Silicone Oil for motor oil? No or mix with hydroc.

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Sep 15, 2015
Messages
1,288
Location
Colorado
There are silicone greases and rubber good for high temperatures.
Has anyone ever heard of silicone motor oil? No hydrocarbons in it.
Does silicone oil mix well with hydrocarbon oils?
 
Silicone polymers are used as foam reducers in motor oils.

A silicon based oil with PCMO would not be feasible.
 
Originally Posted By: lubricatosaurus
Silicone oils stand up to higher temperatures? Seems motor oil needs that.


So does asbestos. Doesn't make it suitable for engine lubrication.
 
Originally Posted By: lubricatosaurus
Silicone oils stand up to higher temperatures? Seems motor oil needs that.


Certain POE's do it as well at 5 cSt in jet turbine engines and some oils use those.
 
Does silicone oil not mix well with additives?
Possibly too expensive for sure.
Does silicone oil work OK with metals?
There must be chemical reasons why they aren't found in motor oils.

Wikipedia says (they say its antiflatulent, who wouldn't want that?):

A silicone oil is any liquid polymerized siloxane with organic side chains. The most important member is polydimethylsiloxane. These polymers are of commercial interest because of their relatively high thermal stability and their lubricating properties.[1]

Contents
1 Structure
2 Applications
2.1 Medical uses
2.2 Automotive use
3 References
Structure[edit]
Like all siloxanes (e.g., hexamethyldisiloxane), the polymer backbone consists of alternating silicon-oxygen atoms (...Si-O-Si-O-Si...). Many groups can be attached to the tetravalent silicon centres but the dominant substituent is methyl or sometimes phenyl. Many silicone liquids are linear polymers end-capped with trimethylsilyl groups. Other silicone liquids are cyclosiloxanes.

Applications[edit]
Silicone oils are primarily used as lubricants, thermic fluid oils or hydraulic fluids. They are excellent electrical insulators[2] and, unlike their carbon analogues, are non-flammable. Their temperature-stability and good heat-transfer characteristics make them widely used in laboratories for heating baths ("oil baths") placed on top of hotplate stirrers, as well as in freeze-dryers as refrigerants. Silicone oil is also commonly used as the working fluid in dashpots, wet type transformers, diffusion pumps and in oil-filled heaters.

The class of silicone oils known as cyclosiloxanes has many of the same properties as other non-cyclic siloxane liquids but also has a relatively high volatility making it useful in a number of cosmetic products such as antiperspirant.

Some silicone oils, such as simethicone, are potent anti-foaming agents due to their low surface tension. They are used in industrial applications such as distillation or fermentation where excessive amounts of foam can be problematic. They are sometimes added to cooking oils to prevent excessive frothing during deep frying. Silicone oils used as lubricants can be inadvertent defoamers (contaminants) in processes where foam is desired, such as in the manufacture of polyurethane foam.

Silicone oil is also one of the two main ingredients in Silly Putty, along with boric acid.

Medical uses[edit]
Consumer products to control flatus (antiflatulents) often contain silicone oil. Silicone oils have been used as a vitreous fluid substitute to treat difficult cases of retinal detachment, such as those complicated with proliferative vitreoretinopathy, large retinal tears, and penetrating ocular trauma.[3]

Automotive use[edit]
Silicone oil was commonly used as the fluid in the automobile cooling fan clutch assemblies, before the industry switched to electric cooling fans.[4]

References[edit]
Jump up ^ Moretto, Hans-Heinrich; Schulze, Manfred; Wagner, Gebhard (2005). "Silicones". Ullmann's Encyclopedia of Industrial Chemistry. Weinheim: Wiley-VCH. doi:10.1002/14356007.a24_057.
Jump up ^ Miyahara, H; Nakajima, A; Wada, J; Yanabu, S (June 2006), "Breakdown Characteristics of Combined Insulation in Silicone Oil for Electric Power Apparatus", Properties and applications of Dielectric Materials, 2006. 8th International Conference, 2006 IEEE 8th International Conference on Properties and applications of Dielectric Materials: 661–664, doi:10.1109/ICPADM.2006.284264, ISBN 1-4244-0190-9
Jump up ^ Martín-Gil, J; Martín-Gil, FJ; De Andrés Santos, AI et al. (1997). "Thermal behaviour of medical grade silicone oils". J Anal Appl Pyrolysis 42 (2): 151–158. doi:10.1016/S0165-2370(97)00002-8.
Jump up ^ Doremus, R. H. (2002). "Viscosity of silica". J. Appl. Phys. 92 (12): 7619–7629. Bibcode:2002JAP....92.7619D. doi:10.1063/1.1515132.
 
Last edited:
I sometime use silicone oil at work for high temperature and high vacuum applications. They are great: very heat resistant, and very chemically stable. Good resistance to oxidation and no problems with metal corrosion as far as I know.

I don't think they play well with organic oils, in that I don't think they mix well. Their lack of mixing also makes me worry about their dispersant properties.

Even though I think they would hold up well to the rigors of a IC engine and not break down, I don't think they would do a very good job of holding petrol, soot, etc in solution / suspension. This is a major job of an engine oil. I think we change oil not just to refresh the oil, but to remove the contaminants of combustion that the oil has managed to capture.

I use organic oils in primary pumps that capture the general nasties, and would only use silicone oils in secondary pumps operating in a very clean environment. A car engine isn't clean.
 
Can you produce an oil that will not mix with other consumer oils?

Not many owners would go for it if changing oil required the engine to be washed out completely...
 
Originally Posted By: Snoman002
Can you produce an oil that will not mix with other consumer oils?

Not many owners would go for it if changing oil required the engine to be washed out completely...


You CAN. And you could market it. And a few might buy it. But you wouldn't likely be able to get any of the usual certifications (API, ACEA, ILSAC) for it.

To sum up what others have said: it has a very narrow set of things it does very, very well (high-temp stability, inert, thermal conductivity, high dielectric constant). But it probably does a relatively bad job at between 8 and 20 other tasks that passenger car motor oils have to do. Car engines don't really demand an oil with a super high dielectric breakdown strength.
 
Fuel contamination is a hydrocarbon which might not be miscible with the silicone oil. Dispersant discussion above is right I'll bet. I guess this stuff best stays in fake boobies, not engines.
 
I saw some old Teflon oil on clearance at Oriellys. It was quaker state with slick 50 added.

I dunno why this reminds me of that. Oh yeah, I'm sure it was tried and didn't work. Just like Teflon.
 
Also, what if some slipped past the valves into the combustion chamber. It probably wouldn't burn, which would be bad. The only thing worse would be that it did burn and form something gritty like silicon carbide.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top