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Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5049443 03/21/19 01:37 AM
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dave1251 Offline
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Mobil One historically has produced higher than average iron numbers in UOA. This with the facts of using Auto Rx which I would skip in your situation and you have new heads is adding a few variables for the uptick in iron. Honestly I would just use Mobil One and annual UOA's with your Vette and continue to enjoy your track time.


make the inside of your engine oil cap white.
don't use.
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5049482 03/21/19 03:52 AM
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Gasbuggy Offline
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Head replacement is very likely the cause of your iron levels jumping. They opened the engine up and now that new valvetrain has to wear in. Don't sweat it.


Cadillac CTS-V 6.2L 10w30PP
Volvo P1800 Euro L
76 Mercedes 300D Rotella T4
Series III Land Rover VWB
02 Yukon 10w30 PP
01 P71 M1 EP-HM 0W20
95 Accord - 386k. Mobil 2 RIP
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5049835 03/21/19 12:18 PM
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Dirty_Howie Offline OP
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Thanks guys!

DH




Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5057934 03/29/19 05:05 PM
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sprinj76 Offline
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DH, just wanted to say thank you for posting all your UOA's. I'm going to try mobil 1 0W-40 in my LS1, I usually do 2-3 autoX events each summer. I'll post up my results after 2-3k miles.

Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: sprinj76] #5057996 03/29/19 06:00 PM
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dailydriver Offline
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Originally Posted by sprinj76
DH, just wanted to say thank you for posting all your UOA's. I'm going to try mobil 1 0W-40 in my LS1, I usually do 2-3 autoX events each summer. I'll post up my results after 2-3k miles.


C5, or 4th gen f-body?


2016 Ford Fiesta ST 17K miles
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Fram XG3600 filter
Ravenol MTF-2 in the IB6 transaxle
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: dailydriver] #5058324 03/30/19 06:46 AM
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sprinj76 Offline
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F-body. 98 Z28

Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: sprinj76] #5058700 03/30/19 02:47 PM
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dailydriver Offline
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Originally Posted by sprinj76
F-body. 98 Z28



cool My last ride, before the one in my sig, was a 250K+ mile (in 16 years since ordered new by me), was a no option, '00 Z28 manual. drive


2016 Ford Fiesta ST 17K miles
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Fram XG3600 filter
Ravenol MTF-2 in the IB6 transaxle
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5181436 08/07/19 07:39 PM
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Dirty_Howie Offline OP
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Okay, here is my Blackstone from a couple of days ago. I am relieved to see my iron levels lower. I am doing 2-3 AutoX per month now so am using more oil. Used 1/8 of a quart on last one. And lets not forget my high Lead levels which are now lower than universal averages. So happy I am running Mobil 0w40


[Linked Image]


DH

Last edited by Dirty_Howie; 08/07/19 07:47 PM.



Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5181611 08/08/19 12:06 AM
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Garak Offline
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Seems to be all evening out now, which is fine. We still don't have enough data since that last iron bump but I wouldn't worry, as I said before. The engine gets worked. I think General Motors has a rule that their UOAs must throw iron levels that are elevated in comparison to most of the competition, irrespective of engine family. wink


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5183885 08/10/19 08:33 PM
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A_Harman Offline
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Originally Posted by Dirty_Howie
Originally Posted by A_Harman
The OP is obsessing too much over autocrossing an LS7 Corvette for about 30 minutes during a 3000 mile oil change interval.
Relax.
The dry sump system in a C6 Z06 holds a lot of oil, and 1.5 minutes on an autocross course is not long enough to heat the oil to any worrisome temperature.
He could safely run the oil until the OLM says to change it. He could probably even safely use M1 5w30 instead of the 0w40.
The decrease in lead after the switch from Redline to M1 is interesting, but I haven't seen anything in this thread that changes my opinion about the cause since I posted it in 2015.
I wonder about the low Phosphorous readings that Blackstone has been getting (from 7/2016 to 8/2017), and would ask them about it. M1 0w40 should have 1000 ppm. I have noticed that Blackstone's Phosphorous readings are often less than the PDS specs, but not by that much. The Iron wear numbers were low during that period.
The Iron wear rates are all less than 1 ppm per 1000 miles, and that's pretty darn good.


Although I appreciate your input I have no idea where you are getting this "obsession over autoX" from. I used to road race regularly and don't think AutoX compares at all in terms of engine wear. The ONLY thing I was ever concerned about was LEAD level. And the ONLY reason for that was that it likely meant bearing wear. The LS7 is an extremely expensive engine to replace so I feel OCI at 3-4K and closely watching my wear metals is prudent.

And I agree about phos levels but don't see where ou get the iron wear rate calculation from??

Thanks
DH


My goodness this thread had a lot of life after I posted in it back in 2015!

But to answer your most recent question: The Iron wear rate calculation is directly from the data on the report: ppm Iron divided by the oil change interval miles.

I used to track my Camaro regularly on Redline 5w30 and never had a problem with Lead concentration in a UOA. Here is an old UOA from my Camaro on Redline 5w30: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...e-5w30-ls1-camaro-5800-miles#Post2906981
One of the big differences between your LS7 and my LS1 is that my LS1 doesn't have Titanium rods.

By saying "obsessing over autocrossing", I was trying to encourage you to extend the OCI to the point where the oil life monitor tells you to change it.

I stated long ago that the LS7 has aluminum bearings in it, and that the lead was likely coming from the connecting rod small end bushings. The LS7 has Titanium rods and needs leaded bronze small end bushings. But everybody kept saying it was bearing wear. I think it was the high concentration (500+ppm) of Moly in the Redline leaching Lead out of the rod small end bushings. So it was chemistry, not physics, that was likely causing the elevated Lead readings.

Last edited by A_Harman; 08/10/19 08:44 PM.

1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5183970 08/10/19 10:51 PM
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Gasbuggy Offline
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Interesting theory. Wonder if RedLine would have an opinion


Cadillac CTS-V 6.2L 10w30PP
Volvo P1800 Euro L
76 Mercedes 300D Rotella T4
Series III Land Rover VWB
02 Yukon 10w30 PP
01 P71 M1 EP-HM 0W20
95 Accord - 386k. Mobil 2 RIP
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Gasbuggy] #5184508 08/11/19 06:28 PM
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Garak Offline
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It does make sense and is something we've seen often enough. I find it hard to believe that a slightly thicker lube is somehow causing people to chew through bearing material.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: A_Harman] #5200286 08/29/19 11:10 PM
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Dirty_Howie Offline OP
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Originally Posted by A_Harman
Originally Posted by Dirty_Howie
Originally Posted by A_Harman
The OP is obsessing too much over autocrossing an LS7 Corvette for about 30 minutes during a 3000 mile oil change interval.
Relax.
The dry sump system in a C6 Z06 holds a lot of oil, and 1.5 minutes on an autocross course is not long enough to heat the oil to any worrisome temperature.
He could safely run the oil until the OLM says to change it. He could probably even safely use M1 5w30 instead of the 0w40.
The decrease in lead after the switch from Redline to M1 is interesting, but I haven't seen anything in this thread that changes my opinion about the cause since I posted it in 2015.
I wonder about the low Phosphorous readings that Blackstone has been getting (from 7/2016 to 8/2017), and would ask them about it. M1 0w40 should have 1000 ppm. I have noticed that Blackstone's Phosphorous readings are often less than the PDS specs, but not by that much. The Iron wear numbers were low during that period.
The Iron wear rates are all less than 1 ppm per 1000 miles, and that's pretty darn good.


Although I appreciate your input I have no idea where you are getting this "obsession over autoX" from. I used to road race regularly and don't think AutoX compares at all in terms of engine wear. The ONLY thing I was ever concerned about was LEAD level. And the ONLY reason for that was that it likely meant bearing wear. The LS7 is an extremely expensive engine to replace so I feel OCI at 3-4K and closely watching my wear metals is prudent.

And I agree about phos levels but don't see where ou get the iron wear rate calculation from??

Thanks
DH


My goodness this thread had a lot of life after I posted in it back in 2015!

But to answer your most recent question: The Iron wear rate calculation is directly from the data on the report: ppm Iron divided by the oil change interval miles.

I used to track my Camaro regularly on Redline 5w30 and never had a problem with Lead concentration in a UOA. Here is an old UOA from my Camaro on Redline 5w30: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...e-5w30-ls1-camaro-5800-miles#Post2906981
One of the big differences between your LS7 and my LS1 is that my LS1 doesn't have Titanium rods.

By saying "obsessing over autocrossing", I was trying to encourage you to extend the OCI to the point where the oil life monitor tells you to change it.

I stated long ago that the LS7 has aluminum bearings in it, and that the lead was likely coming from the connecting rod small end bushings. The LS7 has Titanium rods and needs leaded bronze small end bushings. But everybody kept saying it was bearing wear. I think it was the high concentration (500+ppm) of Moly in the Redline leaching Lead out of the rod small end bushings. So it was chemistry, not physics, that was likely causing the elevated Lead readings.


I appreciate your input and analysis.
Like I said before I am glad I took the advise of the majority here and made the switch from Reline to Mobil. I have 71K miles now and would not have wanted leaching or wearing of the lead for all this time either from street or AutoX driving. I will leave it to you experts to draw conclusions from the data I am providing.

DH




Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5200367 08/30/19 06:10 AM
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A_Harman Offline
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It was a good, positive result you got when the Mobil was switched in for the Redline. The Lead gradually decreased over the next few oil changes, and has stayed low on M1.


1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
Re: Corvette UA0 with Redline 5w30: High Lead [Re: Dirty_Howie] #5200643 08/30/19 12:51 PM
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bulwnkl Offline
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The lead is now being sequestered in the light varnish building up on the internals. (-; d-:


I use speech recognition frequently. Please excuse any consequent grammatical or typographical errors.
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