What is so special about Honda DW-1 fluid?

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: sayjac
But I don't buy into the princess', use only Honda parts and fluids always as espoused on Honda specific forum(s) either. And why I take what's said in those with a grain of salt. My .02

For critical and rarely failed parts such as clutch master & slave cylinders, clutch plate ... OEM parts are better than aftermarket, and since labor cost is very high in replacing those parts, try to save few dollars with aftermarket parts doesn't make sense.

 

[Sayjac]

^^^^No doubt there are some parts used with labor intensive situations where OEM parts are preferable, including those mentioned. However, the princess' and "always" was more to the point of 'never' looking for aftermarket fluids or parts with solid aftermarket reputations.

Two examples I can think of with the Civic. Recent timing belt service, had I done it myself, I did the research and would have purchased Aisin water pump, Gates tensioner and timing belt and Gates or Bando drive belts. Turns out the Honda belt is Gates and drive belts used are Bando. And it would have been at significant savings from OEM.

Also used a BWD/Intermotor camshaft position/TDC sensor replacing the bad/worn oem in a diy job. Working like a champ.

So really what I was referring to was me not buying into the dogma preached in some forums that oem is always the only thing that should be used.

 

[Jake777]

I noticed when looking around here lots of people say they have used Maxlife in honda applications and have been really happy. I have a 2005 Odyssey with 120k miles on it and was thinking of doing the 3x drain and fill with maxillae. Can anyone sound off as to how many miles they are running so far after switching to Maxlife?

 

[ltslimjim]

Meh, I'm going to use Amsoil's Fuel Efficient ATF soon for my '07 Fit. Who thinks I'm making a downgrade?

 

[Trav]

I have been using Amsoil ATF (not the ATL) in Honda transmissions for years without issue.
I just did one that has had it in there for 100K and its still red and looks good. The PS fluid i use only the Honda stuff, they are finicky and pump failures are common enough but like VW seem much more common when non OEM fluid is used.

Just my observations.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: sayjac
^^^^No doubt there are some parts used with labor intensive situations where OEM parts are preferable, including those mentioned. However, the princess' and "always" was more to the point of 'never' looking for aftermarket fluids or parts with solid aftermarket reputations.

Two examples I can think of with the Civic. Recent timing belt service, had I done it myself, I did the research and would have purchased Aisin water pump, Gates tensioner and timing belt and Gates or Bando drive belts. Turns out the Honda belt is Gates and drive belts used are Bando. And it would have been at significant savings from OEM.

Also used a BWD/Intermotor camshaft position/TDC sensor replacing the bad/worn oem in a diy job. Working like a champ.

So really what I was referring to was me not buying into the dogma preached in some forums that oem is always the only thing that should be used.

I agree.

Some critical parts with labor intensive are better with OEM, some other parts can be aftermarket.

Honda recommends OEM brake fluid but I use Preston DOT-3 brake fluid in my S2000 brake and clutch for more than 6-7 years without problem.

But there are parts that OEM is much better quality and lasted a long time such as air filter. My S2000 original air filter is still in good condition after 55k miles(I have pantyhose pre-filter), when I need to change it I will buy OEM filter for better quality. To me, $10-15 extra for OEM air filter that I change only 60-70k miles is worth it.

I bought some PCX-004 oil filters for my S2000 some years ago for $5-6/ea since it was the best oil filter for S2000. But I now have some Fram Ultra XG3593A filters because I think it is better than PCX-004.

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: Trav
I have been using Amsoil ATF (not the ATL) in Honda transmissions for years without issue.
I just did one that has had it in there for 100K and its still red and looks good. The PS fluid i use only the Honda stuff, they are finicky and pump failures are common enough but like VW seem much more common when non OEM fluid is used.

Just my observations.


I'm hoping the ATL will perform well as a DW1 replacement in my Fit. Going to be installing by the end of summer hopefully.

I wonder if Red Line's D6 could be a better match or better ATF than Amsoil's ATL?

Amsoil's has a lower VI and pour point, but also a lower viscosity on the other hand. Both seem shear stable. D6 being slightly more heavy of a fluid.

 

[2civics]

Originally Posted By: Quakish
Originally Posted By: 2civics


DW1 is not synthetic in the U.S....that's it.


how do you know this? please share, thanks


Other than talking to a service tech. from my Honda Service Department, and having it not be labled as synthetic in any manner.... just common knowledge among several civic and general Honda forums I happen to belong to. (8th Gen Civic and Honda's Civic forum) Notice you were the only one to challenge me on it. Again, common knowledge......I'm no genius.

 

[2civics]

Canada has a version of DW1 that is synthetic and not recommended, from what I understand, for USA Hondas. Why? No idea. That is where the confusion comes in.

 

[Quakish]

Originally Posted By: 2civics
Originally Posted By: Quakish
Originally Posted By: 2civics


DW1 is not synthetic in the U.S....that's it.


how do you know this? please share, thanks


Other than talking to a service tech. from my Honda Service Department, and having it not be labled as synthetic in any manner.... just common knowledge among several civic and general Honda forums I happen to belong to. (8th Gen Civic and Honda's Civic forum) Notice you were the only one to challenge me on it. Again, common knowledge......I'm no genius.

not that i really care but it just seems this DW-1 is different in USA and Canada has never been proven, at least not that i've seen, but everyone talks about it so it must be fact. I called Idemitsu and asked and they told me it was the same fluid from the same factory. But they didn't give that to me in writing so who knows? Anyway, I guess until we see a virgin oil analysis of Canada DW-1 and US DW-1 no one will ever know the truth.

 

[ltslimjim]

I needed to correct my previous post. Amsoil's ATL vs Red Line's D6 ATF (as high-end DW-1 replacements):

The Red Line D6 has a better (lower) pour point than the ATL and also has a higher VI / virgin viscosity. Both are probably very shear stable.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Originally Posted By: Quakish
Anyway, I guess until we see a virgin oil analysis of Canada DW-1 and US DW-1 no one will ever know the truth.


If you're interested enough in it, I have a number of oil analysis kits that I haven't used yet. If you send me a quart of Canadian DW-1, I will do a UOA on both versions and post here. PM me if you are interested.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: 2civics
Canada has a version of DW1 that is synthetic and not recommended, from what I understand, for USA Hondas. Why? No idea. That is where the confusion comes in.

Regardless of whether the Canadian version is the same or different than the US stuff, I still want to see where the Canadian one isn't "recommended" for the US.

From what you understand of course....

 

[2civics]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2civics
Canada has a version of DW1 that is synthetic and not recommended, from what I understand, for USA Hondas. Why? No idea. That is where the confusion comes in.

Regardless of whether the Canadian version is the same or different than the US stuff, I still want to see where the Canadian one isn't "recommended" for the US.

From what you understand of course....



Well as I stated, it is just my understanding from being a dedicated Honda/ Civic forum rat. Could be false information propagated in the forums until it becomes accepted as truth. Again, I don't know for sure, thus the statement "from my understanding". I don't bare a burden of proof of something I admittedly don't know for sure myself.

 

[2civics]

Originally Posted By: Quakish
Originally Posted By: 2civics
Originally Posted By: Quakish
Originally Posted By: 2civics


DW1 is not synthetic in the U.S....that's it.


how do you know this? please share, thanks


Other than talking to a service tech. from my Honda Service Department, and having it not be labled as synthetic in any manner.... just common knowledge among several civic and general Honda forums I happen to belong to. (8th Gen Civic and Honda's Civic forum) Notice you were the only one to challenge me on it. Again, common knowledge......I'm no genius.

not that i really care but it just seems this DW-1 is different in USA and Canada has never been proven, at least not that i've seen, but everyone talks about it so it must be fact. I called Idemitsu and asked and they told me it was the same fluid from the same factory. But they didn't give that to me in writing so who knows? Anyway, I guess until we see a virgin oil analysis of Canada DW-1 and US DW-1 no one will ever know the truth.


I can certainly agree that there is no common sense to it if they are two different fluids and if they are, why the Canadian version wouldn't be recommended in the U.S. I agree that it gets talked about a lot and had led me to my conclusions over the past year. Not everything on forums is to be taken as golden. To have called the company and received that answer is the best evidence I have heard yet to the contrary.

 

[Quakish]

Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: Quakish
Anyway, I guess until we see a virgin oil analysis of Canada DW-1 and US DW-1 no one will ever know the truth.


If you're interested enough in it, I have a number of oil analysis kits that I haven't used yet. If you send me a quart of Canadian DW-1, I will do a UOA on both versions and post here. PM me if you are interested.


PM sent

 

[GiveMeAVowel]

There was a picture of both Canadian version and US version, the Canadian version clearly stated "synthetic" on the container, while the US version had no mention of that on the bottle.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel
There was a picture of both Canadian version and US version, the Canadian version clearly stated "synthetic" on the container, while the US version had no mention of that on the bottle.


Well that would certainly explain why it wasn't recommended

 

[PandaBear]

DW1 seems to have around 280 ppm of Zinc, that's a lot more than the in other ATF (i.e. 0 in T-IV and Castrol IMV)

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2583957

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3186907/2003_Lexus_GS430,_15,607_miles#Post3186907

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...hic#Post1665557

Honda can probably tolerate or even like zinc because of its design, and likely want to use it for some reason. I'd not use Honda ATF in another brand but if ATF blender found a way to do without zinc and still get great result, I think that's fine too.