Mobil 1 5W-20, Where's the PDS?

[Blue99]

What actually is the Chrysler 6395 specification & is the current version M?

Since the majority of 5W-20 Grp II/III syn blends are listing both Ford WSS-MC930A and Chrysler 6395, the possibility that M1 5W-20, at the top of the "performance heap" being unable to meet this spec, is in the area of slim to none.

 

[gregk001]

I am not sure what the MS-6395 current version is or what it specifies. The 2005 Grand Caravan 3.8L owners manual calls out 5W-20 (specifically that viscosity) with both MS-6395 and API Certification. It is the MS-6395 rating that is hard to find (in writing) for the 5W-20 but it does occasionally show up for heavier viscosity oils.

I am concerned that the MS-6395 spec has some rigorous requirements that are tougher than the Ford and Honda specs. Read the following TSB that I found on the web. It matches up with my owners manual and really stresses the importance of the MS-6395 requirements.

Jeep TSB
09-013-04 GASOLINE ENGINE OIL QUALITY AND VISCOSITY GRADES
Date: 08/06/04

Model year(s): 2005

Description: NOTE: This information applies to U.S. and Canada markets only. This bulletin involves the engine oil to be used to service Chrysler Group gasoline engines. This symbol, found on the front of the container, means that the oil quality has been certified by the American Petroleum Institute.

Details: Only use API Certified engine oils that meet the requirements of Chrysler's Material Standard MS-6395. MS-6395 contains requirements, not addressed by API Certification, that provide additional protection for Chrysler Group engines. All Chrysler Group gasoline engines, irrespective of model year, should be serviced with API Certified engine oils meeting MS-6395. Chrysler Group Engines are developed, certified and filled with engine oil of the designated viscosity grade, meeting MS-6395, and should be serviced with the correct viscosity grade engine oil.

The following table contains the correct viscosity grades for the 2005 model year.

3.7L 5W40
4.7L 5W40
5.7L 5W20

 

[tenderloin]

Pennzoil lists their Platinum "synthetic" oil as MS-6395 approved

http://www.pzlqs.com/Tech/Pdsheet/DomesticMarketing/EngineOils/Pdf/PlatinumFullSyntheticMotorOil.pdf

 

[Roger]

Valvoline DuraBlend meets the Chryler spec too, but not many others mention it.

 

[Jay]

It has been frustrating waiting for the PDS. In Feb, Mobil 1 told me the PDS would be released at the end of the month. In March, they said the same thing. In April, they said the same thing again.

I've been interested because we were trying to settle the argument over whether the new 5w-20 is really a 0w-20. I think it still is a 0w-20. The new 5w-20 MSDS lists the same viscosity at 40C and 100C as the old 0w-20, so it has the same VI. That's not proof positive that the 5w-20 is a 0w-20, but it's pretty strong evidence that it is.

 

[Gary Allan]

So, Jay, are you suggesting that this is just a rebadge for the sake of market acceptance??

 

[Roger]

Yeah, Mobil's PDS situation is goofy right now. They show the GF4/SM version of M1 10W30, but the 5W30 PDS is still GF3/SL. I couldn't find the PDS for either 0W or 5W20. And the PDS numbers for their EP line look like a difference without distinction to the M1 line.

 

[buster]

I was told they are tied up in the leagal department. Why I do not know...makes me wonder.

 

[Cicero]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jay:
It has been frustrating waiting for the PDS. In Feb, Mobil 1 told me the PDS would be released at the end of the month. In March, they said the same thing. In April, they said the same thing again.

I've been interested because we were trying to settle the argument over whether the new 5w-20 is really a 0w-20. I think it still is a 0w-20. The new 5w-20 MSDS lists the same viscosity at 40C and 100C as the old 0w-20, so it has the same VI. That's not proof positive that the 5w-20 is a 0w-20, but it's pretty strong evidence that it is.

---

Mobil told me the same things last month and this month. I have a UOA coming (When?) from Blackstone (mailed 4/22) on a 4,250 mile run of Mobil 1 5W20. Maybe that will give some new information.

(BTW, I'll share my pain...I hope I didn't contaminate that sample much...I dropped the filled sample bottle in the waste oil catch pan...very slight oil film from the last change was probably in it. Mobile DC 5W30. I "rationalized" it probably didn't ruin the sample and sent it in anyway; Probably a bad idea. I don't know for sure. It's OK. I'm a Doctor.)

 

[gregk001]

All they have on-line is the MSDS for M1 5W-20. The web page for M1 5W-20 says "Specifically designed for Ford, Honda and 2005 Chryslers where an SAE 5W-20 is recommended." but it would be nice to see (in writing) if they meet Chrysler's MS-6395 specification. My 2005 Dodge Caravan manual says it has to meet that spec. I did call Mobil but they could only say that its taking awhile.

 

[gregk001]

Just to explain why I think there is something fishy. Mobil does have an MSDS for MOPAR MAX PRO 5W-20 (they package some MOPAR oils) and it is identical to the MSDS for "MOBIL CLEAN 5W-20". There are no PDSs for the MOPAR oils but the PDS for the MOBIL CLEAN 5W-20 lists Chrysler MS-6395 builder approval. What confuses me is the fact that the PDSs for Mobil Clean 5000 and Mobil Clean 7500 DO NOT list the Chrysler MS-6395 spec or approval. In fact, MOBIL CLEAN 5W-20 is the only Mobil 5W-20 oil that lists the Chrysler spec. So I got Chrysler telling me that "MS-6395 contains requirements, not addressed by API Certification". I got Mobil telling me (on the phone) that "M1 5W-20 meets the MS-6395 spec" but they seem to be intentionally avoiding putting it in writing in the PDSs. And most importantly, why do they not list the Chrysler spec for the Mobil Clean 5000 and Mobil Clean 7500?