Recent Topics
Tough low-ash OE specs, API SJ/SM apps, short OCIs
by d00df00d
06/29/17 05:47 AM
High mileage oil???
by OneEyeJack
06/29/17 03:27 AM
Question on 30wt oils
by Ammofirst
06/29/17 02:16 AM
True economics of extended oil drains
by userfriendly
06/29/17 12:34 AM
China to mass-produce 400km/h fast train
by L_Sludger
06/29/17 12:06 AM
why is it so hard to find a good body shop?
by tomcat27
06/28/17 11:32 PM
first aid kit..what to put in?
by bmwjohn
06/28/17 11:20 PM
2016 Harley sportster 883 iron
by jkhawaii
06/28/17 11:20 PM
Performed the Citric Acid Flush With Great Results
by DoubleWasp
06/28/17 11:13 PM
Who wants to buy this house?
by Chris142
06/28/17 11:09 PM
Switch from Royal Purple 10-40 to?
by 555
06/28/17 10:26 PM
Boutique/Expensive Oils over standard brands?
by gryffinwings
06/28/17 10:00 PM
Beck/Arnley control arm is Kia/Hyundai OEM
by Klutch9
06/28/17 09:38 PM
MPG after switched to new Mobil1 FS 0w40
by Eugene_Von
06/28/17 09:36 PM
Valvoline Maxlife Full Synthetic 5w30
by bbhero
06/28/17 09:16 PM
Toyo Open Country
by Camprunner
06/28/17 09:15 PM
Red Line 10W-30, 1992 Acura NSX, 3 months
by robertcope
06/28/17 09:10 PM
trans lubrication on startup
by MrTruckDriver
06/28/17 09:08 PM
Gas Pressure washer
by ford46guy
06/28/17 09:07 PM
Valvoline HD CK-4, CJ-4/SN Ford Approved Spec
by fantastic
06/28/17 08:53 PM
Newest Members
fantastic, ACuna545, koryg0327, Fred_L_Johnson, turk182
62006 Registered Users
Who's Online
79 registered (agpatel, 03s, Andrei, Bear, Ammofirst, ArcticDriver, 7 invisible), 1731 Guests and 12 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
62006 Members
66 Forums
267198 Topics
4419559 Posts

Max Online: 3590 @ 01/24/17 08:07 PM
Donate to BITOG
Topic Options
#3395555 - 06/12/14 10:41 AM Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI
bulwnkl Offline


Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 1643
Loc: Arizona
Stationary back-up power generator. It was exercised at no-load once per week for 30 minutes. Had to run the facility once during this OCI for an hour or two, about a year and a half before the sample. Filters are as old as the oil. Now that I'm here, we're modifying our maintenance practices on this engine. 604.5 hours on the engine at sample time. Engine is ~20 years old.

Code:
Spectroscopic (ASTM D5185)
Fe	3
Cu	11
Pb	6
Al	0
Sn	8
Ni	0
Cr	0
Ti	0
V	0
Ag	0
Si	3
B	81
Ca	2970
Mg	215
P	1245
Zn	1433
Ba	0
Mo	46
Na	0
K	0

FTIR (JOAP method)
Fuel	0
Glycol	0
Nit	6
Oxi	13
Soot	5

TAN	1.26
TBN	8.21
Water    0.010%
Vis 100C	14.1
Vis 40C	102.7
VI	139
_________________________
Non-political signature NOT removed

Top
#3396214 - 06/13/14 04:41 AM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 6602
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
I'm a bit lost here; are you saying the sample it 1.5 years old, or that's how long ago the full-call duty cycle ran?

The engine is 20 years old.
The engine has 605 hours on it.
The engine sees typical 1/2 runs per month, plus whatever emergeny call may come up.

What I cannot seem to quite get is how many hours on on this particular sample? The long term running average is 2.5 hours/month; that is nothing really at all. However, should there not be a run-call for several months, then a half-hour run per month is a tiny fraction of use.


Overall the numbers look OK. It's really hard to know the wear on a "per hour" basis as I'm not sure what this sample represents.

TBN/TAN is very strong and could easily go longer. Contamination is non-existent by any measure. Vis look fine.

My suggestion would be to install bypass filtration (if not there already), forgot OCIs by any means of chronology, and ONLY OCI when a sample would indicate (which in this case, shows a LOT of life left in it).


Edited by dnewton3 (06/13/14 04:44 AM)
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

Top
#3396326 - 06/13/14 07:46 AM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: dnewton3]
krismoriah72 Online   content


Registered: 02/16/09
Posts: 1026
Loc: wv
I would be more worried about the fuel than the oil.

Top
#3396925 - 06/13/14 07:41 PM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
Rob_Roy Offline


Registered: 10/26/08
Posts: 934
Loc: Northern, NY
Fuel dilution is often a problem with diesel generators, but that doesn't seem to be the case here. Your report looks very good.

If possible, try to run the engine under load more often. Do a web search for "generator wet stacking" and you will see what frequent short runs can do over a long period of time.
_________________________
2015 Subaru Legacy 3.6
2014 Subaru Outback 2.5
1999 Ford F350, V10 workhorse

Top
#3397111 - 06/13/14 11:48 PM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
bulwnkl Offline


Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 1643
Loc: Arizona
dnewton, this generator is exercised _weekly_ at no load. Hours on this run are around 105 (don't have the data in front of me). I don't like this weekly no-load exercise, yet the results do not indicate a problem.

We load-banked this machine recently, and that will now be a regular occurrence. I'd like to cut line power regularly, and make the switch and generator work running the facility. However, I don't care for how certain equipment behaves in the face of that brief outage, so I haven't chosen to take this tack yet.

For those who were thinking of the fuel, I was thinking of that, too. smile The sample on it shows good cetane, distillation curve is appropriate/reasonable, no microbes, and no water. We additize it regularly against the issues we face in this application, and our approach there seems to be working.
_________________________
Non-political signature NOT removed

Top
#3398294 - 06/15/14 04:54 PM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
krismoriah72 Online   content


Registered: 02/16/09
Posts: 1026
Loc: wv
My comment was relating to the fuel having bacteria after 20 years. Ive seen an actual bloom in the bottom of my tanks after sitting for a month.. but i havent used additives to 'kill' the bacteria either.. so kudos if your additives can keep 20 year old fuel viable.

Top
#3398442 - 06/15/14 08:06 PM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
bulwnkl Offline


Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 1643
Loc: Arizona
The tank doesn't hold 20-years-worth of fuel. wink
We only carry 500 gallons max on-hand, and it ends up being partly replenished every couple years; more frequently now that we're going to load-bank it regularly.
_________________________
Non-political signature NOT removed

Top
#3398773 - 06/16/14 09:35 AM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: bulwnkl]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 6602
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Monthly loading is a good thing. Not only good for the engine, but also the gen-head itself.

Rather than dropping main-line power to simulate an outage, why not develop a secondary, inexpensive load system (not knowing the application, I can only speculate here ...) such a running a small tool shop for a day, or perhpas fire-pump motors for their monthly testing?

As for the UOA itself, 100+ hours on this shows things are fine. The current system seems to be working, despite the low loading.
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

Top
#3399453 - 06/17/14 12:57 AM Re: Cummins KTA19, RotellaT, 4-year OCI [Re: dnewton3]
Fraser434 Offline


Registered: 09/17/11
Posts: 162
Loc: Chicago
Originally Posted By: dnewton3

Rather than dropping main-line power to simulate an outage, why not develop a secondary, inexpensive load system (not knowing the application, I can only speculate here ...) such a running a small tool shop for a day, or perhpas fire-pump motors for their monthly testing?


The fire pump would be in bypass unless its pushing water through sprinklers...
Would have almost no load.

What kind of transfer switches do you have? i'm guessing green onan ones with 4 lights in the upper corner? Considering its an onan gen. Most likely you could perform a transfer test from the ATS at minimal risk to the rest of the facility.

The cheapest load bank would be a tub of salt water (100 gallons) with adjustable steel electrodes submerged in the salt water, cable the gen to one end and it will load it up 100% unity PF. Not OSHA approved, but used outside of america.... Thats why they make resistve air cooled load banks.

Some sites do have permanent or radiator mounted load banks, very expensive.


Edited by Fraser434 (06/17/14 01:04 AM)

Top