Kerosene

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Originally Posted By: rockydee
Have you ever used Marvel oil?-RD


Nope. I've used Techron & Gumout for fuel system cleaning but never needed to put anything into my oil.
 
Originally Posted By: aa1986
Here's the list of ingredients posted in 2010 but apparently was posted before then as well:

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I borrowed this from another thread, I've pasted this into a few threads before HTH. I would follow the suggested OCI for a vehicle and not run MMO if you plan on extending an OCI beyond what the mfg suggests.

70% Light Aromatic Oil (Pale Oil)
- It is a Naphthenic Oil, so while it oxidizes faster than a Paraffinic oil, it does clean and dissolve sludge and carbon well and cleans up after itself from any oxidation. serves as base oil as well. [Naphthenic oils have more solvency and are more polar (they are attracted to metal more), but oxidize faster.

29% Mineral Spirits
- Cleans Varnish very well. General cleaner. Also acts as an antioxidant.

38 parts per million (ppm) Boron
- AW/EP agent, friction reducer, antioxidant

900 ppm Phosporous
- AW/EP agent

1/2% 1, 2 ortho-Dichlorobenzene
- EP agent as it interacts with Iron to form an Iron chloride barrier under any ZDDP or other AW additives. Also very good cleaner/solvent, and friction reducer

1/4% 1, 4 para-Dichlorobenzene
- EP agent as it interacts with Iron to form an Iron chloride barrier under any ZDDP or other AW additives. Also very good cleaner/solvent, and friction reducer

Oil of wintergreen - for the scent
- Not just for the cent, is also a cleaner. may aid lubricity.

Red Dye - for the color
- well this one just colors the stuff


Yea that's the list thanks. It seems to pass the litmus test. And it seems to jive with the msds. Currently there's no reason for me not to believe the list.-RD
 
Originally Posted By: rockydee
aa1986 said:
Yea that's the list thanks. It seems to pass the litmus test. And it seems to jive with the msds. Currently there's no reason for me not to believe the list.-RD


What litmus test are you referring to.
confused2.gif


My analysis was dated April, 2014.

Any MSDS is there for safety reasons to disclose potential safety hazards such as toxicity, etc, and is not there to disclose the complete formula.

For example, where is this supposed Boron or oil of wintergreen in the MSDS verses that unsubstantiated list?

Nowhere in the Turtle Wax MSDS for MOM does it say it contains Oil of Wintergreen. It only says that it has the odor of Oil of Wintergreen. Stoddard Solvents, Mineral Spirits, or whatever the solvent industry wants to call it are essentially "dearomatized" or hydroprocessed Kerosenes.
Click to expand...
 
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Originally Posted By: rockydee
aa1986 said:
Yea that's the list thanks. It seems to pass the litmus test. And it seems to jive with the msds. Currently there's no reason for me not to believe the list.-RD


What litmus test are you referring to.
confused2.gif


My analysis was dated April, 2014.

Any MSDS is there for safety reasons to disclose potential safety hazards such as toxicity, etc, and is not there to disclose the complete formula.

For example, where is this supposed Boron or oil of wintergreen in the MSDS verses that unsubstantiated list?


Lets see if I can clear things up a tad. Litmus test is a figure of speech I use from time to time. Jives meant it coincides with the list. The msds seemed close, the list being more detailed. Where is the winter green oil in your report? And there's still no reason not to believe the list.-RD
Click to expand...
 
Quote:
Lets see if I can clear things up a tad. Litmus test is a figure of speech I use from time to time. Jives meant it coincides with the list. The msds seemed close, the list being more detailed. Where is the winter green oil in your report? And there's still no reason not to believe the list.-RD


Litmus test is a political term. Litmus paper is a chemical material.

Where is the Oil of WinterGreen in the MSDS. Did you even read the Turtle Wax MSDS for MOM?

https://www.turtlewax.com/docs/default-source/msds-english/msds-consumer/marvel-mystery-oil

Quote:
9. PHYSICAL AND CHEMICAL PROPERTIES
PHYSICAL FORM: Thin liquid December 27, 2012 Page 3 of 5
COLOR: Red
ODOR: Wintergreen
BOILING POINT: Not determined
MELT / FREEZE POINT - 60 º F ( - 51 º C)
PH: Not applicable
SOLUBILITY IN WATER: Insoluble
SPECIFIC GRAVITY: 0.876 @ 60 º F (15.6 º C)
% VOLATILE BY WEIGHT: 25 %
VAPOR PRESSURE: Not determined
VAPOR DENSITY: Not determined


Quote:
Where is the winter green oil in your report? And there's still no reason not to believe the list.-RD


Because in our analysis there were no esters present and there were no Borons present.

That list on the internet is an Internet guess by someone who obviously doesn't know much about organic chemistry, and who did not have the instrumentation that we have.
 
Last edited:
Mr. Molakule- I didn't read their msds from the site. I read what was posted here asked a few questions then said I had no reason not to believe the list that aa posted. I'm not going to play games with you. I asked a question you answered with one, that's a game. Time for dinner and cocktails, I wasted enough time in this thread. Mystic was right when it comes to Marvel Oil, saying it works or anything good here can be a hack sometimes.-RD
Happy New Year.
 
Originally Posted By: Trajan

That list, of unknown origin, claims that the smell is from oil of wintergreen. Which is an ester. And ester is expensive.


wintergreen is about as expensive as asprin and heet...


Originally Posted By: Trajan
And the smell doesn't mean very much. Cyanide smells like burnt almonds. Doesn't have almonds in it


I think you mean "bitter almonds"....and the analogy you are using is sort of Bass ackwards, as bitter almonds contain amygdalin, which metabolises to cyanide.
 
It matters not to me what you read or believe on the internet, nor what you put in your oil or fuel.

Just presenting the facts and if you don't like the facts, well...

Happy New Year as well!
banana2.gif
thankyou2.gif
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Trajan



Trajan said:
And the smell doesn't mean very much. Cyanide smells like burnt almonds. Doesn't have almonds in it


I think you mean "bitter almonds"....and the analogy you are using is sort of Bass ackwards, as bitter almonds contain amygdalin, which metabolises to cyanide.


Yeah, I meant bitter...
smile.gif

I did read here that it was expensive...ah well...
Dyslexic too. (Me) So at times I am Bass ackwards.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: rockydee
Originally Posted By: aa1986
Here's the list of ingredients posted in 2010 but apparently was posted before then as well:

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I borrowed this from another thread, I've pasted this into a few threads before HTH. I would follow the suggested OCI for a vehicle and not run MMO if you plan on extending an OCI beyond what the mfg suggests.

70% Light Aromatic Oil (Pale Oil)
- It is a Naphthenic Oil, so while it oxidizes faster than a Paraffinic oil, it does clean and dissolve sludge and carbon well and cleans up after itself from any oxidation. serves as base oil as well. [Naphthenic oils have more solvency and are more polar (they are attracted to metal more), but oxidize faster.

29% Mineral Spirits
- Cleans Varnish very well. General cleaner. Also acts as an antioxidant.

38 parts per million (ppm) Boron
- AW/EP agent, friction reducer, antioxidant

900 ppm Phosporous
- AW/EP agent

1/2% 1, 2 ortho-Dichlorobenzene
- EP agent as it interacts with Iron to form an Iron chloride barrier under any ZDDP or other AW additives. Also very good cleaner/solvent, and friction reducer

1/4% 1, 4 para-Dichlorobenzene
- EP agent as it interacts with Iron to form an Iron chloride barrier under any ZDDP or other AW additives. Also very good cleaner/solvent, and friction reducer

Oil of wintergreen - for the scent
- Not just for the cent, is also a cleaner. may aid lubricity.

Red Dye - for the color
- well this one just colors the stuff


Yea that's the list thanks. It seems to pass the litmus test. And it seems to jive with the msds. Currently there's no reason for me not to believe the list.-RD


Wow I missed this thread. The list, that's a good name for it. I posted it more times than I can remember. It was borrowed I think from the MMO board?

Anyway don't let'em get to you RD, this is an ongoing thing around here. Looking at some of your posts I see you've used it from time to time with good results At the end of the day that's all that really matters, you had good results. Unless you're thick skinned don't bother mentioning it. I get tired sometimes of fighting in these threads. Sometimes I sit back and watch, take a jab or two if I'm up to it. If I didn't see myself quoted I probably would have stayed out.

Like you said time for dinner and cocktails. Happy New Year BITOG! Stay safe!!
 
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
It matters not to me what you read or believe on the internet, nor what you put in your oil or fuel.

Just presenting the facts and if you don't like the facts, well...

Happy New Year as well!
banana2.gif
thankyou2.gif



Love facts.
 
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
It matters not to me what you read or believe on the internet, nor what you put in your oil or fuel.

Just presenting the facts and if you don't like the facts, well...


But let's hope this myth that MMO contains an expensive cleaning ester called oil of wintergreen is no longer perpetuated as it so readily was.

It was surely nice for MMO to have that impression out there to justify a 400%+ markup on kerosene.
 
Originally Posted By: aa1986
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
It matters not to me what you read or believe on the internet, nor what you put in your oil or fuel.

Just presenting the facts and if you don't like the facts, well...


But let's hope this myth that MMO contains an expensive cleaning ester called oil of wintergreen is no longer perpetuated as it so readily was.

It was surely nice for MMO to have that impression out there to justify a 400%+ markup on kerosene.
It is special kerosene.
 
For what its worth here's the MSDS. Everywhere I searched they reference wintergreen oil as part of it. Here they note is as the ODOR. I guess it depends on if you like the stuff or not what you believe. Enjoy- MSDS http://www.mcoe.us/view/1724.pdf

December 27, 2012 Page 3 of 5
COLOR: Red
ODOR: Wintergreen
BOILING POINT: Not determined
MELT / FREEZE POINT - 60 º F ( - 51 º C)
PH: Not applicable
SOLUBILITY IN WATER: Insoluble
SPECIFIC GRAVITY: 0.876 @ 60 º F (15.6 º C)
% VOLATILE BY WEIGHT: 25 %
VAPOR PRESSURE: Not determined
VAPOR DENSITY: Not determined

Kerosene, red dye, and no wintergreen oil is that the bobistheoilguy final analysis? Maybe they created the wintergreen scent in the lab with some other chemicals? Or maybe no one tested for it @ bobs? I'm scratching my head on this one.-RD
 
Quote:
Because in our analysis there were no esters present and there were no Borons present.

That list on the internet is an Internet guess by someone who obviously doesn't know much about organic chemistry, and who did not have the instrumentation that we have.


The original MSDS from Turtle Wax was posted previously, so why re-post?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt2GmcQidb8
 
Last edited:
Quote:
...Maybe they created the wintergreen scent in the lab with some other chemicals? Or maybe no one tested for it @ bobs?...


I don't know what you mean by the last sentence.

This was tested in an independent, University advanced chemical lab. BITOG had nothing to do with it.

Please re-read the following:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...MMO#Post3551854

You can make all kinds of excuses if you like, but the analysis is what we found as of April, 2014.

Quote:
I guess it depends on if you like the stuff or not what you believe


I guess it really depends on the FACTS!

Feel free to spend $700+ for an advanced analysis if you like.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: MolaKule

Quote:
Because in our analysis there were no esters present and there were no Borons present.

That list on the internet is an Internet guess by someone who obviously doesn't know much about organic chemistry, and who did not have the instrumentation that we have.


The original MSDS from Turtle Wax was posted previously, so why re-post?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt2GmcQidb8


No boron no esters, according to you OK.

I'm asking where the smell of Marvel Oil comes from if its not wintergreen oil? The kero stink is pretty tough to hide. Can that smell be created with other chemicals? If yes what? Some fair questions I think. BTW a simple search of the www shows a lot of refs of the wintegreen oil being used in Marvel Oil. Which leads me to the line of questions i asked-RD
 
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