Fill battery with water
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Remember that the chemistry of the plates and those caps are there to allow recombination of the hydrogen and oxygen formed at the electrodes to recombine. Its not a "valve" with a set opening pressure, its really just a friction fit to help prevent much gas from escaping, but it can indeed still escape and dry out. This is why other than on special occasions, fast charge is NOT recommended. Excessive gassing will occur that may not recombine, and a locally flammable atmosphere can occur.
A particular brand of battery I sell has top plastic plates covering the fill holes for electrolyte. And this is the size for Japanese branded cars. Ford Motorcraft battery sold here by some dealer has similar casing.
The same brand for European cars (DIN size) has an extra vent hole by the top side.
In cars like BMW or Mercedes with concealed battery, there is a vent hose which connects to the battery and leads to outside of the car.
I supposed the vent hose is to prevent build-up of gases inside a closed box.
My question is why isn't the former (JIS size) provided with a vent hole anyway ?
Is this vent hole a pressure relief valve, assuming recombination of gases does not requires it ?
Thanks.
Remember that the chemistry of the plates and those caps are there to allow recombination of the hydrogen and oxygen formed at the electrodes to recombine. Its not a "valve" with a set opening pressure, its really just a friction fit to help prevent much gas from escaping, but it can indeed still escape and dry out. This is why other than on special occasions, fast charge is NOT recommended. Excessive gassing will occur that may not recombine, and a locally flammable atmosphere can occur.
A particular brand of battery I sell has top plastic plates covering the fill holes for electrolyte. And this is the size for Japanese branded cars. Ford Motorcraft battery sold here by some dealer has similar casing.
The same brand for European cars (DIN size) has an extra vent hole by the top side.
In cars like BMW or Mercedes with concealed battery, there is a vent hose which connects to the battery and leads to outside of the car.
I supposed the vent hose is to prevent build-up of gases inside a closed box.
My question is why isn't the former (JIS size) provided with a vent hole anyway ?
Is this vent hole a pressure relief valve, assuming recombination of gases does not requires it ?
Thanks.
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Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
Absolutely. And do you know how short a life a car battery has in the heat under the hood of a taxi if you don't periodically check electrolyte levels, maintenance free or not?
Of course, I've rarely had to bother with the issue on my personal vehicles. I certainly understand why that instructor would warn against doing so. Sometimes it's best to leave well enough alone.
There are low maint. and maint free. Which are we talking about here? If you can get the vent caps off with your fingers or maybe slightly needed help from a screwdriver then you should be able to add distilled water.
Good to clean off the battery with water and or water & baking soda so the top is pretty clean and nothing falls into the cells when the caps are pulled off.
Good to clean off the battery with water and or water & baking soda so the top is pretty clean and nothing falls into the cells when the caps are pulled off.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
Perhaps this is a dumb question, but how would you know that water has been added to a battery? I'm talking one as pictured like the OP's above, where you can pop off the plastic caps (It seems possible to me to do it without leaving evident marks).
I always thought this was normal maintenance a few times a year? Check the water level in the battery.
@99Saturn - there really is not a way to tell if water has been added to the batter. If it's really low, to the point you can see the innards are exposed to air - you know that it has been neglected.
only way I can think of is check to see if the slots for a screwdriver are burred up / bent a bit. I always managed to mess them up a bit getting the cap off with a screwdriver.
@99Saturn - there really is not a way to tell if water has been added to the batter. If it's really low, to the point you can see the innards are exposed to air - you know that it has been neglected.
only way I can think of is check to see if the slots for a screwdriver are burred up / bent a bit. I always managed to mess them up a bit getting the cap off with a screwdriver.
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Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
OK, Interstate handles the distribution of their branded JCI batteries then, LOL! Still, they ONLY do batteries, so I would hope that they know what they are talking about.
Exide says something similar however:
http://www.exidebatteries.com.au/battery-faq/
Quote:
To help maximise the life of your battery, follow these helpful tips:
Keep batteries topped up
Maintaining a sufficient electrolyte level ensures the electrolyte is neither too high or too low. Use distilled or deionised water and never over fill. Maintenance free batteries will usually not require topping up. Low maintenance batteries require the addition of water only once or twice per year depending on conditions.
And the Sears policy makes perfect sense, as you have no way of knowing whether somebody has added contaminated water to the battery or not and they didn't want to be liable for you guys opening them up either.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
OK, Interstate handles the distribution of their branded JCI batteries then, LOL! Still, they ONLY do batteries, so I would hope that they know what they are talking about.
Exide says something similar however:
http://www.exidebatteries.com.au/battery-faq/
Quote:
To help maximise the life of your battery, follow these helpful tips:
Keep batteries topped up
Maintaining a sufficient electrolyte level ensures the electrolyte is neither too high or too low. Use distilled or deionised water and never over fill. Maintenance free batteries will usually not require topping up. Low maintenance batteries require the addition of water only once or twice per year depending on conditions.
And the Sears policy makes perfect sense, as you have no way of knowing whether somebody has added contaminated water to the battery or not and they didn't want to be liable for you guys opening them up either.
Miller88 - thanks. That was what I was thinking of as well but figured that wouldn't be evident 100% of the time. I was able to avoid any marks (at least I don't see any) last year when I opened the one in my Saturn up.
I was just thinking how that conversation would go if I tried to go back to Sears for the warranty.
I was just thinking how that conversation would go if I tried to go back to Sears for the warranty.
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
EXACTLY!
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
EXACTLY!
According to BCI, the majority of today's auto batteries are maintenance- free. This means that motorists should not check or top off the electrolyte levels in maintenance-free batteries.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
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Originally Posted By: ram_man
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
EXACTLY!
Exactly what, that because Interstate, who ONLY does batteries, doesn't actually MANUFACTURE their batteries, that this somehow vindicates your claims and makes you master of the known universe? Hardly.
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
The text book is pretty clear on it as well and the part about what we are speaking of was cited from Chrysler . I would assume they know what they are doing.
I'm pretty sure Interstate knows what THEY are talking about, given that they make batteries and all
They don't make batteries. Their batteries are many by JCI, the Interstate truck comes by my work as they handle the Mazda battery program.
When I worked at Sears we were told to under no circumstances add water to a battery and to not honor a warranty on a battery that had water added to it.
EXACTLY!
Exactly what, that because Interstate, who ONLY does batteries, doesn't actually MANUFACTURE their batteries, that this somehow vindicates your claims and makes you master of the known universe? Hardly.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: ram_man
According to BCI, the majority of today's auto batteries are maintenance- free. This means that motorists should not check or top off the electrolyte levels in maintenance-free batteries.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
OK? Note the use of the term MANY there....
This means that, like many have said, that some "maintenance-free" batteries really aren't. That they CAN be maintained. Similar to the statements made by Exide and Interstate. And this backs what JHZR2 has stated. Yes, SOME batteries are sealed. I can think of no better example than the Optima AGM batteries as one that is truly MAINTENANCE-FREE as there is NO WAY to add electrolyte to the battery. However, with many other batteries, like many of the Exide ones I've owned, despite being a "Maintenance-free" design, you can check and top up the electrolyte IF NEEDED, which is in-line with their literature.
Your original post painted an absolute picture about "Maintenance-free" batteries. And you heavily contested what JHZR2 posted. Yet here, you open saying the same thing, but it really isn't supported by what you post after that. If I have an Exide "Maintenance-free" battery, and in the instructions that come with it, it says exactly what I posted from Exide earlier, is time going to fold in upon itself because we've created some sort of paradox here? That I'm not supposed to check the electrolyte because it is "Maintenance-free" yet the instructions say that if operating under extreme conditions, I may need to add water to the battery? AND the caps are easily removed? Sweet man-baby Jesus, I've just resurrected the Lord in my backyard and he's having tea with my kids!
Now if only the Doc would get back here with my time machine.....
According to BCI, the majority of today's auto batteries are maintenance- free. This means that motorists should not check or top off the electrolyte levels in maintenance-free batteries.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
OK? Note the use of the term MANY there....
This means that, like many have said, that some "maintenance-free" batteries really aren't. That they CAN be maintained. Similar to the statements made by Exide and Interstate. And this backs what JHZR2 has stated. Yes, SOME batteries are sealed. I can think of no better example than the Optima AGM batteries as one that is truly MAINTENANCE-FREE as there is NO WAY to add electrolyte to the battery. However, with many other batteries, like many of the Exide ones I've owned, despite being a "Maintenance-free" design, you can check and top up the electrolyte IF NEEDED, which is in-line with their literature.
Your original post painted an absolute picture about "Maintenance-free" batteries. And you heavily contested what JHZR2 posted. Yet here, you open saying the same thing, but it really isn't supported by what you post after that. If I have an Exide "Maintenance-free" battery, and in the instructions that come with it, it says exactly what I posted from Exide earlier, is time going to fold in upon itself because we've created some sort of paradox here? That I'm not supposed to check the electrolyte because it is "Maintenance-free" yet the instructions say that if operating under extreme conditions, I may need to add water to the battery? AND the caps are easily removed? Sweet man-baby Jesus, I've just resurrected the Lord in my backyard and he's having tea with my kids!
Now if only the Doc would get back here with my time machine.....
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: ram_man
According to BCI, the majority of today's auto batteries are maintenance- free. This means that motorists should not check or top off the electrolyte levels in maintenance-free batteries.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
OK? Note the use of the term MANY there....
This means that, like many have said, that some "maintenance-free" batteries really aren't. That they CAN be maintained. Similar to the statements made by Exide and Interstate. And this backs what JHZR2 has stated. Yes, SOME batteries are sealed. I can think of no better example than the Optima AGM batteries as one that is truly MAINTENANCE-FREE as there is NO WAY to add electrolyte to the battery. However, with many other batteries, like many of the Exide ones I've owned, despite being a "Maintenance-free" design, you can check and top up the electrolyte IF NEEDED, which is in-line with their literature.
Your original post painted an absolute picture about "Maintenance-free" batteries. And you heavily contested what JHZR2 posted. Yet here, you open saying the same thing, but it really isn't supported by what you post after that. If I have an Exide "Maintenance-free" battery, and in the instructions that come with it, it says exactly what I posted from Exide earlier, is time going to fold in upon itself because we've created some sort of paradox here? That I'm not supposed to check the electrolyte because it is "Maintenance-free" yet the instructions say that if operating under extreme conditions, I may need to add water to the battery? AND the caps are easily removed? Sweet man-baby Jesus, I've just resurrected the Lord in my backyard and he's having tea with my kids!
Now if only the Doc would get back here with my time machine.....
first off optima batteries of a total different design they are gel batteries, so yes they're maintenance free but most car batteries are also maintenance free. so a gel battery versus a water based electrolyte battery is apples to oranges.
you cannot even fast charge a gel battery they are a very different animal. on MOST maintenance free batteries when you pry off the "caps" you damage the seal and harm the vent causing a potential gassing issue. its generally not a good idea. the few batteries where it can be done should only be done by people with a great understanding for batteries, how they work and function. which means most of us on here shouldn't be doing it.
Originally Posted By: ram_man
According to BCI, the majority of today's auto batteries are maintenance- free. This means that motorists should not check or top off the electrolyte levels in maintenance-free batteries.
"Battery manufacturers provide instructions with their products, and a motorist should read and follow all of instructions that come with the battery," said Randy Hart, President of BCI. Mr. Hart also is President of Superior Battery Manufacturing, Co. in Russell Springs, Kentucky.
In addition, the battery label generally provides guidelines: many maintenance-free battery labels carry a "do not open" or similar statement. Finally, battery caps that appear to be removable may actually be glued or locked in place. "If a battery cap is meant to be opened, it can be opened without much effort. Forcing or prying these caps open may destroy or permanently damage the battery," Mr. Hart said.
OK? Note the use of the term MANY there....
This means that, like many have said, that some "maintenance-free" batteries really aren't. That they CAN be maintained. Similar to the statements made by Exide and Interstate. And this backs what JHZR2 has stated. Yes, SOME batteries are sealed. I can think of no better example than the Optima AGM batteries as one that is truly MAINTENANCE-FREE as there is NO WAY to add electrolyte to the battery. However, with many other batteries, like many of the Exide ones I've owned, despite being a "Maintenance-free" design, you can check and top up the electrolyte IF NEEDED, which is in-line with their literature.
Your original post painted an absolute picture about "Maintenance-free" batteries. And you heavily contested what JHZR2 posted. Yet here, you open saying the same thing, but it really isn't supported by what you post after that. If I have an Exide "Maintenance-free" battery, and in the instructions that come with it, it says exactly what I posted from Exide earlier, is time going to fold in upon itself because we've created some sort of paradox here? That I'm not supposed to check the electrolyte because it is "Maintenance-free" yet the instructions say that if operating under extreme conditions, I may need to add water to the battery? AND the caps are easily removed? Sweet man-baby Jesus, I've just resurrected the Lord in my backyard and he's having tea with my kids!
Now if only the Doc would get back here with my time machine.....
first off optima batteries of a total different design they are gel batteries, so yes they're maintenance free but most car batteries are also maintenance free. so a gel battery versus a water based electrolyte battery is apples to oranges.
you cannot even fast charge a gel battery they are a very different animal. on MOST maintenance free batteries when you pry off the "caps" you damage the seal and harm the vent causing a potential gassing issue. its generally not a good idea. the few batteries where it can be done should only be done by people with a great understanding for batteries, how they work and function. which means most of us on here shouldn't be doing it.
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Originally Posted By: ram_man
first off optima batteries of a total different design they are gel batteries, so yes they're maintenance free but most car batteries are also maintenance free. so a gel battery versus a water based electrolyte battery is apples to oranges.
They are AGM, which is Absorbed Glass Matt. Why did you think they were gel?
You know for a guy with some pretty concrete opinions on this topic your knowledge appears to be a bit lacking.... Just saying
Quote:
you cannot even fast charge a gel battery they are a very different animal.
Well luckily I wasn't talking about a gel battery then
Quote:
on MOST maintenance free batteries when you pry off the "caps" you damage the seal and harm the vent causing a potential gassing issue. its generally not a good idea. the few batteries where it can be done should only be done by people with a great understanding for batteries, how they work and function. which means most of us on here shouldn't be doing it.
LMAO!!
Dude, how old are you?
MOST maintenance free batteries? How many Exide batteries have you touched?
What sets apart a "Maintenance free" battery from a "maintainable" battery that makes it more dangerous to handle or maintain assuming it is the type with the removable caps? Give me a SOLID answer here, because I'm dying to know! Have you ever owned or worked on a battery that is designed to be maintained? Ever owned a golf cart?
first off optima batteries of a total different design they are gel batteries, so yes they're maintenance free but most car batteries are also maintenance free. so a gel battery versus a water based electrolyte battery is apples to oranges.
They are AGM, which is Absorbed Glass Matt. Why did you think they were gel?
You know for a guy with some pretty concrete opinions on this topic your knowledge appears to be a bit lacking.... Just saying
Quote:
you cannot even fast charge a gel battery they are a very different animal.
Well luckily I wasn't talking about a gel battery then
Quote:
on MOST maintenance free batteries when you pry off the "caps" you damage the seal and harm the vent causing a potential gassing issue. its generally not a good idea. the few batteries where it can be done should only be done by people with a great understanding for batteries, how they work and function. which means most of us on here shouldn't be doing it.
LMAO!!
Dude, how old are you?
MOST maintenance free batteries? How many Exide batteries have you touched?
What sets apart a "Maintenance free" battery from a "maintainable" battery that makes it more dangerous to handle or maintain assuming it is the type with the removable caps? Give me a SOLID answer here, because I'm dying to know! Have you ever owned or worked on a battery that is designed to be maintained? Ever owned a golf cart?
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
My wife works with commercial floor cleaning equipment, powered by batteries... They are instructed to CHECK and TOP OFF the batteries to prevent them from failing prematurely.
NOOOOOO ERIC!! She WILL DIE!!!!!! DO NOT TOUCH A BATTERY! IT HAS GHOST DUST INSIDE OF IT THAT WILL STEAL YOUR SOUL!!!!!
My wife works with commercial floor cleaning equipment, powered by batteries... They are instructed to CHECK and TOP OFF the batteries to prevent them from failing prematurely.
NOOOOOO ERIC!! She WILL DIE!!!!!! DO NOT TOUCH A BATTERY! IT HAS GHOST DUST INSIDE OF IT THAT WILL STEAL YOUR SOUL!!!!!
OVERKILL
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Originally Posted By: The_Eric
My wife works with commercial floor cleaning equipment, powered by batteries... They are instructed to CHECK and TOP OFF the batteries to prevent them from failing prematurely.
In all seriousness though, we have a forklift at the office that is the same way. Has a big bank of batteries in it that you are supposed to check the electrolyte on every few operating cycles and top up as needed using distilled water.
My wife works with commercial floor cleaning equipment, powered by batteries... They are instructed to CHECK and TOP OFF the batteries to prevent them from failing prematurely.
In all seriousness though, we have a forklift at the office that is the same way. Has a big bank of batteries in it that you are supposed to check the electrolyte on every few operating cycles and top up as needed using distilled water.
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