87 BMW 325i M20 engine. Valvoline VR1. Advice

[Nick26]

I have a 1987 BMW 325i with a M20 engine (2.5 liter I6) with 103,000 miles.

I read on the BMW forum that my car needs a high Zinc oil. I utilized the Valvoline VR1 that was mentioned on the forum for the last 2-3 oil changes. This time I noticed on the back of the bottle, it states "this oil should not be used for extended time on cars with catalytic converters" (which my car does have).

So, with my big concern, as this car is my baby, I emailed Valvoline and I told them what car I have, that I have been using VR1 and I asked is it safe to continue using it in my car. They stated that I should not use the VR1 as "it will poison your o2 sensor." I accidentally emailed them twice and two different people emailed me back from Valvoline with the same "it will poison your o2 sensor" answer.

I am kind of stuck as I want to do good for my engine and that seems to be an oil with high ZDDP but I also do not want to harm any other part of my car.

Will using the Valvoline VR1 "racing oil" as my sole oil harm the longevity of my catalytic converter and/or o2 sensor?

Please advice.

 

[OVERKILL]

You do not need an oil with high zinc. An oil like Mobil 1 0w-40 or Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5w-40 has MORE than enough ZDDP for your application and what I use in my M5.

 

[190E26FTW]

When I had a 1991 325i I always used Castrol GTX 20w50. Car ran great and had great power climbing the hills in San Francisco. Only problem was I got some sludge from changing out the oil at 7000 miles. So for you...maybe change it out a little bit early.

 

[Nick26]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
You do not need an oil with high zinc. An oil like Mobil 1 0w-40 or Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5w-40 has MORE than enough ZDDP for your application and what I use in my M5.


Yours is a much newer engine which does not require the zddp like my old engine. My understanding is my M20 flat tappet engine needs the high Zinc to keep it healthy.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Nick26
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
You do not need an oil with high zinc. An oil like Mobil 1 0w-40 or Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5w-40 has MORE than enough ZDDP for your application and what I use in my M5.


Yours is a much newer engine which does not require the zddp like my old engine. My understanding is my M20 flat tappet engine needs the high Zinc to keep it healthy.


That is incorrect. Both of our engines are cam over bucket. Mine is valve springed to spin to 7,000RPM, which, if anything, means that mine requires higher levels of anti-wear additives than yours.

If mine were roller and yours were flat tappet, you'd have a point, but that's not the case here.

 

[Nick26]

Originally Posted By: 190E26FTW
When I had a 1991 325i I always used Castrol GTX 20w50. Car ran great and had great power climbing the hills in San Francisco. Only problem was I got some sludge from changing out the oil at 7000 miles. So for you...maybe change it out a little bit early.


That is exactly what I used (Castrol GTX High Miles 20w50) before I started reading about needing oil with high zinc for our M20 motors.

 

[artificialist]

I wouldn't use Valvoline VR-1 because race oils often have lower detergent content than street oils.

OHC engines with flat lifters do fine on SN oil unless the engine is not designed properly. The engines that suffer are OHV engines with heavy springs and high lift. If you really want high ZDDP and something that works well in a European car, Shell RT6 is an excellent choice.

 

[Nick26]

Thank you for the follow up response "overkill"

I am getting my oil changed this Saturday and I need advice bad. I only want to do good by my car and do not want to harm it in anyway. That is the reason of my concern with the Valvoline VR1 and the catalytic converter, o2 sensor.

My whole reading from the BMW e30 forums is my flat tappet M20 engine needs the higher zinc. If that is wrong. Then I shouldn't use the VR1 anymore and go back the the Castrol GTX High Mileage?

 

[OVERKILL]

FWIW, those speaking with respect to GTX 20w-50:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=236264
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=721546
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1856324
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2098567

You'll see that Phosphorous hovers around the 800ppm mark for the older formula, 900ppm for the newer one. Zinc is around 1000ppm for the old formula, 1100ppm for the newer one.

Compared to M1 0w-40 SN:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2365762

900ppm Phosphorous, 1050ppm Zinc.

I don't see GTX offering up anything more in the anti-wear department

And the previous versions were less robust.

What I see is an oil with a [censored] VI and poor low temp performance. But I'm sure it is cheap.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Nick26
Thank you for the follow up response "overkill"

I am getting my oil changed this Saturday and I need advice bad. I only want to do good by my car and do not want to harm it in anyway. That is the reason of my concern with the Valvoline VR1 and the catalytic converter, o2 sensor.

My whole reading from the BMW e30 forums is my flat tappet M20 engine needs the higher zinc. If that is wrong. Then I shouldn't use the VR1 anymore and go back the the Castrol GTX High Mileage?


You have a European car, there are many European oils on the market that are more than adequate for your application. Don't over-think this. Mobil 1 0w-40, Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5w-40, Valvoline Synpower 5w-40 Euro....etc. If it says Euro or European formula on the bottle, it will perform admirably in your application.

 

[Roadkingnc]

There are two different versions of vr1 racing oil, not street legal has low detergent levels. The other version has detergents.

 

[Nick26]

Originally Posted By: Roadkingnc
There are two different versions of vr1 racing oil, not street legal has low detergent levels. The other version has detergents.


The one I have used is the regular VR1 (silver bottle)

 

[Nick26]

What options do I have if I want to stick with 20w-50 and conventional oil, not synthetic?

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Nick26
What options do I have if I want to stick with 20w-50 and conventional oil, not synthetic?


Run a 15w-40 HDEO if you don't want to pony up the money for a Euro-spec synthetic. Delvac 15w-40, DELO 15w-40, Valvoline Premium Blue 15w-40, Rotella....etc.

 

[Nick26]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Nick26
What options do I have if I want to stick with 20w-50 and conventional oil, not synthetic?


Run a 15w-40 HDEO if you don't want to pony up the money for a Euro-spec synthetic. Delvac 15w-40, DELO 15w-40, Valvoline Premium Blue 15w-40, Rotella....etc.


Believe me it is not about the money. This car has plenty of money into it by being pampered. It is more about the recommendation from factory 20w-50 and conventional was what was used back when the car came out. So, thats what I want to keep.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
Overkill - an excellent recommendation!

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Nick26
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Nick26
What options do I have if I want to stick with 20w-50 and conventional oil, not synthetic?


Run a 15w-40 HDEO if you don't want to pony up the money for a Euro-spec synthetic. Delvac 15w-40, DELO 15w-40, Valvoline Premium Blue 15w-40, Rotella....etc.


Believe me it is not about the money. This car has plenty of money into it by being pampered. It is more about the recommendation from factory 20w-50 and conventional was what was used back when the car came out. So, thats what I want to keep.


Doesn't the manual have an oil recommendation chart in it listing numerous grades of oil depending on ambient temperature?

Remember, 5w-40 and 0w-40 didn't exist in 1987. A lot about oil technology has changed since then bud

 

[Nick26]

Will the regular Valvoline VR1 with detergent do any harm to the catalytic converter or o2 sensor?

I know I read this is a controversy of why oil companies stopped using so much ZDDP some state it really has nothing to do with harming the catalytic converter or o2 sensor.

 

[OVERKILL]

Also, according to the Mobil oil recommendation tool, their 0w-40 is indeed the proper lubricant for your car:

 

[Nick26]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Nick26
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Nick26
What options do I have if I want to stick with 20w-50 and conventional oil, not synthetic?


Run a 15w-40 HDEO if you don't want to pony up the money for a Euro-spec synthetic. Delvac 15w-40, DELO 15w-40, Valvoline Premium Blue 15w-40, Rotella....etc.


Believe me it is not about the money. This car has plenty of money into it by being pampered. It is more about the recommendation from factory 20w-50 and conventional was what was used back when the car came out. So, thats what I want to keep.


Doesn't the manual have an oil recommendation chart in it listing numerous grades of oil depending on ambient temperature?

Remember, 5w-40 and 0w-40 didn't exist in 1987. A lot about oil technology has changed since then bud

True, but also in 1987 gasoline was straight gasoline. No talk about ethanol. Now there is ethanol in most gas, so I have to go all over the place to refill with non-ethanol gasoline.