choose.

 

[ragtoplvr]

when the lb was new, i did. muffler is a little heavier, last 10 years the exhaust ports have not needed cleaned, i attribute that to better oils,i use generics.

rod

 

[beanoil]

Air cooled oil only, TCW3 should be left to the boat crowd. When you are talking 40:1 vs. 32:1, you are not talking much difference, .8 ounce in a whole 128 ounces of fuel. You will not smoke yourself out, you aren't going to foul plugs, and you're muffler is not going to plug up, especially with modern 2T oils. You'll have more trash left behind from pump swill with ethanol than your oil. You will ensure you are providing enough oil though, under any RPM. ISO-L-EGD is virtually smokeless, and keeps exhaust ports clean by basically being consumed during combustion.
I'm a 32:1 guy in everything, a little extra oil does not hurt a thing. I do run a very clean oil though. VP Small Engine Fuel and Mobil MX2T is a dynamite combo.

 

[mehullica]

Run Amsoil Saber. I've run it 60:1 in my chainsaw, blower, Goped, line trimmer. 6 years with no issues

 

[demarpaint]

I have an 88 Evinrude 15 HP outboard engine that is pristine. Used mostly in Lake George and has about 50 hours total time on it. It was build in an era where they were trying to go green with outboard engines and recommended a 100:1 mix after break in. I wasn't comfortable with that and kept it at 50:1. As it turned out that was a smart move. When engines started blowing up they upped the rate to 50:1.

In my Poulan chainsaw I run 3.2 ounces of oil/gallon of gas. That machine is about 10 years old now and runs great. It is used often. OP I think going slightly over the recommended mix is a safer bet than going slightly under.

 

[Cujet]

As always, 32 to 1 will protect all but the most highly stressed two stroke engines. That's why I continue to recommend it as a generic mixture.

I've posted on this so many times it's not funny. But testing I was involved with clearly shows leaner mixtures of oil result in more rapid wear, regardless of choice of oil. Whether this matters or not depends on use. Most equipment fails long before the 2 stroke engine wears out.

A good oil and fuel choice will result in clean running at 32 to 1.

Interestingly, 2 stroke engines produce more power with more oil. All the way up to 8 to 1, but low RPM performance is terrible at 8 to 1, so most ultra high performance guys choose 16 to 1.

As for more internal carbon with more oil, forget it. Often oil rich mixtures are internally cleaner.

Let's look at this another way. It's amazing that just 3% of the fuel needs to be oil to provide all the lubrication most engines will ever need and result in the longest engine life.

 

[BrocLuno]

I'm one of the co-coordinators for the Bothe Forrest Practices Group. That's Bothe-Napa Valley Park. About 1,800 acres of woodland with trails, camping, etc. We have to remove or mitigate about 30 serious trees a year. And we make 50 cords of fire wood a year for the heck-of-it

Our group includes a lot of vintage chainsaw guys and gals. They run everything from David Bradley and Disston uprights, to two-man felling saws. The vintage stuff comes out to play. To work, we run modern saws with chain-breaks, etc. All our own stuff. The Park has some equipment. But they have yet to buy a saw with a 48" bar ...

So me, and my friends, rebuild a lot of "gee that's an interesting old ...". And I been playing with 2-strokes since about 1959 when I got my first outboard boat as a kid.

None of these motors have plain bearings. Even the oldest antique saws we have have roller bearings or ball bearings. There may be 2-strokes with plain bearings, but I've never seen one and I've been into prolly 250 2-stroke engines in my life.

Rule number one: If you have an adjustable carb, DO NOT adjust for max RPM unloaded. The correct way is to adjust slightly rich so that the motor 4-strokes when unloaded and only cleans up and runs 2-stroke when under load. Adjusted this way, it will never seize-up unless you "straight gas it" (no oil in the gas)...

Rule number two: If it ain't blowing blue smoke, it ain't happy. OK, modern CAT equipped saws will need around 40:1 ratio to keep the CAT happy. But ANY non-CAT saw will run best, and longest, on 32:1 with good oil.

Longest is not 5 years. Longest is 20 years with only occasional freshen-ups. We have saws that are 50+ years old. And other than rings and gaskets, they are all original.

We also have 14,000 RPM race saws that don't live an hour in the wood. But that is a race motor. Not a working engine ...

My oil blend for working engines is Wal-Mart TWC-3 mixed 50/50 with Poulan Synthetic. If I can't get that, it's LUCAS 2-Stroke Synthetic/TWC-3. Valvoline makes a very good T-2 oil also, if you can find it...

The best oil out there used to be Full-Bore. Has not been available for decades. The best currently available is Motul 710 at about $19/L. But stock working saws that are not run to lean, will live decades on my formula.

I have Motul for the race motors and they need it. They are making big power and huge heat loads. The shrouds are cut-away to allow for exotic exhaust systems (expansion chambers). They are start-n-go motors. Stone cold to full power in seconds. They break parks galore.

The biggest deal for your motor is to watch the gas. No gas over 10% ethanol - ever. No ethanol is even better. It'll eat the fuel lines and it'll lean out - bingo, end of motor.

As long as you run Tygon fuel lines and they have not discolored to white-ish, you're prolly OK. If they have, change them ASAP and look for other gas... Your diaphragm carb is going next ...

Get a grease injector for your bar nose bearing. Dribble some bar oil along the bar before you start cutting. Pumped oil is to replenish, but it should be wet to start. Especially in dry wood like dead/diseased trees, demo work, etc. Really dry wood will need a second person with a squirt can 50/50 kerosene and bar oil.

Have fun. Wear chaps and ear plugs. Don't take chances ...

 

[bubbatime]

Ok here is the real scoop. Owned a small engine shop for a few years.

Your factory carburetor is factory set, tuned, and SEALED to run on 40 to 1. There is a very high probability that it will run terribly on 32 to 1 or 50 to 1 ratios.

Just run 40 to 1 from day one and don't try to outsmart the manufacturer.

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

Thanks everyone. Ill go with 32:1 with the synthetic Echo which is readily available at Homey Depot. Gonna cut some wood tomorrow, new load of Mesquite for bowls.

Mark

 

[bubbatime]

Originally Posted By: 1977c10phxdriver
Thanks everyone. Ill go with 32:1 with the synthetic Echo

 

[bubbatime]

Originally Posted By: 1977c10phxdriver

PoulanPro chain saw
PoulanPro blower
Echo HC2000 hedge trimmers
Echo 21cc grass trimmer


The chainsaw and hedge trimmer will be used, what, twice a year on average? If you have an average size lot, you will use less than a gallon a year of fuel. TruFuel is perfect in that scenario and usage.

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

I miss-typed. Should have been 40:1, sorry.
I use the grass trimmers every week year around. Hedge trimmers twice a month. Blower twice a week and chain saw once in a while.
If I have any of the mix left at the end of the month, it goes in my truck and I start fresh. Cheap insurance for fresh fuel and my truck doesn't care.

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

Originally Posted By: bubbatime


Your factory carburetor is factory set, tuned, and SEALED to run on 40 to 1. There is a very high probability that it will run terribly on 32 to 1 or 50 to 1 ratios.

Just run 40 to 1 from day one and don't try to outsmart the manufacturer.


On the saw, its 3 months old with maybe 3 total hours. It ran BAD from day one and last time out, would not rev at all past 1/2 throttle. I took it back to home depot and the repair guy went over it. Yesterday he told me all he found was the carb horribly out of adjustment and the plug had a tad of stuff on it. I had the cover off to look around last week when It [censored] out, mix screws were there and adjustable, just took different tools. As far as properly set, it was not. Where ever it was made and if even run, is most likely not the same altitude as Phx so it could not have been right. But Gary re-set it and it fired second pull and after idling for maybe a minute, pulled right to a nice 4 cycle. I headed to the 10" Sissue branch,got into it big time, it went to a perfect 2 cycle and hauled you-know-what.
Any, its 3am at Dennys, mail check time.
Mark

 

[Srt20]

Lmao.


If you want 2 stroke advice on this forum the only person I have see post time after time with genuine knowledge of 2 stroke engines is Cujet.

I have never seen a post about 2 strokes from Cujet that I would disagree with. I'm sure there are others that have the same knowledge as him, after all 2 strokes aren't rocket science, but they probably don't post because of all the "experts" that like to argue.

 

[bubbatime]

Originally Posted By: Srt20
Lmao.


If you want 2 stroke advice on this forum the only person I have see post time after time with genuine knowledge of 2 stroke engines is Cujet.

I have never seen a post about 2 strokes from Cujet that I would disagree with. I'm sure there are others that have the same knowledge as him, after all 2 strokes aren't rocket science, but they probably don't post because of all the "experts" that like to argue.


+1

 

[1977c10phxdriver]

Originally Posted By: Srt20
Lmao.


If you want 2 stroke advice on this forum the only person I have see post time after time with genuine knowledge of 2 stroke engines is Cujet.

I have never seen a post about 2 strokes from Cujet that I would disagree with. I'm sure there are others that have the same knowledge as him, after all 2 strokes aren't rocket science, but they probably don't post because of all the "experts" that like to argue.

If I may ask, what or who are you laughing at/about?