You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should be. It's a high temperature nylon based plastic, so it can take the punishment of its intended environment. FRAM has a video (it's been posted here many times) talking about the rigorous testing they put the bypass valve through.
Honda 15400-PLM-A02 oil filter now made in USA
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Yeah either the rep who posts here or the video states it is glass impregnated nylon, I don't remember which source though.
Anybody who has watched that video and still worries about it is either OCD or has internet based Fram hysteria syndrome IMO.
Anybody who has watched that video and still worries about it is either OCD or has internet based Fram hysteria syndrome IMO.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should be. It's a high temperature nylon based plastic, so it can take the punishment of its intended environment. FRAM has a video (it's been posted here many times) talking about the rigorous testing they put the bypass valve through.
I'm not too concerned, as I like the FU and its white plastic bypass valve.
I just wanted to know if there was a "DIFFERENCE" in one being black and the other being white, other then the color.
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should be. It's a high temperature nylon based plastic, so it can take the punishment of its intended environment. FRAM has a video (it's been posted here many times) talking about the rigorous testing they put the bypass valve through.
I'm not too concerned, as I like the FU and its white plastic bypass valve.
I just wanted to know if there was a "DIFFERENCE" in one being black and the other being white, other then the color.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound data based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound data based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I just wanted to know if there was a "DIFFERENCE" in one being black and the other being white, other then the color.
I doubt it if there is really any real difference besides the color. I'm sure both were engineered to take the hot oil environment they are design for. You have no trust in engineering science and testing.
I just wanted to know if there was a "DIFFERENCE" in one being black and the other being white, other then the color.
I doubt it if there is really any real difference besides the color. I'm sure both were engineered to take the hot oil environment they are design for. You have no trust in engineering science and testing.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Call Honda and talk to their Chief Engineer.
You think Honda is going to risk massive warranty repairs by recommending using an oil filter for 2 OCIs? Honda has some of the best engineers in the world. No reason to not trust what they engineer and the reasons behind it.
Also, I'm sure there are some members here who have ran oil filters for 2 or 3 OCIs and have UOAs that show the wear particles are still OK. Go to that forum and ask them to show that testing, which is the kind of "scientific proof" you are looking for.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Call Honda and talk to their Chief Engineer.
You think Honda is going to risk massive warranty repairs by recommending using an oil filter for 2 OCIs? Honda has some of the best engineers in the world. No reason to not trust what they engineer and the reasons behind it.
Also, I'm sure there are some members here who have ran oil filters for 2 or 3 OCIs and have UOAs that show the wear particles are still OK. Go to that forum and ask them to show that testing, which is the kind of "scientific proof" you are looking for.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Call Honda and talk to their Chief Engineer.
Would he/she/it be able to provide that information? I just am saying, and will continue to, until I see someone post that it is proven to be ok for an oil filter to be used 2+ OCIs, they are only going by what someone says is ok to do.
I'm sure that reply will open up a HUGE can of worms, such as; do you do as your dr. tells you? Do you do as your dietitian tells you? Do you do as your wife (
) tells you? By doing so, you can get the proof on the interweb and it is there. Where does it show proof about the multiple OCI filter use?
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever." But, as I have also stated before, until someone can show me actual scientific lab results/proof that it is proven an oil filter can be used for 2+ OCI's, I will NEVER condone it! Simple!
If a car manufacture like Honda says it OK to use an oil filter for 2 OCIs, then I have to believe their engineers have made that decision based on sound date based on science and testing. Doubt they just spew that out after drinking a bunch of Sake.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sake
Scientific Method
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
Scientific Method Findings
http://physics.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/a/scimethod.htm
Show me.
Call Honda and talk to their Chief Engineer.
Would he/she/it be able to provide that information? I just am saying, and will continue to, until I see someone post that it is proven to be ok for an oil filter to be used 2+ OCIs, they are only going by what someone says is ok to do.
I'm sure that reply will open up a HUGE can of worms, such as; do you do as your dr. tells you? Do you do as your dietitian tells you? Do you do as your wife (
Ok, I just called US Honda CS @ 1 800 999 1009 #7, and they will have someone call me back within (2) hours.
To be continued............
To be continued............
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Ok, I just called US Honda CS @ 1 800 999 1009 #7, and they will have someone call me back within (2) hours.
To be continued............
Be sure to tell them you drive a Ford.
Ok, I just called US Honda CS @ 1 800 999 1009 #7, and they will have someone call me back within (2) hours.
To be continued............
Be sure to tell them you drive a Ford.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should be.
Ooop ... meant to say:
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should'nt be
That's what I thought you meant.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should be.
Ooop ... meant to say:
You guys who are concerned about the "plastic bypass valves" should'nt be
That's what I thought you meant.
Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Ok, I just called US Honda CS @ 1 800 999 1009 #7, and they will have someone call me back within (2) hours.
To be continued............
Be sure to tell them you drive a Ford.
That thar's funny rot thar!
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Ok, I just called US Honda CS @ 1 800 999 1009 #7, and they will have someone call me back within (2) hours.
To be continued............
Be sure to tell them you drive a Ford.
That thar's funny rot thar!
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Would he/she/it be able to provide that information? I just am saying, and will continue to, until I see someone post that it is proven to be ok for an oil filter to be used 2+ OCIs, they are only going by what someone says is ok to do.
If Honda says you can use an oil filter for 2 OCIs based on your driving habits, then they have a reason to say that. They didn't pull it our of their you know what. There are engineering reasons they say that ... not to just freak people out.
Would he/she/it be able to provide that information? I just am saying, and will continue to, until I see someone post that it is proven to be ok for an oil filter to be used 2+ OCIs, they are only going by what someone says is ok to do.
If Honda says you can use an oil filter for 2 OCIs based on your driving habits, then they have a reason to say that. They didn't pull it our of their you know what. There are engineering reasons they say that ... not to just freak people out.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever."
That wasn't the point of my post. It appeared to me that you were saying that the lower efficiency of the Honda filter is even more reason to change it every time. What I'm saying is that Honda specifies a lower efficiency BECAUSE they recommend an oil filter change at every other oil change. Filter efficiency and filter capacity go hand-in-hand. You would not want to run a high-efficiency filter twice, because it will load up and bypass. Conversely, you don't get the benefit of the lower-efficiency filter if you run it just once. Lower efficiency filters are designed that way because they are intended to be used twice.
My point wasn't to make you change your habits; it was to point out the engineering reasoning behind the recommendation with this particular filter.
I am not out to MAKE everyone do as I do, or continue to change the filter every OCI "because that's how its been done forever."
That wasn't the point of my post. It appeared to me that you were saying that the lower efficiency of the Honda filter is even more reason to change it every time. What I'm saying is that Honda specifies a lower efficiency BECAUSE they recommend an oil filter change at every other oil change. Filter efficiency and filter capacity go hand-in-hand. You would not want to run a high-efficiency filter twice, because it will load up and bypass. Conversely, you don't get the benefit of the lower-efficiency filter if you run it just once. Lower efficiency filters are designed that way because they are intended to be used twice.
My point wasn't to make you change your habits; it was to point out the engineering reasoning behind the recommendation with this particular filter.
Is everyone sitting down? I just got off of the phone with a HQSR (Honda Qualified Service Rep.) who stated, "Honda leaves the decision up to the Honda auto tech as to "IF" the oil filter needs to be replaced at each OCI." Then I asked her, "Who trains the tech to know if the filter needs to be changed each OCI? He can't see through the filter or open it up...." Again, she stated it is up to the tech. Then I asked her if she could give me Honda's engine engineering dept. so I could ask them this Q? She stated, "It would then be the service advisor/mgr. you need to ask this Q? to. We have "NO" engine engineer dept. that can answer your Q?'s."
W T H ! I smell a HUGE rat!
Does anyone else want to call Honda? I provided the number and ext. above in another post.
Like I am really to believe it's a techs call to replace the filter or not, and if it's questioned, it's the service mgr. who makes the decision. I wasn't born yesterday!
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
This stinks to HIGH HEAVEN!
I'm not through with Honda. I will call a dealership and ask a service mgr. what Honda USA told me.
To be continued..........
Does anyone else want to call Honda? I provided the number and ext. above in another post.
Like I am really to believe it's a techs call to replace the filter or not, and if it's questioned, it's the service mgr. who makes the decision. I wasn't born yesterday!
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
This stinks to HIGH HEAVEN!
I'm not through with Honda. I will call a dealership and ask a service mgr. what Honda USA told me.
To be continued..........
Hah! X-ray vision? Or just change it and make another couple of bucks, which do you think they pick?
Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Hah! X-ray vision? Or just change it and make another couple of bucks, which do you think they pick?
That's a good Q? KC? When Honda advertise's an oil change does it specify if the filter is included, or is there an asterik stating, "only if needed."
Hah! X-ray vision? Or just change it and make another couple of bucks, which do you think they pick?
That's a good Q? KC? When Honda advertise's an oil change does it specify if the filter is included, or is there an asterik stating, "only if needed."
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Is everyone sitting down? I just got off of the phone with a HQSR (Honda Qualified Service Rep.) who stated, "Honda leaves the decision up to the Honda auto tech as to "IF" the oil filter needs to be replaced at each OCI."
There are legitimate reasons to change a filter sooner than required, and these are reasons that a service technician can identify. If the filter is leaking, you would want to replace it. If the filter has bulged or deformed for whatever reason, you would want to replace it. These are things that a service technican can see as he or she services the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
She is simply mistaken on that, and is not familiar with the "A" and "B" service common on nearly every Honda sold today. You can verify this yourself:
On an "A" service, you change the oil only. On a "B" service, you change the oil, the filter, and inspect a number of other things. In Honda's Maintenance Minder system, the service alerts alternate between "A" and "B", so you are instructed by the car to change the oil filter on every other oil change.
Is everyone sitting down? I just got off of the phone with a HQSR (Honda Qualified Service Rep.) who stated, "Honda leaves the decision up to the Honda auto tech as to "IF" the oil filter needs to be replaced at each OCI."
There are legitimate reasons to change a filter sooner than required, and these are reasons that a service technician can identify. If the filter is leaking, you would want to replace it. If the filter has bulged or deformed for whatever reason, you would want to replace it. These are things that a service technican can see as he or she services the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
She is simply mistaken on that, and is not familiar with the "A" and "B" service common on nearly every Honda sold today. You can verify this yourself:
On an "A" service, you change the oil only. On a "B" service, you change the oil, the filter, and inspect a number of other things. In Honda's Maintenance Minder system, the service alerts alternate between "A" and "B", so you are instructed by the car to change the oil filter on every other oil change.
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Is everyone sitting down? I just got off of the phone with a HQSR (Honda Qualified Service Rep.) who stated, "Honda leaves the decision up to the Honda auto tech as to "IF" the oil filter needs to be replaced at each OCI."
There are legitimate reasons to change a filter sooner than required, and these are reasons that a service technician can identify. If the filter is leaking, you would want to replace it. If the filter has bulged or deformed for whatever reason, you would want to replace it. These are things that a service technican can see as he or she services the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
She is simply mistaken on that, and is not familiar with the "A" and "B" service common on nearly every Honda sold today. You can verify this yourself:
On an "A" service, you change the oil only. On a "B" service, you change the oil, the filter, and inspect a number of other things. In Honda's Maintenance Minder system, the service alerts alternate between "A" and "B", so you are instructed by the car to change the oil filter on every other oil change.
I agree, she had no clue!
If a tech does the required oil filter check as you stated, how does he check inside the filter, the media itself to see if it is too dirty, clogged, or torn in any way? Someone please answer that Q?
Or, does he just "ASSUMES" the filter is ok, from all his vast training on filters being checked from the outside only?
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Is everyone sitting down? I just got off of the phone with a HQSR (Honda Qualified Service Rep.) who stated, "Honda leaves the decision up to the Honda auto tech as to "IF" the oil filter needs to be replaced at each OCI."
There are legitimate reasons to change a filter sooner than required, and these are reasons that a service technician can identify. If the filter is leaking, you would want to replace it. If the filter has bulged or deformed for whatever reason, you would want to replace it. These are things that a service technican can see as he or she services the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Oh, and she stated, "It is nowhere written, nor recommended, in ANY Honda Owners manual to use an oil filter for multiple OCIs."
She is simply mistaken on that, and is not familiar with the "A" and "B" service common on nearly every Honda sold today. You can verify this yourself:
On an "A" service, you change the oil only. On a "B" service, you change the oil, the filter, and inspect a number of other things. In Honda's Maintenance Minder system, the service alerts alternate between "A" and "B", so you are instructed by the car to change the oil filter on every other oil change.
I agree, she had no clue!
If a tech does the required oil filter check as you stated, how does he check inside the filter, the media itself to see if it is too dirty, clogged, or torn in any way? Someone please answer that Q?
Or, does he just "ASSUMES" the filter is ok, from all his vast training on filters being checked from the outside only?
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