After long run Car won't start.

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SuperDave456

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I need options of where I go from here.

This is on a 2002 Ford Taurus with a 3.0 V6 SOHC Vulcan engine.

So my car has an issue where after a long hot run it won't start. Short trips, like to 7/11 down the street, it works fine, but if I drive home late at night. Then after that 45 minute stop-and-go drive where the engine is hot I decide to go get something to eat it wont start.

I have electricity, lights, windows, everything else works. I can hear the starter engage and it will attempt to turn the engine over. However when the starter attempts to turn the engine over the starter acts like my engine is full of jelly. The starter trys, but cannot turn the hot engine over.

I figured it was a short on the starter and decided to take it off and clean it and the connections last night. The Starter is mounted right under the oil filter and gets covered in oil every oil change and I figured that that had caused this issue.
Once I got to looking at it there was 1/4 inch thick layer of crud over some parts of the starter.

Anyways, I cleaned it up, reinstalled it and went on a drive. Highway and city to make sure everything was up to temp. When I got home I turned the car off, and then tried to restart it.

I still have the electrical problem.
My battery is only 1 year old and I have had that and my Alternator tested, by 2 different parts stores, and everything is well within spec.

Could it be my starter after 11 years is going out and only likes a well cooled car to start?
What else could it be?

Thanks!

-Dave
 
It could be that your starter is getting weak after all these years (provided that your battery and alternator have been tested repeatedly to be ok).

Try a new reman starter if you like. it's still electrical-related somehow ..

BTW: starter does go out and given taht yours is about 11 yrs old, it's about time?

Q.
 
Sounds like a failing starter to me. Heat soak raises the electrical resistance, and if there are some broken field wires or the brushes are getting bad, sometimes it just can't develop enough torque. It could even be a high resistance point in the solenoid contacts for that matter, but my guess is that its still starter related.

On old carbureted high-compression engines you could also get pre-ignition at cranking speeds that would push back against the starter... but I've *never* heard that on a modern car.
 
Likely the starter, or the cable to the starter is marginal and when heat soaked, doesn't pass enough current.
 
Yeah, that is kind of what I am thinking. 11 years and a 176,000 miles is pretty good for a starter.

The cables seem to be ok. I took a good look at them last night and could not diagnose anything wrong with them. Attachment points look solid, and I could find zero fraying of the wires or insulation.
 
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While I am at it is there a brand of Starter that yall would recommend more than others?

Might as well get the most bang for the buck while I am at it.

Thanks again!
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Likely the starter, or the cable to the starter is marginal and when heat soaked, doesn't pass enough current.


On my workplace Ford truck, the large cable to the starter looked perfect, but was "internally" corroded to the point it wouldn't pass enough current (that's what the garage told us).

Just passing this on because sometimes we make assumptions and miss the less obvious. But, I'm not sure how the hot engine would affect this.

Good luck.
 
I had an 84 LTD w/3.8 v6 that used to do the same thing. Replacing the starter cured it. I owned the car another 5 years afterwards.
 
Originally Posted By: doitmyself
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Likely the starter, or the cable to the starter is marginal and when heat soaked, doesn't pass enough current.


On my workplace Ford truck, the large cable to the starter looked perfect, but was "internally" corroded to the point it wouldn't pass enough current (that's what the garage told us).

Just passing this on because sometimes we make assumptions and miss the less obvious. But, I'm not sure how the hot engine would affect this.

Good luck.


Heat soak makes an engine harder to turn over for the starter and more difficult for a wire to pass current.
 
Originally Posted By: SuperDave456
I need options of where I go from here.

This is on a 2002 Ford Taurus with a 3.0 V6 SOHC Vulcan engine.


-Dave


The 3 liter Vulcan was pushrod, unless you're thinking of the 3 liter Duratec?
 
All I know is that the valve covers say V6 SOHC and it matches all the pictures of a Vulcan and takes all their parts too.

And as far as starters go I Googled "Starter Rebuild Shop" found a place near my house called "Richardson Generator" and traded my old starter in for a rebuilt one and $50.

The guy has a pretty nice shop and was pleasent to work with.
It seems to have fixed my problem.

Going out for a test drive now.

Sure beats having to pay over $100 for some of the rebuilds I see online.
 
If you have a DVOM, do a voltage drop test at the + terminal on the battery, and at the connection on the starter. Factory cables do have a tendancy to internally corrode at the batt terminals where the lead is crimped around the copper cable.
 
Well, I have learned a reason to change my oil filter every other oil change. My Starter is located directly underneath it. The guy at the generator shop said that these starters would last forever if it wasn't for that issue. They get loaded with crud and once that happens it's over.

Anyways it seems like the new starter does its job really well. Really quick starts now. It used to have to roll over once or twice before it got started. Where I can now bip the key in the ignition instead of holding it and the car will start. It's probably not good to do that, but you can tell that this rebuilt starter has a lot more power than my 11 year old core I exchanged.

Nope, no voltage meter. I would like to get one. Maybe for Christmas.
Right now I am going to stick with just the starter. I have pulled back the insulation to take a look at connectors and wiring and from what I have looked at it seems to be good. Due to the tests I have done with the new starter tonight I'm pretty sure that was the problem

If I have any more problems I will stop what I am doing and order new cables off of Rock Auto immediately.
This is my daily driver and although it has seen better days she's a Tank, I want to do my best at keeping her functional.

I might go ahead and order cables with my next paycheck. Don't know... probably a safe idea as those are 11 years old also.
 
I am not familiar with the orientation of your filter.

My last few oil changes I have taken an awl and poked it through the lowest part of the filter and let it drain for several minutes until it is just a drop every few seconds. I then slide my pan under my pan bolt, unscrew it, and let both drain and drip for anywhere from an hour to overnight.

As I don't overtorque my filter, and I got strong hands, grabbing the somewhat oily filter with a paper towel and unscrewing it is pretty simple, and when I get it off completely, no oil spills out.

The last time I did this, I spilled not a drop, well until putting the oil back into the bottles for recycling.
 
I loosen the oil filter till its about to leak then.
I slide a cut off 1.5liter pop bottle over the filter
Continue loosening and all the oil goes into the bottle.
Worked good on ranger 4.0 (would leak all over suspension)
and a duratech 3.0 in a taurus.

Not sure exactly where your filter is but as long as its not exactly horizontal it works good.


Edit: for larger filters like a fl-820s I use a 2liter.

I think the vulcan takes the fl-400s which a 1.5lt bottle works great.
 
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Originally Posted By: SuperDave456
All I know is that the valve covers say V6 SOHC and it matches all the pictures of a Vulcan and takes all their parts too.

And as far as starters go I Googled "Starter Rebuild Shop" found a place near my house called "Richardson Generator" and traded my old starter in for a rebuilt one and $50.

The guy has a pretty nice shop and was pleasent to work with.
It seems to have fixed my problem.

Going out for a test drive now.

Sure beats having to pay over $100 for some of the rebuilds I see online.


...and you give the money to a local business right around you.
 
Originally Posted By: Rand
I loosen the oil filter till its about to leak then.
I slide a cut off 1.5liter pop bottle over the filter
Continue loosening and all the oil goes into the bottle.
Worked good on ranger 4.0 (would leak all over suspension)
and a duratech 3.0 in a taurus.

Not sure exactly where your filter is but as long as its not exactly horizontal it works good.


Edit: for larger filters like a fl-820s I use a 2liter.

I think the vulcan takes the fl-400s which a 1.5lt bottle works great.

That's a darn good idea. I think I'll do that to the wife's car from now on...
 
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