2-cycle oil as a fuel add in 4-cycle engine
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I accidently put 5 oz. in my son's Saturn (300:1), I'll see what happens....
Originally Posted By: jhenle
I've recently started adding TCW3 to gas (2oz/10gal) and noticed the following. Almost immediately after I added it for the first time (later same day anyway) my car became significantly louder. Not engine noise, but exhaust noise. Like I had added one of those tailpipe resonators - which I hate BTW, I have a neighbor who uses one and drives around at 2AM, you get the idea. Haven't really noticed any other change. This is a '98 Jetta, using Maxlife 10W40. Only other additive I use was about 100cc of Lubri Moly MoS2 that I added at the last oil change, about 2 months ago. The muffler on the car is almost brand new - replaced at Midas 4 months ago.
I'm not sure how the TCW3 would make such exhaust noise, but the change was conspicuous and I don't believe in coincidences.
(edit) the TCW3 is Walmart's Super Tech FWIW
Originally Posted By: From The Skeptic's Dictionary site
post hoc fallacy
The post hoc ergo propter hoc (after this therefore because of this) fallacy is based upon the mistaken notion that simply because one thing happens after another, the first event was a cause of the second event. Post hoc reasoning is the basis for many superstitions and erroneous beliefs.
I'm having a tough time seeing what causal link could exist between the introduction of a relatively small amount of oil in the fuel and a major change in exhaust noise.
I've recently started adding TCW3 to gas (2oz/10gal) and noticed the following. Almost immediately after I added it for the first time (later same day anyway) my car became significantly louder. Not engine noise, but exhaust noise. Like I had added one of those tailpipe resonators - which I hate BTW, I have a neighbor who uses one and drives around at 2AM, you get the idea. Haven't really noticed any other change. This is a '98 Jetta, using Maxlife 10W40. Only other additive I use was about 100cc of Lubri Moly MoS2 that I added at the last oil change, about 2 months ago. The muffler on the car is almost brand new - replaced at Midas 4 months ago.
I'm not sure how the TCW3 would make such exhaust noise, but the change was conspicuous and I don't believe in coincidences.
(edit) the TCW3 is Walmart's Super Tech FWIW
Originally Posted By: From The Skeptic's Dictionary site
post hoc fallacy
The post hoc ergo propter hoc (after this therefore because of this) fallacy is based upon the mistaken notion that simply because one thing happens after another, the first event was a cause of the second event. Post hoc reasoning is the basis for many superstitions and erroneous beliefs.
I'm having a tough time seeing what causal link could exist between the introduction of a relatively small amount of oil in the fuel and a major change in exhaust noise.
2 stroke oil does indeed burn, and therefore produces power.
In some older applications, a richer 20/1 mixture produces more power than 50/1 mixes.
This is noted my some mfrs as a reason not to upgrade to 50/1 oils.
In any event, it is not simply blown out the exhaust - it burns.
In some older applications, a richer 20/1 mixture produces more power than 50/1 mixes.
This is noted my some mfrs as a reason not to upgrade to 50/1 oils.
In any event, it is not simply blown out the exhaust - it burns.
What is the stuff at the end of a 2 cycles exhaust pipe when rich oil ratios are used?
mechtech2 and Steve S: Pay attention....this thread is about 4-cycle engines.
Originally Posted By: drop
for a 1:500 mix, use 114ml.
114ml in what quantity of gasoline?
for a 1:500 mix, use 114ml.
114ml in what quantity of gasoline?
LOL, he was thinking 15 gallons but forgot to type it.
mechtech answers:
Concerning possible exhaust residue from an over oiled 2 stroke:
If you use a gasoline mixture that is too rich, you also get soot in the exhaust pipe.
Does that mean that gasoline doesn't burn?
Talk about faulty logic!
Concerning possible exhaust residue from an over oiled 2 stroke:
If you use a gasoline mixture that is too rich, you also get soot in the exhaust pipe.
Does that mean that gasoline doesn't burn?
Talk about faulty logic!
is there any difference and can both be used as an addictive to a 4 cycle engine.
Synthetic TCW3 vs regular
http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/28356-tc-w3-100-synthetic-2-cycle-outboard-oil-from-pennzoil.html
compared to lets say Supertech by wal mart
Synthetic TCW3 vs regular
http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/28356-tc-w3-100-synthetic-2-cycle-outboard-oil-from-pennzoil.html
compared to lets say Supertech by wal mart
Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Originally Posted By: jhenle
I've recently started adding TCW3 to gas (2oz/10gal) and noticed the following. Almost immediately after I added it for the first time (later same day anyway) my car became significantly louder. Not engine noise, but exhaust noise. Like I had added one of those tailpipe resonators - which I hate BTW, I have a neighbor who uses one and drives around at 2AM, you get the idea. Haven't really noticed any other change. This is a '98 Jetta, using Maxlife 10W40. Only other additive I use was about 100cc of Lubri Moly MoS2 that I added at the last oil change, about 2 months ago. The muffler on the car is almost brand new - replaced at Midas 4 months ago.
I'm not sure how the TCW3 would make such exhaust noise, but the change was conspicuous and I don't believe in coincidences.
(edit) the TCW3 is Walmart's Super Tech FWIW
Originally Posted By: From The Skeptic's Dictionary site
post hoc fallacy
The post hoc ergo propter hoc (after this therefore because of this) fallacy is based upon the mistaken notion that simply because one thing happens after another, the first event was a cause of the second event. Post hoc reasoning is the basis for many superstitions and erroneous beliefs.
I'm having a tough time seeing what causal link could exist between the introduction of a relatively small amount of oil in the fuel and a major change in exhaust noise.
When I had side pipes on my car, I could hear a difference in sound with the TC-W3 in the fuel. It seemed a bit louder, and deeper. It could be affecting the speed at which the fuel burns, which would likely change the exhaust sound.
Originally Posted By: jhenle
I've recently started adding TCW3 to gas (2oz/10gal) and noticed the following. Almost immediately after I added it for the first time (later same day anyway) my car became significantly louder. Not engine noise, but exhaust noise. Like I had added one of those tailpipe resonators - which I hate BTW, I have a neighbor who uses one and drives around at 2AM, you get the idea. Haven't really noticed any other change. This is a '98 Jetta, using Maxlife 10W40. Only other additive I use was about 100cc of Lubri Moly MoS2 that I added at the last oil change, about 2 months ago. The muffler on the car is almost brand new - replaced at Midas 4 months ago.
I'm not sure how the TCW3 would make such exhaust noise, but the change was conspicuous and I don't believe in coincidences.
(edit) the TCW3 is Walmart's Super Tech FWIW
Originally Posted By: From The Skeptic's Dictionary site
post hoc fallacy
The post hoc ergo propter hoc (after this therefore because of this) fallacy is based upon the mistaken notion that simply because one thing happens after another, the first event was a cause of the second event. Post hoc reasoning is the basis for many superstitions and erroneous beliefs.
I'm having a tough time seeing what causal link could exist between the introduction of a relatively small amount of oil in the fuel and a major change in exhaust noise.
When I had side pipes on my car, I could hear a difference in sound with the TC-W3 in the fuel. It seemed a bit louder, and deeper. It could be affecting the speed at which the fuel burns, which would likely change the exhaust sound.
Originally Posted By: goixiz
is there any difference and can both be used as an addictive to a 4 cycle engine.
Synthetic TCW3 vs regular
http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/28356-tc-w3-100-synthetic-2-cycle-outboard-oil-from-pennzoil.html
compared to lets say Supertech by wal mart
I've used the Pennzoil full synthetic (ester based) stuff in several vehicles, and it worked just as well as the petroleum based stuff. The ester based stuff should be more polar, helping it to grab onto the cylinder walls, and it should also help clean the fuel system.
is there any difference and can both be used as an addictive to a 4 cycle engine.
Synthetic TCW3 vs regular
http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/28356-tc-w3-100-synthetic-2-cycle-outboard-oil-from-pennzoil.html
compared to lets say Supertech by wal mart
I've used the Pennzoil full synthetic (ester based) stuff in several vehicles, and it worked just as well as the petroleum based stuff. The ester based stuff should be more polar, helping it to grab onto the cylinder walls, and it should also help clean the fuel system.
2 cycle oil with tcw3 only in ur gas tank on ur car , the mix is one ( 1 ) ounce to 5 gallons of gas period, no more , no less, Remember to get the 2 cycle oil with tcw3 so there will be no ash left and it burns clean, try it for a month. It will clean and lube ur injectors, throttle body , fuel pump etc.
All miles on 2C TCW-3
30k in the CRV
45k in the Accord
30k in the CRV
45k in the Accord
Reviving this old thread as I only came across this idea last night - yet there's so much good discussion here it shouldn't (IMHO) be buried as deeply as it was. I didn't read the entire thread, but read enough to be convinced of the value of tcw3 as a very inexpensive (500:1 ratio means using tiny quantities of it), easily attainable, and worthwhile fuel additive to try.
So I hit Walmart tonight and grabbed a half liter bottle of the Castrol brand. It was either that or Supertech, but for the small difference in price, the Castrol version won out because it stated clearly on the back of the bottom that it was ashless (the Supertech bottle said instead "low ash"). Also I liked the design of the Castrol bottle for this application: it has a see through stripe down the side, and its marked at every half ounce and 50 ml increment - which makes measuring the small amounts of this out simple.
I estimated, based on my known average mileage and trip meter since last fill, how much gas I'd burned since that fillup and therefore what remained in the tank. I rounded it to 24L, which at a 500:1 desired ratio, meant 48 ml of oil. I rounded that up to 50 and, using a funnel, poured 50 ml from the Castrol bottle into an old empty Prestone fuel injector bottle I still had in the trunk (for future reference, I will be keeping my next empty Regane 2x bottle as its perfect for this). I then emptied that into the tank and took the 'rolla for a short spin to get it sloshed up a bit.
The noticeable difference right away: at high rpm (just before the auto shifts), the engine has a deeper, throatier resonance. Its not unpleasant. A little surprising coming from a 1.8L 4 cylinder, but it doesn't sound "riced" or like the muffler is missing or defective.
No noticeable impact on acceleration or power, which is all good. This little 500 ml bottle should go a long way in my 50L gas tank, but when I run out I can obtain the same stuff for a little more than half the price in its 4L bottle size. If it delivers what those in threads say it does (and I'm inclined to believe them), its worth adding to every tank imho (at least until MMO is sold locally at as cheap a price per application).
-Spyder
So I hit Walmart tonight and grabbed a half liter bottle of the Castrol brand. It was either that or Supertech, but for the small difference in price, the Castrol version won out because it stated clearly on the back of the bottom that it was ashless (the Supertech bottle said instead "low ash"). Also I liked the design of the Castrol bottle for this application: it has a see through stripe down the side, and its marked at every half ounce and 50 ml increment - which makes measuring the small amounts of this out simple.
I estimated, based on my known average mileage and trip meter since last fill, how much gas I'd burned since that fillup and therefore what remained in the tank. I rounded it to 24L, which at a 500:1 desired ratio, meant 48 ml of oil. I rounded that up to 50 and, using a funnel, poured 50 ml from the Castrol bottle into an old empty Prestone fuel injector bottle I still had in the trunk (for future reference, I will be keeping my next empty Regane 2x bottle as its perfect for this). I then emptied that into the tank and took the 'rolla for a short spin to get it sloshed up a bit.
The noticeable difference right away: at high rpm (just before the auto shifts), the engine has a deeper, throatier resonance. Its not unpleasant. A little surprising coming from a 1.8L 4 cylinder, but it doesn't sound "riced" or like the muffler is missing or defective.
No noticeable impact on acceleration or power, which is all good. This little 500 ml bottle should go a long way in my 50L gas tank, but when I run out I can obtain the same stuff for a little more than half the price in its 4L bottle size. If it delivers what those in threads say it does (and I'm inclined to believe them), its worth adding to every tank imho (at least until MMO is sold locally at as cheap a price per application).
-Spyder
The initial addition should contain some extra product to coat the fuel system parts. I say use a double-dose.
W*M has the PZ Marine 2C semisyn for about $12 / gallon. It replaces a gallon of gas, so the real cost is more like $9. Comes out to about $.02c per gallon of fuel.
W*M has the PZ Marine 2C semisyn for about $12 / gallon. It replaces a gallon of gas, so the real cost is more like $9. Comes out to about $.02c per gallon of fuel.
No PZ Marine at the WM I hit, but the 4L Castrol jug was close to that price. Very cheap additive and I worked out the easiest way to add it to my small gas tank: keep a pre-filled 50 ml bottle in the glove box, and then just dump it in and pump 25L of gas. Gives me the 500:1 ratio every time and keeps it there.
I was sold on it already just as a cheap UCL, but if it delivers any engine cleaning at all, or helps reduce oil consumption (some in this thread say it does one, the other, or both), then that's an added bonus. Same for any mileage gains. Gas is almost $4 a gallon here, so even at 5 cents a gallon (and I'm paying more like 3 cents using the 4L Castrol bottle), its relative cost is almost nothing.
-Spyder
I was sold on it already just as a cheap UCL, but if it delivers any engine cleaning at all, or helps reduce oil consumption (some in this thread say it does one, the other, or both), then that's an added bonus. Same for any mileage gains. Gas is almost $4 a gallon here, so even at 5 cents a gallon (and I'm paying more like 3 cents using the 4L Castrol bottle), its relative cost is almost nothing.
-Spyder
TCW3 works well for many people. Keep us updated as to how it works for you.
Beyond the throatier engine noise at high revs, I briefly thought it was making my engine noisier at idle - then I realized it was the opposite, it was so quiet at idle that I was just noticing for the first time things that were lost in the white noise previously.
Its hard to quantify, but the engine also feels smoother - using less gas, or less adjustment, to coast along at city speeds of 50-60 km/h.
I've run it less than 150 km so far, so these are still initial impressions (almost all city). I also think I overestimated how much gas was in the tank during the initial dosing, so the ratio was probably closer to 400:1 than 500:1. Using the simple method I mentioned above, over a few tanks it should normalize to 500:1 in time, and stay there.
I've noticed no detrimental effects. Its cheap, widely available, easy to use, and my engine (which is prone to sticking rings due to a design defect), can very much benefit from a UCL.
I'll update again, after I've gotten a few dosed tanks in. But my initial experience is nothing but positive. Hats off to you guys for contributing so much good info to this thread - I was swayed to go out and get it before I even got to the end ( and then to bump it back to page 1).
-Spyder
Its hard to quantify, but the engine also feels smoother - using less gas, or less adjustment, to coast along at city speeds of 50-60 km/h.
I've run it less than 150 km so far, so these are still initial impressions (almost all city). I also think I overestimated how much gas was in the tank during the initial dosing, so the ratio was probably closer to 400:1 than 500:1. Using the simple method I mentioned above, over a few tanks it should normalize to 500:1 in time, and stay there.
I've noticed no detrimental effects. Its cheap, widely available, easy to use, and my engine (which is prone to sticking rings due to a design defect), can very much benefit from a UCL.
I'll update again, after I've gotten a few dosed tanks in. But my initial experience is nothing but positive. Hats off to you guys for contributing so much good info to this thread - I was swayed to go out and get it before I even got to the end ( and then to bump it back to page 1).
-Spyder
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