Ive said enough about MMO in previous posts.
MMO - I Almost Hate To Admit it...
- Thread starter mechtech2
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Originally Posted By: Spartanfool
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: TurboJim
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
Would you like to suggest how one can scientifically measure this observation? "Immediately the car idled better and seemed to have more pep."
Fuel mileage tests, fuel usage while idling tests, before and after pics, compression readings, fleet statistical analysis, double-blind comparative test to a base, anything that is quantifiably measured would be a start.
I'd love to switch to MMO. It is a LOT cheaper than Auto-RX. But, I have done actual measurements that proved Auto-RX works. I have a 96 cavalier whose compression readings improved by over 20% and gas mileage improved by 10% after starting usage. There are tons of other quantified experiments out there with Auto-RX. All I read about MMO is "i slept better because it sounded better."
I'll add what I observed. I did two ARX cleaning treatments on my son's 2001 Alero V-6 with 142K. Followed by a maintenance cycle on the third bottle. ARX brought the compression up on two low cylinders from 120/130 to 150. But it did nothing to the golden varnish visible thru the oil filler cap. After the maintenance doses were complete, I ran one quart MMO on each oil change since then. Several oil & MMO changes later, the area under the cap is almost spotless. Silver metal with no golden varnish tint. ARX clearly helped the compression, but did nothing for the varnish. The MMO did. Two different products, two different results. Am I disappointed in either....no....but I am impressed with the value MMO provided for the price. Would MMO have restored my compression? I don't know...but at its price point I would have liked to find out. Don't dismiss MMO out of hand. The more I use it, the more I like it.
A one two punch, why not? I'm glad it worked. IMO varnish is hard to get rid of, we'll never know in your case if MMO would have raised the compression, my bet is it probably would have.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: TurboJim
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
Would you like to suggest how one can scientifically measure this observation? "Immediately the car idled better and seemed to have more pep."
Fuel mileage tests, fuel usage while idling tests, before and after pics, compression readings, fleet statistical analysis, double-blind comparative test to a base, anything that is quantifiably measured would be a start.
I'd love to switch to MMO. It is a LOT cheaper than Auto-RX. But, I have done actual measurements that proved Auto-RX works. I have a 96 cavalier whose compression readings improved by over 20% and gas mileage improved by 10% after starting usage. There are tons of other quantified experiments out there with Auto-RX. All I read about MMO is "i slept better because it sounded better."
I'll add what I observed. I did two ARX cleaning treatments on my son's 2001 Alero V-6 with 142K. Followed by a maintenance cycle on the third bottle. ARX brought the compression up on two low cylinders from 120/130 to 150. But it did nothing to the golden varnish visible thru the oil filler cap. After the maintenance doses were complete, I ran one quart MMO on each oil change since then. Several oil & MMO changes later, the area under the cap is almost spotless. Silver metal with no golden varnish tint. ARX clearly helped the compression, but did nothing for the varnish. The MMO did. Two different products, two different results. Am I disappointed in either....no....but I am impressed with the value MMO provided for the price. Would MMO have restored my compression? I don't know...but at its price point I would have liked to find out. Don't dismiss MMO out of hand. The more I use it, the more I like it.
A one two punch, why not? I'm glad it worked. IMO varnish is hard to get rid of, we'll never know in your case if MMO would have raised the compression, my bet is it probably would have.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
I would suggest if someone were to use MMO or any oil additive that it would be a good idea if possible to remove your valve cover before using a product to get an idea of how things look in the valvetrain and then do a few OCI's with the oil additive.
It would also be a good idea to spend sometime going through this oil additive section and checking out various threads to gain as much information as possible.
MMO has been around since 1923, that should show that the product does something. If it did nothing then it would not be here in 2009.
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
I would suggest if someone were to use MMO or any oil additive that it would be a good idea if possible to remove your valve cover before using a product to get an idea of how things look in the valvetrain and then do a few OCI's with the oil additive.
It would also be a good idea to spend sometime going through this oil additive section and checking out various threads to gain as much information as possible.
MMO has been around since 1923, that should show that the product does something. If it did nothing then it would not be here in 2009.
I have been using MMO in the wifes KIA Sorento for a couple months now. It was developing a nasty rattle at start up. I have always used good oils in it and recently went with PP and a 4 ounce dose of MMO. I drained out Motorcraft semi sen. and 8 ounces of MMO. The rattle has toned down quite a bit and when I started it yesterday morning I didnt hear it at all, and it was about 45*. The rattle could be heard even on warmer mornings.
I always change the filter out at 2000 miles and this time I will replace the MMO when I top off the ctankcase.
I always change the filter out at 2000 miles and this time I will replace the MMO when I top off the ctankcase.
Guys, I am not a fan of oil additives.
Maybe an STP like substance for an oil burner.
When I say my engine idled smoother right away with the MMO in the crankcase, I meant it - no doubt. I know my car.
My threshold of realization is trained over the years to be better than normal for automotive sensory inputs, and I also feel more light throttle snap.
My original post was to show my surprise, not make an inflated boast of MMO.
BTW, I like MMO in the gas tank also!
Maybe an STP like substance for an oil burner.
When I say my engine idled smoother right away with the MMO in the crankcase, I meant it - no doubt. I know my car.
My threshold of realization is trained over the years to be better than normal for automotive sensory inputs, and I also feel more light throttle snap.
My original post was to show my surprise, not make an inflated boast of MMO.
BTW, I like MMO in the gas tank also!
Originally Posted By: Vikas
mechtech2,
I value your input lot more than some of the others.
- Vikas
So do I, and it is this kind of testimony that gets me looking into different products. An honest mans assessment of something he tried, no tests, no charts, no graphs, no fake reports, no [censored]. In my book this is what sells a product, a long standing respected Bitog member. BTW this goes for any product for a car. It can be; oil, an additive, wax, tires, shocks, brakes, anything!
mechtech2,
I value your input lot more than some of the others.
- Vikas
So do I, and it is this kind of testimony that gets me looking into different products. An honest mans assessment of something he tried, no tests, no charts, no graphs, no fake reports, no [censored]. In my book this is what sells a product, a long standing respected Bitog member. BTW this goes for any product for a car. It can be; oil, an additive, wax, tires, shocks, brakes, anything!
I'm using it in the gas tank until my next OCI.
Nothing to report just yet, its my first week.
Nothing to report just yet, its my first week.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: KW
It's funny that only a couple of years ago I read a lot of "I would never add MMO to my oil". Now it's very popular as it should be. I have used the stuff on and off for 30 years or so with great success. I even keep some in a spray bottle in the shop to keep engine parts from rusting.
Success compared to what? The cars you didn't use it in blew up and died and early death? How do you quantify this success? It made you sleep better? What was the alternative?
Stops ticking hydraulic lifters, washes goo out of old engines, works as a soak for stuck pistons in old motors, keeps freshly machined parts from rusting. I also use it for cooling oil in my drill press.
I do sleep very well at night. For $100,000 I'll plot a graph for you, yet that would still be my word against yours.
How about providing me proof that it does not work?
Originally Posted By: KW
It's funny that only a couple of years ago I read a lot of "I would never add MMO to my oil". Now it's very popular as it should be. I have used the stuff on and off for 30 years or so with great success. I even keep some in a spray bottle in the shop to keep engine parts from rusting.
Success compared to what? The cars you didn't use it in blew up and died and early death? How do you quantify this success? It made you sleep better? What was the alternative?
Stops ticking hydraulic lifters, washes goo out of old engines, works as a soak for stuck pistons in old motors, keeps freshly machined parts from rusting. I also use it for cooling oil in my drill press.
I do sleep very well at night. For $100,000 I'll plot a graph for you, yet that would still be my word against yours.
How about providing me proof that it does not work?
I ran a quart of mmo for 800 miles on a new filter. When I cut the filter open there was alot of very hard carbon.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: TurboJim
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
Would you like to suggest how one can scientifically measure this observation? "Immediately the car idled better and seemed to have more pep."
Fuel mileage tests, fuel usage while idling tests, before and after pics, compression readings, fleet statistical analysis, double-blind comparative test to a base, anything that is quantifiably measured would be a start.
I'd love to switch to MMO. It is a LOT cheaper than Auto-RX. But, I have done actual measurements that proved Auto-RX works. I have a 96 cavalier whose compression readings improved by over 20% and gas mileage improved by 10% after starting usage. There are tons of other quantified experiments out there with Auto-RX. All I read about MMO is "i slept better because it sounded better."
badtlc, this is obviously an MMO Thread and it is obvious that you have never used MMO. If you want to knock MMO at least use the product.
I can give members here my observations on MMO since I have used it, when I was pro ARX and I was called an ARX Robot and a ARX Cheerleader I never jumped into any MMO threads because at that time I had not used the product.
I had some dialogue via PM with a member here and he was upset about members jumping into an ARX Thread and causing trouble, and now we have someone who is pro ARX jumping into this MMO Thread. When I was Pro ARX the worst thing I wrote about MMO in a post was that it was old school.
I jumped on a member here for recommending Berryman's B-12, I called it every name in the book, I was called a troll, the member who called me a troll was right, because I had never used Berryman's B-12, if I have never used B-12 then I had absolutely no business posting about it. You are doing the exact same thing here, trolling.
Originally Posted By: TurboJim
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I'm still hoping to see some quantifiable measurements in some form or fashion that show MMO does something/anything. Please let us know if you can provide any.
Would you like to suggest how one can scientifically measure this observation? "Immediately the car idled better and seemed to have more pep."
Fuel mileage tests, fuel usage while idling tests, before and after pics, compression readings, fleet statistical analysis, double-blind comparative test to a base, anything that is quantifiably measured would be a start.
I'd love to switch to MMO. It is a LOT cheaper than Auto-RX. But, I have done actual measurements that proved Auto-RX works. I have a 96 cavalier whose compression readings improved by over 20% and gas mileage improved by 10% after starting usage. There are tons of other quantified experiments out there with Auto-RX. All I read about MMO is "i slept better because it sounded better."
badtlc, this is obviously an MMO Thread and it is obvious that you have never used MMO. If you want to knock MMO at least use the product.
I can give members here my observations on MMO since I have used it, when I was pro ARX and I was called an ARX Robot and a ARX Cheerleader I never jumped into any MMO threads because at that time I had not used the product.
I had some dialogue via PM with a member here and he was upset about members jumping into an ARX Thread and causing trouble, and now we have someone who is pro ARX jumping into this MMO Thread. When I was Pro ARX the worst thing I wrote about MMO in a post was that it was old school.
I jumped on a member here for recommending Berryman's B-12, I called it every name in the book, I was called a troll, the member who called me a troll was right, because I had never used Berryman's B-12, if I have never used B-12 then I had absolutely no business posting about it. You are doing the exact same thing here, trolling.
How about we all use ARX and MMO at the same time and call it good?
Originally Posted By: FastSUV
I recently did 16oz in my 5qt sump...I was scared to use something that thin with solvents in it in a higher volume like 32oz??? Did I do wrong?
I wanted to "ease" into it!
No you didn't do wrong, just less cleaning and slower cleaning. I've used that amount many times over the years. Usually during the winter I'll use a full quart, it aids in cold starts and does some nice cleaning. Either way you'll be fine.
I recently did 16oz in my 5qt sump...I was scared to use something that thin with solvents in it in a higher volume like 32oz??? Did I do wrong?
I wanted to "ease" into it!
No you didn't do wrong, just less cleaning and slower cleaning. I've used that amount many times over the years. Usually during the winter I'll use a full quart, it aids in cold starts and does some nice cleaning. Either way you'll be fine.
Originally Posted By: Hethaerto
How about we all use ARX and MMO at the same time and call it good?
People are doing that too, and calling it good. For me it's about getting the job done. I've used both products, but not together. From reading here people have done it with good results, and no problems.
How about we all use ARX and MMO at the same time and call it good?
People are doing that too, and calling it good. For me it's about getting the job done. I've used both products, but not together. From reading here people have done it with good results, and no problems.
What gas additives have I used? Fuel power, Lucas UCL, 2 stroke oil, and MMO.
Fuel power and Lucas may indeed lube things, but with no perceptible feel difference.
The TCW3 2 stroke oil works well, but is not really a cleaner.
So MMO gets the nod. Cleaning, lubrication, and feel [mostly idle quality].
Gas mileage? tough to tell, because I haven't run straight fuel in a long time. But not much difference. MMO would come out on top by general feel -at least there was never a hit downwards.
Oil additives? Ha! In years past U-Name-It.
Really.
But I have come to use only engine oil now, because they are so good nowadays. And like I said, maybe some thick stuff like STP for someone's oil burner.
I know MMO cleans, but have not personally used it in oil for a long time - decades. Except for the unseen ring area, none of my engines have needed any cleaning otherwise - no sludge or lifter ticks.
Since I had it in my hand, and winter is here, I decided to give it a 1/2 shot [16ounces]in the crankcase.
Maybe it is causing less friction, or being simply thinner caused my fast results.
It is worth it so peruse the actual MMO website:
http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/
Not to hijack my own thread, but I have interest in LubroMoly.
I have mixed feelings. Almost assuredly less friction, but at what cost? What are the downsides? So not yet.
Fuel power and Lucas may indeed lube things, but with no perceptible feel difference.
The TCW3 2 stroke oil works well, but is not really a cleaner.
So MMO gets the nod. Cleaning, lubrication, and feel [mostly idle quality].
Gas mileage? tough to tell, because I haven't run straight fuel in a long time. But not much difference. MMO would come out on top by general feel -at least there was never a hit downwards.
Oil additives? Ha! In years past U-Name-It.
Really.
But I have come to use only engine oil now, because they are so good nowadays. And like I said, maybe some thick stuff like STP for someone's oil burner.
I know MMO cleans, but have not personally used it in oil for a long time - decades. Except for the unseen ring area, none of my engines have needed any cleaning otherwise - no sludge or lifter ticks.
Since I had it in my hand, and winter is here, I decided to give it a 1/2 shot [16ounces]in the crankcase.
Maybe it is causing less friction, or being simply thinner caused my fast results.
It is worth it so peruse the actual MMO website:
http://www.marvelmysteryoil.com/
Not to hijack my own thread, but I have interest in LubroMoly.
I have mixed feelings. Almost assuredly less friction, but at what cost? What are the downsides? So not yet.
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Cool report thanks! I've spoken to Mr. Kelly over at MMO and 16 oz in a 5 qt sump [just for example] doesn't really take the oil to far out of grade. I know from my own use that it does help with cold starting. While the oil is coming up to temp, in that so called 20 minutes where all the wear occurs, "I believe" that it helps reduce wear while the oil is coming up to temp. A friend of mine from here and I had this conversation, two car buffs talking and that is what we think.
Originally Posted By: Spartanfool
.....Would MMO have restored my compression? I don't know...but at its price point I would have liked to find out. Don't dismiss MMO out of hand. The more I use it, the more I like it.
I wouldn't dismiss it, hence my asking. I do not care for spending so much on Auto-RX but I know it works. I really don't care about varnish so if that is MMO's biggest attribute then I guess I'm not all that interested. I'm looking for something that can maintain ring cleanliness and compression levels.
Thanks.
.....Would MMO have restored my compression? I don't know...but at its price point I would have liked to find out. Don't dismiss MMO out of hand. The more I use it, the more I like it.
I wouldn't dismiss it, hence my asking. I do not care for spending so much on Auto-RX but I know it works. I really don't care about varnish so if that is MMO's biggest attribute then I guess I'm not all that interested. I'm looking for something that can maintain ring cleanliness and compression levels.
Thanks.
Originally Posted By: c3po
I would suggest if someone were to use MMO or any oil additive that it would be a good idea if possible to remove your valve cover before using a product to get an idea of how things look in the valvetrain and then do a few OCI's with the oil additive.
It would also be a good idea to spend sometime going through this oil additive section and checking out various threads to gain as much information as possible.
MMO has been around since 1923, that should show that the product does something. If it did nothing then it would not be here in 2009.
I have read hundreds of threads on MMO. All are pretty much the same. The time the product has been around means nothing. Mass consensus is a fallacy and doesn't provide any meaning. Everyone once believed with the heart and brain the world was flat. That didn't make it true.
I would suggest if someone were to use MMO or any oil additive that it would be a good idea if possible to remove your valve cover before using a product to get an idea of how things look in the valvetrain and then do a few OCI's with the oil additive.
It would also be a good idea to spend sometime going through this oil additive section and checking out various threads to gain as much information as possible.
MMO has been around since 1923, that should show that the product does something. If it did nothing then it would not be here in 2009.
I have read hundreds of threads on MMO. All are pretty much the same. The time the product has been around means nothing. Mass consensus is a fallacy and doesn't provide any meaning. Everyone once believed with the heart and brain the world was flat. That didn't make it true.
Originally Posted By: c3po
I jumped on a member here for recommending Berryman's B-12, I called it every name in the book, I was called a troll, the member who called me a troll was right, because I had never used Berryman's B-12, if I have never used B-12 then I had absolutely no business posting about it. You are doing the exact same thing here, trolling.
You find one place or quote where I have bashed MMO. I have an open mind toward the product because everyone says it works. That isn't enough, though. I'm here asking if anyone has anything other than gut feelings to back up their claims.
I waited 2.5 years before trying ARX because I wanted measured results. After enough, I gave it a go.
You can call me a troll if you wish but that just makes you look insecure. Questioning a product is not the same as bashing/trolling. If I were a troll I'd be here telling people their engine will blow up if they use MMO.
Your personal attack/name calling is what should be banned on this forum but feel free to continue.
I jumped on a member here for recommending Berryman's B-12, I called it every name in the book, I was called a troll, the member who called me a troll was right, because I had never used Berryman's B-12, if I have never used B-12 then I had absolutely no business posting about it. You are doing the exact same thing here, trolling.
You find one place or quote where I have bashed MMO. I have an open mind toward the product because everyone says it works. That isn't enough, though. I'm here asking if anyone has anything other than gut feelings to back up their claims.
I waited 2.5 years before trying ARX because I wanted measured results. After enough, I gave it a go.
You can call me a troll if you wish but that just makes you look insecure. Questioning a product is not the same as bashing/trolling. If I were a troll I'd be here telling people their engine will blow up if they use MMO.
Your personal attack/name calling is what should be banned on this forum but feel free to continue.
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