smart (Mercedes) requires MB 229.5. but not 229.51

[Elmosisu]

First post here........ Glad to be a apart of this esteemed forum!

I own a 2008 smart fortwo that we've had for just over a year, that has a Mitsubishi 1 liter gas engine that require the MB 229.5 oil requirement. I have been using Amsoil for years, and without much thought, figured the low-SAPS 5w-30 euro forumla would be fine for its typical 10k change interval.

I have come to learn that perhaps this is not the case, and that I should consider an earlier interval and be sure to find a solid ( if not Amsoil) MB 229.5 Rated oil in order to comply and be sure about the next 10k interval.

Seems a little odd that Amsoil has other oils that have had 25k extended intervals for years, but somehow those won't apply to my situation because of the presence or lack of that MB 229.5 rating. I kinda feel comfortable with a 7.5k oil change for no other reason than it gives me a buffer. I know that without a Blackstone test, I'm [censored] in the wind, but I would like some input on what you guys think?

 

[Falcon_LS]

What's the Mitsubishi engine code? The MB Sheet 229.5 rating probably has more to do with extended drains, but I definitely would avoid low SAPS oils like the plague if you're using high sulfur gas. Having said that, MB Sheet 229.51 is a diesel specification.

What viscosity rating is required? If you're out of warranty, my suggestion would be Pennzoil Ultra 5W-40.

 

[Elmosisu]

Ethanol gas is the concern from what I'm told on the smart forum. Not sure about high sulfer content in Oregon. The weight chart for smart is fairly flexible with 0w30 to 10w-40 depending on ambient. Most members use M1 0w-40 MB 229.5.


The amsoil bottle on the euro 5w-30 does say for gas and Diesel engines Why would it list just the 229.51 rating?

 

[Smart_Guy]

Hello there and welcome to BITOG.

Mercedes have their own standards and regulations when it comes to fluids and oils.

If it is a gas engine made after 2005 then the right approval is indeed 229.5, therefore stick to this list:
http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/229.5_en.html

229.51 is exclusively for diesel engines. Here is it's official list as a reference:
http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/229.51_en.html

As for the changing interval, strictly follow what is written in the owner's manual. You also need to know that change intervals of more than 10,000 kilometers need a special oil filter. If I remember correctly it is called feelees or something like that.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Elmosisu
The amsoil bottle on the euro 5w-30 does say for gas and Diesel engines Why would it list just the 229.51 rating?

It is not possible for the same oil to meet both 229.51 as well as 229.5. That's why Amsoil has separate products to address each one.

229.51 requires sulfated ash to be no more than 0.8%. That's what makes it low SAPS.

229.5 requires sulfated ash to be from 1.0% to 1.6%.

So you can see that the two are mutually exclusive.

Even though MB allows the use of 229.51 in their gasoline engines in Europe, they don't allow it in the US due to different gasoline quality standards. Our gasoline is not ultra-low-sulfur (apart from the state of California), and it has ethanol. This leads to quicker oil additive pack depletion making it hard for a low SAPs oil to make it to 10K miles.

 

[Elmosisu]

Would I be safe to assume that I should change out my existing Amsoil MB229.51 before 5000 miles to be reasonably confident that the low SAPS does not get a chance to expire on me?

OR do I need to change it immediately? I only have about 3000 miles on it now with a Mobile 1 filter

 

[Quattro Pete]

5-7K miles should be fine. Heck, even 10K miles might just be OK. Without an oil analysis, it's hard to say for sure though.

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: Elmosisu
Would I be safe to assume that I should change out my existing Amsoil MB229.51 before 5000 miles to be reasonably confident that the low SAPS does not get a chance to expire on me?

OR do I need to change it immediately? I only have about 3000 miles on it now with a Mobile 1 filter



Not sure how the low saps would expire.

Or are you getting it mixed up with TBN.

I know all these new names etc have confused me somewhat.

I have noticed that the few direct injected petrol engines I have looked into are specced for mid/low saps oil.

I know the reasoning in a diesel with DPF, but I suppose there may be benefits for petrol vehicles aswell.

All low saps oil are all rated under ACEA specs for diesel and petrol vehicles.

So I suspect that the Amsoil is fine for both, perhaps an email to Amsoil to confirm might help.

 

[Elmosisu]

Thanks guys. I'll not panic, but I will be on the prowl for the next 229.5 oil change brand options

 

[tig1]

As for ethanol, it won't make a differance as to your OCI. We have had E10 here in Illinois since well back in the 90s and it hasn't affected my engines at all with the longer OCIs I do. I know others that go longer than I do(10K). Some out to 15 and 20K with no problems with a quality synthetic.

 

[montero1]

Originally Posted By: Elmosisu
First post here........ Glad to be a apart of this esteemed forum!

I own a 2008 smart fortwo that we've had for just over a year, that has a Mitsubishi 1 liter gas engine that require the MB 229.5 oil requirement. I have been using Amsoil for years, and without much thought, figured the low-SAPS 5w-30 euro forumla would be fine for its typical 10k change interval.

I have come to learn that perhaps this is not the case, and that I should consider an earlier interval and be sure to find a solid ( if not Amsoil) MB 229.5 Rated oil in order to comply and be sure about the next 10k interval.

Seems a little odd that Amsoil has other oils that have had 25k extended intervals for years, but somehow those won't apply to my situation because of the presence or lack of that MB 229.5 rating. I kinda feel comfortable with a 7.5k oil change for no other reason than it gives me a buffer. I know that without a Blackstone test, I'm [censored] in the wind, but I would like some input on what you guys think?



Amsoil EFM meets 229.5.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: montero1
Originally Posted By: Elmosisu
First post here........ Glad to be a apart of this esteemed forum!

I own a 2008 smart fortwo that we've had for just over a year, that has a Mitsubishi 1 liter gas engine that require the MB 229.5 oil requirement. I have been using Amsoil for years, and without much thought, figured the low-SAPS 5w-30 euro forumla would be fine for its typical 10k change interval.

I have come to learn that perhaps this is not the case, and that I should consider an earlier interval and be sure to find a solid ( if not Amsoil) MB 229.5 Rated oil in order to comply and be sure about the next 10k interval.

Seems a little odd that Amsoil has other oils that have had 25k extended intervals for years, but somehow those won't apply to my situation because of the presence or lack of that MB 229.5 rating. I kinda feel comfortable with a 7.5k oil change for no other reason than it gives me a buffer. I know that without a Blackstone test, I'm [censored] in the wind, but I would like some input on what you guys think?



Amsoil EFM meets 229.5.


No, it is recommended for 229.5.

 

[HerrStig]

I'd be interested in what Mitsu has to say, since THEY designed and built the engine.

 

[m37charlie]

One of the very best 229.5 oils is Mobil 1 0W40. It obviously has great viscometrics, and its' TBN of 11.8 allows it to neutralize acids better than virtually all of its' competitors.

Charlie