Saps content?

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You will have carbon deposits, regardless of the oil you use. But there is a possibility that these deposits will be slightly less (slower forming) if you use low(er) SAPS oil.

Probably the best thing you can do, regardless which oil you end up using, is to drive the car fairly aggressively and allow high internal engine temps to help burn off some of these deposits. In any case, professional cleaning may be required every now and then.
 
By aggressively driven, I assume higher RPMs are more important than actual speed? I can run 80mph in 6th gear, and RPMs are only around 2600. I'd probably need to drive a little slower, but keep it in 5th gear at around 3200 RPMs for a while to help get things hotter.
 
Not just higher rpms, but also putting significant load on the engine, which means accelerating, to bring the oil temps up higher, and keep them there for some time. This will unfortunately result in higher fuel consumption. Maybe it's just cheaper (and safer) to pay a few hundred bucks for the occasional cleaning.
 
Originally Posted By: nolesfan
By aggressively driven, I assume higher RPMs are more important than actual speed? I can run 80mph in 6th gear, and RPMs are only around 2600. I'd probably need to drive a little slower, but keep it in 5th gear at around 3200 RPMs for a while to help get things hotter.

What I do is that when I go to ski I absolutely push car as hard as possible between curves in mountains. It is not that much important speed, as pushing car very hard for 1-2hrs accelerating, braking etc. If you live in flat area, see whether there is some track (Make sure your tires are up to the task, brakes, braking fluid).
 
We came from a VW TDI with a DPF. We made sure to load the engine in order to burn off excess build-up. Also helped with the DPF regen cycle ... I take it that loading the engine will assist, not cure, carbon build-up?

So, using Full-SAPS and more frequent OC seems a happy medium?
 
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Originally Posted By: whirldy
We came from a VW TDI with a DPF. We made sure to load the engine in order to burn off excess build-up. Also helped with the DPF regen cycle ... I take it that loading the engine will assist, not cure, carbon build-up?

So, using Full-SAPS and more frequent OC seems a happy medium?

Yeah, load will help. If you run your car 80mph in 4th gear, it will not help. Pushing car hard for extended period of time (1-2 hrs) will help. Accelerations etc. If you have some back road where it is safe, I would use it to push car.
Also, if you think you cannot do that that often, start using immediately these two oils to address that issue, and change it every 5K
1. Motul X-Clean 5W40
2. Pentosin 5W40.
Both are Mid-SAPS.
 
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: whirldy
We came from a VW TDI with a DPF. We made sure to load the engine in order to burn off excess build-up. Also helped with the DPF regen cycle ... I take it that loading the engine will assist, not cure, carbon build-up?

So, using Full-SAPS and more frequent OC seems a happy medium?

Yeah, load will help. If you run your car 80mph in 4th gear, it will not help. Pushing car hard for extended period of time (1-2 hrs) will help. Accelerations etc. If you have some back road where it is safe, I would use it to push car.
Also, if you think you cannot do that that often, start using immediately these two oils to address that issue, and change it every 5K
1. Motul X-Clean 5W40
2. Pentosin 5W40.
Both are Mid-SAPS.

Thanks!
So, IF one can load the engine, using Full-SAPS works okay? Or are you saying Mid-SAPS regardless?
Where do you buy your ^suggested oils?
 
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: whirldy
We came from a VW TDI with a DPF. We made sure to load the engine in order to burn off excess build-up. Also helped with the DPF regen cycle ... I take it that loading the engine will assist, not cure, carbon build-up?

So, using Full-SAPS and more frequent OC seems a happy medium?

Yeah, load will help. If you run your car 80mph in 4th gear, it will not help. Pushing car hard for extended period of time (1-2 hrs) will help. Accelerations etc. If you have some back road where it is safe, I would use it to push car.
Also, if you think you cannot do that that often, start using immediately these two oils to address that issue, and change it every 5K
1. Motul X-Clean 5W40
2. Pentosin 5W40.
Both are Mid-SAPS.

Thanks!
So, IF one can load the engine, using Full-SAPS works okay? Or are you saying Mid-SAPS regardless?
Where do you buy your ^suggested oils?

I always used Full-SAPS. I experimented with M1 5W30 ESP low-SAPS. it is great oil, but low TBN which is a problem in combination with the U.S. gas. Due to the emission regulations, market price of VW in the U.S. third gen of those engines are not coming to the U.S> with port injection like in EU, so eventually some carbon will show up on your valves. How bad? Do not know, I do not have any problems on my CC with 88K.
Where do you live? Are you in California? If you are in CA then you can try Low-SAPS oils and then send it for UOA to Blackstone to check TBN.
This is first time I am using Pentosin 5W40. Local small shop carries it here. It is $44 for 5ltr, compare to $27 for Castrol or M1 0W40 in WM, so it is more expensive.
If you do not have locally, you can order online on: FCP Euro, ECS Tuning, etc etc, just type in that oil in google, and bunch of web site will pop out that carry those oils. If you live in hot area with mild winters, go with Motul X-Clean. It is Full Synthetic PAO oil. If you live in norther states, Pentosin will be better since it has better pour point.
Whatever you choose, Pentosin, Motul, Castrol or M1 0W40, you will do much better then what dealership puts in. Then just find local road, and push that car hard, or track. BUT if you do track, be careful when it comes tp tires, brakes and brake fluid.
 
Thank you!

Not going to use ... what SAPS does the MOTUL 300V 5W-40 have?
hXEBDA6h.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Thank you!

Not going to use ... what SAPS does the MOTUL 300V 5W-40 have?
hXEBDA6h.jpg


Full, not recommended for daily use.
 
Does anyone recommend Full-SAPS with shorter oil drain intervals? Does Full-SAPS offer "better" lubricity ?
 
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Does anyone recommend Full-SAPS with shorter oil drain intervals? Does Full-SAPS offer "better" lubricity ?

Like a lot of people said it throughout this forum in years, cut OCI from 10K to 5K. Use Castrol or M1 0W40 bcs they meet MB 229.5.
News: You will not find perfect solution. When it comes to Full-SAPS castrol and M1 0W40 are pretty much best on market when it come sto oils that are readily available and meet all manufacturer approvals.
 
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Thank you!

Not going to use ... what SAPS does the MOTUL 300V 5W-40 have?
hXEBDA6h.jpg


Full, not recommended for daily use.

How come not recommended?
 
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: whirldy
Thank you!

Not going to use ... what SAPS does the MOTUL 300V 5W-40 have?
hXEBDA6h.jpg


Full, not recommended for daily use.

How come not recommended?

It is actually more Mid-SAPS, but it contains different type of additives that are sometimes not compatible with emission system. Also, those additives could potentially have opposite effect on deposits, since oil is created with racing in mind, NOT daily driving. It has very high HTHS, which is good for modified turbo charged engines, but in your car with HTHS of 4.1, you would notice turbo being sluggish and probably decrease fuel economy a little bit.
The fact that there is no manufacturer approval should be sign, since Motul products are always approved by Euro manufacturers.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
You will have carbon deposits, regardless of the oil you use. But there is a possibility that these deposits will be slightly less (slower forming) if you use low(er) SAPS oil.

Probably the best thing you can do, regardless which oil you end up using, is to drive the car fairly aggressively and allow high internal engine temps to help burn off some of these deposits. In any case, professional cleaning may be required every now and then.



LoL Now have you remind me on this citroen C4 commercial for new C4 with hill assist
smile.gif


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3y0X8iMIx3Q
 
SAPS has nothing to do with carbon deposits.

Carbon, ash or calcium deposits have so many other factors, combustion chamber temperature, fuel burn rate etc.

SAPS = Sulphated Ash, Phosphorus and Sulfur

These are actually anti wear compounds, when burned into a DPF or catalyst will leave ash in the catalyst, basically insulating the honeycomb substrate not allowing the catalyst to be effective in coming up to temperature.

In order for the DPF/Catalyst to be contaminated by ash/SAPS, the engine will be burning oil at a higher rate.

To run low SAPS oil in an engine not requiring low SAPS oil, you're doing the engine no favors. Full SAPS oil will allow the pistons, rings, and bearings to last the longest. Mid/low SAPS oil is a balancing act, engine wear vs. emissions; 25% less engine protection and 25% less SAPS for the catalyst to be contaminated with. Mid/low SAPS has 25% less anti wear additive = less engine protection.
 
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