Trying 50/50 mix of 87 octange regular and E85

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Originally Posted By: crinkles
Originally Posted By: holla

The facts are the facts, E85 costs more per unit of energy and when buying fuel that's really what you're paying for.


but you're putting some corn farmer's kids through college in stead of buying some sheik's rich boy a maserati.


Around here all of the oil is local or from Canada. I'd much rather have my money go to Canada than to a corn farmer. Corn is one of the most evil plants there is.
 
ethanolblendgraph.png



I did some experimenting with using an E30 blend last spring in our van (2008 Toyota Sienna). Each bar of this graph is the mileage of four tanks of gas averaged together, all four of these tanks being the same percentage ethanol blend. The beginning of the graph starts in the summer of 2008, the end of the graph is Jan 2010.

I've been surprised that ethanol levels haven't had a bigger effect on mileage.
 
I just posted this on another thread.
I have been running a 50% ethanol mix in my cars for years, with “O” issues. In fact injector cleaner appears to be a thing of the past. My Mark VIII was running poorly and needed premium fuel. I started mixing a ½ tank of regular with a ½ tank of E85 = less total cost than regular. Cleaned the injectors right up and runs great.
I also run this mix in my 67 Ranchero as the 5.0 (89 Mustang engine) likes premium. My 2002 Lincoln Continental, 98 F-150 and sons 2006 Dakota all run great with no issues.
This spring I am converting our 1970 Mercury Cyclone 429CJ to E85. 105 octane for less than regular. All this talk about corrosion and etc seems to be a non-issue. I think people just assume that ethanol is like methanol and it’s not even close.
 
Originally Posted By: crinkles
ethanol from good sources (cane, biomass, algae etc) remains a viable option.


The big thing I see as overlooked is that corn is not used up in the making of ethanol. 60 to 80% of the corn grown in this country is for cattle feed. When this cattle feed is used to make ethanol what do you have left? Cattle feed! The only thing used out of the corn is the starch and sugars. The protein that the corn was grown for is still present, it is still high quality cattle feed. Also all the growing corn is equal to a renewable rain forest in the amounts of CO2 absorbed. Corn is only one of the things being used to make ethanol. Milo is another crop that makes good cattle feed and ethanol. It grows well in areas with less rain fall. We have millions of acres ready for use, there should be no impact on food prices as food is not being used, except for high fructose corn syrup, it is gone. Waste and recycled water is being used to produce ethanol. Citrus waste and garbage make good ethanol stock. The ways of making ethanol are growing rapidly.
 
Nope.. ethanol is not corrosive. It is often confused with methanol, which IS very corrosive. E 85 does have an affinity for water, but if kept dry is a great 102-105 octane fuel. Have used hundred of gallons in both flex and non flex vehicles. No corrosion, o-ring, gasket. plastic issues of any kind. Other than a slight mileage loss, no issues to report.
 
I am thinking about doing this in my car, which is spec'd for premium fuel. So far I only put in about a quarter tank of E85 to the premium I had left, which gives me about 25% alcohol and raised my octane up to about 96. I am gonna run it down and fill up next time with a 50/50 mix of E85 and regular 87 gas. Am I correct in understanding that those of you who did this, did so in normal cars which were not flex fuel or converted to flex fuel?
 
Originally Posted By: Aurora09
I am thinking about doing this in my car, which is spec'd for premium fuel. So far I only put in about a quarter tank of E85 to the premium I had left, which gives me about 25% alcohol and raised my octane up to about 96. I am gonna run it down and fill up next time with a 50/50 mix of E85 and regular 87 gas. Am I correct in understanding that those of you who did this, did so in normal cars which were not flex fuel or converted to flex fuel?


Aurora,
Most older fuel injection systems aren't capable of dealing with E85, without modification. Many (but not all) of the newer ones seem to do just fine with ethanol content up to 98%. My van would only handle about 40% before it started to run badly. I've put a 'WhiteLightning' conversion kit which sends an extra pulse to my injectors, which the FI is then able to correct down from. Runs find on E85.

This is a very easy modification. It takes about an hour to do.

My wife's unmodified Subaru is good closer to E50. If they ever put an E85 station anywhere close to where I live, I'm going to put the kit on it too.
 
I've been tempted to try out a tank of E85 in the Jeep when I've been up in Rochester. The computer can push the fuel tables up about 30% from where they're coded, and it usually runs with just a hair of negative fuel trim anyway. However, at WOT, I'd be just tapping 100% duty cycle on the injectors near redline for optimal AFRs. Being that the computer would probably run it a little lean anyway, not being tuned for E85, it should work fine.
 
Regarding the E85 conversion kits, I have seen two prominent ones online. White Lightning and Change2E85, with the white lightning being cheaper. The folks at the Aurora forum are stating that the computer needs to be reprogrammed, but the conversion companies indicate they more or less offer a plug in type device for the fuel injectors, so I'm looking for solid advice and a recommendation for one brand of kit. Thanks.
 
I don't have any advice on the Change2E85.

Of course, my old bus doesn't have anything that can really be called a computer, without seriously stretching the meaning of the word, so no reprogramming there.

My brother used a WL kit on his '99 2.5 RS with good results and no reprogramming. With both of us, the vehicles would tend to run a bit rich when being started on petrol, until the car went into closed-loop mode. The engine would still start just fine, but was rich enough that you could tell... so annoying.

We both installed a switch that interrupted the ground to the WL kit, so when we weren't running ethanol, we could shut down the system and use factory ECU settings. It's optional though.

All this said; we are both using a first generation WL kit. They have upgraded the system since we purchased ours. The newer ones may well work even better. I've probably gone about 15K miles or so on E85 exclusively and love the stuff.
 
My driving was mostly interstate, driving between Charleston, WV and Washington, D.C. two times a month with some minor city driving around D.C. I went from 20MPG on 87 octane to 18 MPG on E85. Not nearly the drop that I had expected.
 
I can send you some pictures of the unit installed in my van if you'd like; though I didn't install it per instructions. I spliced it into the system, rather than using their plug and play clips. I knew I wasn't going to be removing it during the life of the van.

Send me a PM with your email address if you are interested and I'll hook you up.
 
I switched to running E85 8 or 9 months ago. I make my own tunes so I've added more spark and reset the stoic setting along with rescaling the MAF curve. The injectors are larger to accomodate the ethanol and the slopes changed to the new injectors. So far it has caused me to need to install a 4 link and coilover shocks not to mention new tires and wheels. Lost some mileage but it is cheap race gas.
 
Hi Guys,
I'm also an E85 fun after several attempts with up to 45% ethanol in the gas.
2 open questions remained for me:
1. The oxygen sensor: E85 has lower combustion temperature like pure gas, but oxygen sensor requires high temperature to work correctly.
2. Lower MPG results much gasoline+ethanol mix could be dangeorous on the cylinder wall; flushing the oil resulting higher friction and engine wear.
Am I wrong?
 
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You are working with 2 fuels that have 2 different stoiciometric values. The gasoline is 14.64 and by adding E85 which is 9.85 you are running lean as it is. The ECM can compensate to a point. Don't worry about the cylinder walls. I go 6 months on oil changes and if the factory allows 100% E85 it isn't causing problems.
 
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