K&N filter after 50K miles of service (Pictures)

[barlowc]

Originally Posted By: skyship
The good people that built your car with a normal paper filter do know what they were doing ... blah blah blah

Please read my original post: I post these not to start another thread debating K&N filters. Rather, I just wanted to share some pictures.

I'm not saying K&N is better. I'm not saying everyone should use K&N. In fact, elsewhere I've said that if I had to do it over again, knowing what I know now (thanks to this site), I'd probably stick with OEM paper filters.

But, to provide due balance to those threads where folks have had problems with their K&N filters and filtration performance, I wanted to share my opposite experience which is supported by good UOAs and inspection of my air intake (i.e. no fine black dust) after 50K miles of use. I have had an identical good experience with our other vehicle too and posted about too, simply to share my results with everyone.

 

[Jim Allen]

You're right, of course, barlowc. K&N is one of those hot button topics, "fer-er-agin," and BITOG seems to grow ever more strident. You were probably asking more than you could realistically expect right now. Hope that won't stop you from doing it again, however. Any clear, civil and measured thought is welcome in my book.

I love input counter to my own. It's what helps me learn. About the time we get to thinking we know something, a person will provide some input that throws it all onto the floor for resorting. I will vigorously debate my fact/theories/opinions and try not to defend past the point when my defense falls apart in light of better info.

 

[Colt45ws]

Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
You're right, of course, barlowc. K&N is one of those hot button topics, "fer-er-agin," and BITOG seems to grow ever more strident. You were probably asking more than you could realistically expect right now. Hope that won't stop you from doing it again, however. Any clear, civil and measured thought is welcome in my book.

I love input counter to my own. It's what helps me learn. About the time we get to thinking we know something, a person will provide some input that throws it all onto the floor for resorting. I will vigorously debate my fact/theories/opinions and try not to defend past the point when my defense falls apart in light of better info.

+1 on all counts.

 

[tommygunn]

I wouldn't bother with one but glad its working out for you.

 

[boxcartommie22]

barlowc, its the fine dust that paper filters leave not the k&n filter!!! thats why i use the k&m air filter.

 

[barlowc]

Originally Posted By: boxcartommie22
barlowc, its the fine dust that paper filters leave not the k&n filter!!! thats why i use the k&m air filter.

Actually, what I've read is reports of K&N filter users have a fine black dust inside the clean side of their intakes. However, neither of my two vehicles have experienced that.

 

[ltslimjim]

I had the fine dust experience. Your app may vary. However, I'll let you know if the fine dust returns without the K&N, to be fair.

There are variables to using a K&N, IMO. Use it right; which can be dependent on factors outside of your control, and it seems it can do well.

 

[Jim Allen]

Look... once and for all... the efficiency of a properly cleaned and oiled K&N is adequate and in the high 90 percent range of a coarse dust ISO test. If it has a weakness... it doesn't do as well if fine dust is used. This weakness can be countered by the addition of an optional foam sock. Overall, you can safely say it's efficiency is considered "adequate" by most in the auto industry.

All bets are off with an improperly cleaned unit because efficiency will go into the toilet permanently.

I had some recent training that leads me to believe many of the things we attribute to filter inefficiency, i.e. finding dust in the intake, may really be a filter installation/fitment issue. A relatively small seal leak can let in a LOT of dust. I honestly don't know all the ins and outs yet because my view is so limited but I will now redouble my efforts on my own vehicles to always check fit, sealing and even to use some filter grease and will advise everyone else to do the same.

The oil-contiminated MAF thing is a myth.The test data provided by K&N on their website is pretty convincing unless you are a die-hard "they-all-lie-all-the-time" conspiracy theorist that refuses to believe anything presented.

For myself, I want more efficiency than I can get with a K&N or any other oil cotton gauze filter. That's a measured choice based on things outside the scope of this discussion .... perhaps my anality when it comes to filtration ( : < )

I don't badmouth K&N (any more, I have in the past on occasion) because I've had a good look inside that company and like what I see. The oiled cotton gauze filter has a place in the performance market and, of the companies that make them, I think K&N's is the best.

 

[bigmike]

Environmental influences are probably the most significant variable in choosing whether to use (or not use) a K&N air filter.

That's pretty much it as far as argumentative debate. The rest has been alot of speculation, unfair bias, repetitive argument, and unsupported claims.

I've used K&N filters for hundreds of thousands of miles in multiple vehicles, but I have chosen not to use their filters in certain applications. There must be more conscience thought going into the choice if you are going to have it as an option.

 

[ltslimjim]

Great post JA. If any concern, especially with a cone filter, just use a filter wrap/sock. It's easy and probably does the job so well that filter cleaning is even less of a need.

I'll be the fist to admit and to suppose that cleansing/re-application of oil can be somewhat difficult. To me, it boils down to take the time necessary for thoroughly air drying without doing something that might risk damaging the media during cleansing or drying. Also, they do recommend to add oil to the filter in stages.

For me, I may have cleaned too often in my previous experiences. My parent's vehicles each are equipped with a MAF and I installed the K&N drop-in replacements on each. However, I haven't tried pulling live data and comparing to stock readings. I don't have that capability, TBH.

I simply have changed out on my DD is all, and for my experience the air box screws shut and the K&N had plenty of gasket, so sealing isn't an issue in my app and the tube has no other air entry points post filter box; the tube which gets dusty. I simply started preferring a non-oiled filter of any sort to a dry synthetic of sorts. Which, IIRC, K&N also makes? I just opted for the Pro Dry S by aFe. Very pleased so far.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: skyship
The good people that built your car with a normal paper filter do know what they were doing and trying to beat them by fitting a different air filter system does not work.
There are lots of UOA results showing how important air filtration is and the only way to prove your new air filter is better would be to keep switching from using one, to using the original unit long enough to get conclusive UOA results.
The oil used for the K&N system can contaminate the MAF sensors on some cars like my Volvo diesel and cause false warnings related to air flow or turbo failure that only a dealer or chap with the code reader and program can reset.


I am awaiting my second report from Blackstone with a K&N FIPK on my Cherokee. The first showed LOWER silicon than with the stock (paper) filter.

 

[BISCUT]

I'm not pushing K&N but am using them in the 150 and Nissan in my sig. The 150 is a CAI and the Nissan stock air box replacement. I've just started with UOA and have only one each for both of them. Sure not enough to emphatically state anything, but the UOA's were both excellent.

So far my experience is consistent with that of the OP.

 

[Dually]

I just reinstalled my K&N in my Jeep.If you want to get the most service life out of your K&N filter use a K&N filter minder.K&N advises people who use their filter to clean the filter when the yellow indicator is in the red zone.Their filterminder guages are calibrated for 10 inches of water.Joe

 

[Sam_Julier]

+2 on all counts
Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
You're right, of course, barlowc. K&N is one of those hot button topics, "fer-er-agin," and BITOG seems to grow ever more strident. You were probably asking more than you could realistically expect right now. Hope that won't stop you from doing it again, however. Any clear, civil and measured thought is welcome in my book.

I love input counter to my own. It's what helps me learn. About the time we get to thinking we know something, a person will provide some input that throws it all onto the floor for resorting. I will vigorously debate my fact/theories/opinions and try not to defend past the point when my defense falls apart in light of better info.

 

[4IsWEm]

Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
Originally Posted By: skyship

The oil used for the K&N system can contaminate the MAF sensors on some cars like my Volvo diesel and cause false warnings related to air flow or turbo failure that only a dealer or chap with the code reader and program can reset.


If you thoroughly read This and follow all the links, you will change your mind. If you've read anything else in this section, you will know I have made a study of air filters and am no proponent of oiled cotton gauze filters, but fair is fair.

Is your air filtration study the one at the front pages of BITOG? If not, can you please provide a link? Thanks.

 

[Ken2]

Quote:
They seem to filter very efficient when they start to get dirty, far better than when they are clean.
So a new K&N out of the box should be pretreated with a handful of dirt to make it filter better?

And, how's that superior air flow thing with a dirt blanket on the filter?

 

[SteveSRT8]

After a season with the desert racers I quit using K&N in my cars. They were never a serious problem, but they are hardly some kind of "world standard" either. The only desert boys who use them anymore wrap them tightly in a pre-filter!

Many of their problems come from owners misunderstanding the servicing and over oiling the media, also cleaning way too often. I would venture that many folks change paper filters too often as well. Then there's Internet 'amplification', which makes any problem a HUGE issue!

They are not as bad as the Net makes them appear. But they are questionable on several levels compared to the best paper filters.

 

[bigmike]

I, and I'll make an assumption there are others, have basically quit posting favorable opinions about K&N air filters. I think people have little tolerance for middle of the road and feel a need to pick a side.

I'll probably use a K&N filter for the lifetime of my truck. Decided against it for the Accord, where the OEM filters appear to be of top quality.

I sure wouldn't recommend a K&N for many applications, especially in an off-road and dusty environment.

I suspect people have been bitten by the maintenance bug when it comes to air filters. Dealer service departments love to push a new, clean filter on unsuspecting people. They try it on me just the same. It's a waste of money to overmaintain an air filter change interval.

 

[lockguy]

I have a 2007 honda fit with 225k using mostly a k&n cold air intake. I have never had a uoa done so i don't know what si levels might be. What i can say is that from day one using paper filter, the way i drive the car was using a little bit of oil. I switched over fairly quickly to k&n. 225k later the car is burning NO more oil than day one, and it still runs fantastically.

However, I must say, you have to be very careful when you go to clean the filters, the instructions are not very clear on the site. The first time i cleaned it, i believe i put way to much oil in the filter. this actually caused the filter to partially clog. about 20-30k later i noticed that the filter started to cave in. The dust/dirt was not caked on (which is normally not bad), i just put to much oil.
I can only imagine that I didn't do my engine any favors during that run. Since then, I have lost the orininal box assembly and couldn't switch back so i bought a new k&n, but the car is still running great so who knows....

the flip side, not enough oil and the dust doesn't stick.